2 die in M1 wrong way crash

[flango]

An 87 year old and 27 year old died today in a fatal crash on the M1 involving a car travelling the wrong way down the carriageway.

Two lives destroyed for no reason or lack of regulation? Discuss.

Two dead in 'wrong-way' crash on East Midlands M1 - BBC News

 

[AMGeed]

Without knowing any more details I'd take a guess the 87 yr old took a wrong turning through poor eyesight or confusion and the 27yr old paid with his life.

Tragic and possibly 2 yearly checks after the age of 70 to see if drivers are still competent to drive and pass all criteria.

 

[brucemillar]

Tragic. I think we should await the facts before responding.

 

[grober]

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/359311/rrcgb-2013.pdf
Last available figures 2013 report PAGE 86

 

[BIG UN]

I was supposed to be travelling down the M1 this morning at 7 this morning but everywhere was gridlocked. My short 30 minute journey ended up taking 2 & a half hours. As I came home tonight up the M1 around 7pm it was still shut but they were resurfacing two lanes. According to what I've heard the motorway between junctions 25 & 24 will have been shut for 17hrs due to this horrific incident.

If im not posting, then im retro fitting!! MBClub UK

 

[TheFoX]

Absolutely no meat to the story on the BBC website. Was the 87 year old driving the wrong way, or was the van driver being 'White Van Man' and using his size to intimidate others?

Surely someone must have been able to state what was happening, and surely the BBC could have given us a little more than conjecture.

 

[zipdip]

There is no doubt the 87 year old was driving the wrong way,we have a complete disregard for tackling this problem of aged drivers,your driving license ends when you are 70,and what happens,well you get a letter from DVLC asking do you wish to continue driving and are you fit and able ,answer yes to this and you are free to drive,the police only have the eyesight test to remove older drivers license,we need a medical and eyesight test,at 70,and then every 3 years after that,then at 80 drivers should have a small driving test just a examiner coming around and the older driver going around their local roads,just to see if they are aware of whats going on and what they do,this would have the effect of reducing older drivers insurance and give peace of mind to other road users.

 

[wywywywy]

Absolutely no meat to the story on the BBC website. Was the 87 year old driving the wrong way, or was the van driver being 'White Van Man' and using his size to intimidate others?

Surely someone must have been able to state what was happening, and surely the BBC could have given us a little more than conjecture.

The way I read it, is there's a "car" and a "van" involved in the accident. And a "car" was driving the wrong way.

 

[BTB 500]

The 87 year old in the car was driving north on the southbound carriageway:

Fatal East Midlands M1 crash driver, 87, was going wrong way - BBC News

 

[zipdip]

I think able bodied drivers will be amazed just what illnesses drivers can have and there is no check by the DVLA,how about Parkinsons,slow movement and tremors ,and the medication can make you sleepy,I know one driver who has this and drives a Avensis and tows a caravan,takes 5 hours to get from Colchester to Bournmouth,he has to stop a few times because he is tired,the bottom line is you can be suffering from anything and the DVLA would never know,all you have to do is say I am fine to drive and until you kill somebody it seems nobody cares.

 

[flango]

The 87 year old in the car was driving north on the southbound carriageway:

Fatal East Midlands M1 crash driver, 87, was going wrong way - BBC News

I never doubted it for a moment another wasted life because someone or their relatives can't recognize when its time to hang up the keys and call it a day.

Totally agree with zipdip its a blatant disregard for tacking the issue, how many more people have to die before the DVLA act?

Everyone should have to be requalified to hold their license every three - five years and at 70 it should be every year.

Our driving standards are now some of the lowest in the developed world and thats frightening

 

[BTB 500]

We took the rotor arm out of my grandmother's car in the end because she wouldn't voluntarily stop driving. Sometimes she would go out then not know where she lived, so couldn't get back. She was in her mid-70s IIRC.

 

[grober]

Not according to the figures. Which doesn't mean we can't improve of course.

ROAD TRAFFIC ACCIDENTS DEATH RATE BY COUNTRY

 

[boxbrownie]

It's a rotten situation for sure but from what I have seen of "white van man" I just wonder if the passenger in the van was wearing the seat belt?

Not sure how old the van was so may not have been airbag equipped either.......very sad.

 

[flango]

Not according to the figures. Which doesn't mean we can't improve of course.

ROAD TRAFFIC ACCIDENTS DEATH RATE BY COUNTRY

Agree on deaths but not on number of accidents per 100,000 of population and quality of driving standards of which the UK is well below par. Not seen any recent data but 2 years ago we were shocking.

 

[TheFoX]

I should also point out that my mother, who's almost 70, almost lost her life to a driver who had recently turned 17 and just passed her test.

While there may be an issue with older drivers, there are also issues with drivers under 70.

It may be that someone over 70 might not be as sound a driver as they used to be, but I have seen a growing trend among younger drivers to treat other road users with contempt.

The other day, a van coming the other way almost took my door mirror off, while my vehicle was almost stationary and on the verge, yet he insisted that I had tried to force him off the road. Thankfully, my dashcam proved otherwise, but it was his attitude and violent demeanour that caused a clash of personalities, and his blatant refusal to take responsibility for his rash action that could have caused a serious accident.

You only have to travel to a supermarket car park after dark to see evidence of youngsters pratting about in their cars.

I will also point out that while this elderly person may have caused the crash, plenty of elderly people can still drive in a reasonable and safe fashion, albeit a little bit slower than most of us would prefer.

I wonder how many here would consider themselves too old when they reach 70? I will wait until I am seventy, in twenty years time, to decide if I am still able to cut the mustard.

 

[flango]

I should also point out that my mother, who's almost 70, almost lost her life to a driver who had recently turned 17 and just passed her test.

While there may be an issue with older drivers, there are also issues with drivers under 70.

It may be that someone over 70 might not be as sound a driver as they used to be, but I have seen a growing trend among younger drivers to treat other road users with contempt.

The other day, a van coming the other way almost took my door mirror off, while my vehicle was almost stationary and on the verge, yet he insisted that I had tried to force him off the road. Thankfully, my dashcam proved otherwise, but it was his attitude and violent demeanour that caused a clash of personalities, and his blatant refusal to take responsibility for his rash action that could have caused a serious accident.

You only have to travel to a supermarket car park after dark to see evidence of youngsters pratting about in their cars.

I will also point out that while this elderly person may have caused the crash, plenty of elderly people can still drive in a reasonable and safe fashion, albeit a little bit slower than most of us would prefer.

I wonder how many here would consider themselves too old when they reach 70? I will wait until I am seventy, in twenty years time, to decide if I am still able to cut the mustard.

OK here is the issue ^ There are issues with all driver age groups because the test is too soft and doesn't cover real life situations. Youngsters will always prat about with their cars and show them off just like I did, does that make them unsafe? I've taught and been along side 17 year olds and that are far more competent than people 30 years their senior. I've also been in with 70 year old that have scared the sh*t out of me, so broad brush statements on young or old age groups doesn't mean anything.

You speak of elderly people driving in a safe and reasonable manner just a little bit slower, thats the exact problem slow driving is just as dangerous as fast, I've lost count of the number of times I have followed an elderly person down our country lanes (NSL) at 20 mph because their eyesight is not up to it and they cant drive any faster, same on the motorway 45 mph in lane 1 holding everything up, dangerous and needs stopping.

Again you say when you get to 70 YOU will decide, It shouldn't be your choice you should have to prove you are fit and capable of driving and retaining your license. This can only be done by re qualification of driving licenses and improved testing.

I take a full UK driving test every 3 years as part of my qualifications and when they tell me I am no longer up to it I will hang up the keys for good.

Sorry for the rant and nothing personal but I feel very passionate about this particular subject and have lobbied through motoring groups and to government but it just falls on deaf ears.

Like I say how many more innocent people have to die before action is taken?

 

[artyman]

Well now having reached the wrong side of 70, if I can stick my oar in. It is a case of mental competence, there would be indications of mental sharpness in other areas of behaviour. I feel I'm still well able to drive safely, I'll admit I wouldn't feel as easy driving on the limit that I could have twenty years ago.

I've seen people in their 40's and 50's on the road who don't seem to be capable. I do however think that there should be some form of testing at 70, rather than just writing to the DVLA and saying that you are OK. A 30 minute drive over varied situations , ignoring the bad habits that would probably inevitably would have become ingrained, would indicate whether the mental sharpness is there, and estimate yes they are OK for say 2-5 years before a re-assessment. The period before retest could vary from person to person rather than a fixed period.

 

[MD5]

Google isn't my friend, but looking at this article from 2011, 20-24 years are nearly two and a half times more likely to be involved in an accident than the over 70s, and the 17-19 year old only 10% more likely than the over 70s. Perhaps testosterone levels could also be likely causes? No age group is perfect for different reasons, therefore, but the over 70s are in the safer group of the three.

 

[pipmk]

I never doubted it for a moment another wasted life because someone or their relatives can't recognize when its time to hang up the keys and call it a day.

Totally agree with zipdip its a blatant disregard for tacking the issue, how many more people have to die before the DVLA act?

Everyone should have to be requalified to hold their license every three - five years and at 70 it should be every year.

Our driving standards are now some of the lowest in the developed world and thats frightening

"Our driving standards are some of the lowest" ???? Yet our casualty figures are also some of the lowest. One statement is opinion, one is fact, guess which is which.
Casualty figures caused by older drivers are insignificant compared with those of young drivers. Any injury is deplorable but deal with the major issue first if one is really interested in reducing harm rather than headlines.