A9 average speed cameras go live soon

[219]

BBC News - Date set for A9 average speed camera system going live

 

[John Jones Jr]

''The project, costing £2.5m, involves installing cameras at 27 sites.''

What an investment opportunity...

 

[Dryce]

''The project, costing £2.5m, involves installing cameras at 27 sites.''

What an investment opportunity...

They won't catch many I suspect.

IME speeding isn't that prevalent on the A9. And my recollection is that the actual stats indicate that speeding is (a) not that prevalent and (b) when it does occur the majority of perpetrators aren't going that much above the limit.

The real problem is modern numpty politicians and the 'we have to be seen to do something' attitude.

 

[del320]

'Scuse me whilst I go misty-eyed remembering the time I covered the 150 miles between the (then) Barnton roundabout at the west of Edinburgh to the Tore roundabout north of Inverness in precisely two hours in my SAAB 99 Turbo.

Perth had not yet been bypassed...

 

[John Jones Jr]

They won't catch many I suspect.

IME speeding isn't that prevalent on the A9. And my recollection is that the actual stats indicate that speeding is (a) not that prevalent and (b) when it does occur the majority of perpetrators aren't going that much above the limit.

The real problem is modern numpty politicians and the 'we have to be seen to do something' attitude.

I can't imagine it won't be cost effective.

 

[Dryce]

I can't imagine it won't be cost effective.

I used to do the A9 quite frequently.

Average speeds when its empty don't rise that much. When it's busy then average speeds drop.

The reality of these cameras is that they might just generate some revenue at night or on some of the northern dualled sections.

How much? Not a lot. A few vehicles per day.

But the kicker is if the cameras impact on the use of the dualled sections for passing (the dualled sections north of Pitlochry can be like race tracks as people use them to jump the queues) then that will mean more frustration on the single carriageways.

Average speed isn't the problem on the A9. It's particular issue is the prevalence of head-on collisions - that's down to driver behaviour.

If the enforcement of speed limits on the genuinely fast sections of dual carriageway causes more overtaking to occur on the single carriageway sections then the law of unintended conseqences will kick in. One .... just one extra big accident indirectly caused by these cameras will wipe out any likely annual revenue many times over.

 

[John Jones Jr]

I don't know the road, possibly only used it twice so accept what you are saying and if that's correct you really got to wonder why spend 2.5m in the first place. Too much money floating about up there, a job for the boys, etc? I'm somewhat intrigued.

 

[219]

They won't catch many I suspect.

IME speeding isn't that prevalent on the A9. And my recollection is that the actual stats indicate that speeding is (a) not that prevalent and (b) when it does occur the majority of perpetrators aren't going that much above the limit.

The real problem is modern numpty politicians and the 'we have to be seen to do something' attitude.

I can well believe that the majority aren't that far over the posted limit ( isn't that true on most roads ? ) ; however , the media always seize on the headline generating instances where people are convicted of going 130 , 140 , 150 , usually without crashing .

Of course the real problem is that the road alternates between sections of single carriageway and dual carriageway , and with trucks running in convoy at 40 or 50 mph , much frustration is caused to those stuck behind with little opportunity to safely overtake . That the road is also the main arterial road North and , in the tourist season , is often busy with caravans , camper vans , people towing trailers , and a good number are Johnny foreigner in his LHD vehicle , it makes for an unhappy , if not downright dangerous situation .

The real answer is to have the road upgraded to at least dual carriageway standard along its entire length ( some bits could be upgraded to motorway standard ) and , although planned , it cannot come soon enough .

 

[del320]

Average speed isn't the problem on the A9. It's particular issue is the prevalence of head-on collisions - that's down to driver behaviour.

The main problem is the sight lines on bends more suited to a dual carriageway. Between Dunkeld and Ballinluig and again beyond Killiecrankie to Calvine, virtually the entire single carriageway is marked with a hazard warning centre line.

Despite this, drivers, impatiently waiting behind slower vehicles, are unable to gauge the position of an oncoming vehicle and continue to take risks with often fatal consequences.

ASCs will just add to frustration as many will be unwilling to momentarily exceed the the limit whilst overtaking.

At the height of the season, all single carriageway stretches will be reduced to a 45mph procession with, as Dryce suggests, a mad free for all when the dualled section approaches.

The number of times have I been in a 40mph crawl only to find that when it's my turn to pass the offending slowcoach on a dualled section, my speed is way above 80mph - usually because the slow vehicle is now doing 60mph.

 

[markjay]

I find that drivers tend to be more well-behaved in general when driving through average speed cameras zones.

Not sure why, perhaps it is some sort of 'big brother is watching' mentality.

And yes, there's always the mad rush as soon as the NSL sign is in view...

 

[Tegs200]

Im not against cameras just the reason they use them.

 

[Dryce]

I find that drivers tend to be more well-behaved in general when driving through average speed cameras zones.

Not sure why, perhaps it is some sort of 'big brother is watching' mentality.

If you have a bit of dual carriageway with some minor works and setup up a 40 limit for three miles then a few people will observe the 40. A lot would observe the 40 but see others passing at 50 or 60 and speed up. Human nature.

Stick in the averaging cameras and those would pass at 50 to 60 stick to 40. The rest of the herd who would have speeded up just "because everybody does it" stay in line.

Net result. Calm traffic. Good speed limit observance.

Now if the A9 had a speeding problem (which I'm asserting it doesn't) then
averaging cameras would have that same positive effect. But the A9 doesn't have that problem. Speeds on the single carriage way sections are by and large fine.

 

[Dryce]

The real answer is to have the road upgraded to at least dual carriageway standard along its entire length ( some bits could be upgraded to motorway standard ) and , although planned , it cannot come soon enough .

Waste of money.

It's an odd road. There are no major intervening settlements serviced between Perth and Inverness. Just basically a few big villages.

It's almost empty at times (I refer to it as car-advert land - where you can be driving in daylight with no car visible for a mile ahead or behind).

People actually make good average progress on the A9 as things stand. The frustration is to some extent unique to the A9 because of the motorway like long distance segment.

The mistake was perhaps not to run the road through settlements and deliberately cause slow downs - and have some choke points. That would change perception and make it more like some of the other long distance sngle carriage way routes in the UK. It would alsoe make the perception of accident statistics a bit different as they'd be more naturally split between the different sections rather than attribute to the whole 109 mile segment.

 

[Bellow]

Pretty frequently the local paper that covers the area reports a motorist being caught on the A9 at a three digit speed. Every indication points to it being someone in a hurry, trying to minimise the journey time (not merely sticking their foot in it for half a mile).
That will be the reason for the cameras measuring average speed. To deter those who would hold high speeds for the duration of the road and who may be tempted to recklessly overtake in order to maintain a high speed (though those caught aren't accused of that).
Whether it makes travelling on the road safer remains to be seen.

 

[Dryce]

Pretty frequently the local paper that covers the area reports a motorist being caught on the A9 at a three digit speed. Every indication points to it being someone in a hurry, trying to minimise the journey time (not merely sticking their foot in it for half a mile).

So the A90 and A96 also get these kinds of reports.

They're not statistically relevant. But they make the news. And in the last 15 years it's been nothing like the racetrack it used to be in the eighties and early nineties.

 

[Bellow]

So the A90 and A96 also get these kinds of reports.

The A90 yes, but it is wide open predominately straight dual carriageway, the A96 very rarely.

 

[Giantvanman]

That will be the reason for the cameras measuring average speed. To deter those who would hold high speeds for the duration of the road and who may be tempted to recklessly overtake in order to maintain a high speed (though those caught aren't accused of that).

Just an observation. I see no end of people braking hard from way above the speed limit on the approach to what are clearly marked average speed cameras before accelerating away after passing them.:fail

 

[Dryce]

The A90 yes, but it is wide open predominately straight dual carriageway, the A96 very rarely.

The A90 is dualled, has quite a few cameras, and plenty of police.

The A96 has rather less enforcement and seems to attract a disproportionate share of less widely reported accidents and 130mph+ speeders.

 

[Bellow]

Just an observation. I see no end of people braking hard from way above the speed limit on the approach to what are clearly marked average speed cameras before accelerating away after passing them.:fail

Idiots aplenty who will brake at the sight of a camera (usually when they are but a few yards from it) even though they are travelling below the speed limit. If the police were to follow them and pick them up on their lack of observation there'd be an immediate improvement in road safety.

The A90 is dualled, has quite a few cameras, and plenty of police.

The A96 has rather less enforcement and seems to attract a disproportionate share of less widely reported accidents and 130mph+ speeders.

A90 has speed cameras on the Aberdeen side. The Dundee side uses mobile police. Unmarked cars that appear from nowhere and roadside radar guns.

The A96 employs mobile camera vans and sites them at the safest overtaking opportunities.
High speeds are rare. I live on the A96 exactly half way between Aberdeen and Inverness and know the road like the back of my hand. Speeding is not an issue on that road - lack of speed is.

 

[Dryce]

High speeds are rare. I live on the A96 exactly half way between Aberdeen and Inverness and know the road like the back of my hand. Speeding is not an issue on that road - lack of speed is.

Depends when you drive it.

My experience of the A96 in the evenings - particularly west of Elgin - is that the speeds can be ... interesting - and often way higher than the A9 in similar conditions.

East of Keith plenty of people still push hard when it's not busy.