Driverless Cars and the Law.

[ringway]

Source, BBC Radio 4.

The government wants fully self-driving cars on UK roads by 2021 but which will be ready first - the technology or the law?
Who is responsible in an accident - the owner or the manufacturer?

Joshua Rozenberg meets the team planning a 200 mile driverless journey across the UK.
He speaks to barrister Lucy McCormick, co-author of Law and Driverless Cars, who explains how the legal landscape is evolving.


The clip is only 10 minutes, unless you listen to the other topics.


Driverless Cars and the Law, Law in Action - BBC Radio 4

 

[markjay]

Interesting. I think that self-driving cars will be a common sight on our roads very soon.

Not so sure about driverless cars though.

 

[GeeJayW]

I don't think the law on this will be clear until there have been a number of fatalities and other serious incidents that result in test cases going through the courts.

Currently it's a bit of a mess.
The point at which the passenger sat behind the steering wheel, becomes the driver and thereby responsible for whatever happens next is unclear. Does the 'human driver' then pick up responsibility for what happened before they took over? How does one maintain concentration and awareness of the prevailing situation over a journey where there is no mental or physical involvement in the process? How does one qualify as a driver for driverless cars, and how does one develop and maintain driving competences? Can one still be prosecuted for drink driving in a driverless car?
Etc.

 

[219]

There will probably be similarities with the position of a pilot in charge of an airliner on automatic pilot - some aircraft can take off , fly to a destination and land , all automatically.

 

[markjay]

There will probably be similarities with the position of a pilot in charge of an airliner on automatic pilot - some aircraft can take off , fly to a destination and land , all automatically.

Aircraft operate in far less dense environment.

Pilots are very highly trained and regularly retested.

Cars on the otherhand are operated in close proximity to pedestrians, cyclists, and other cars, by..... well, almost everyone.

This is why autopilot for aircraft was first developed back in the sixties, while 60 years on we are still struggling with self-driving cars.

As for driverless cars... we don't have driverless passanger-carrying aircraft nor will we have it any time soon. We only managed to get as far as driverless trains, and only a handful at that.

It's the future, yes, but it is far from imminent.

 

[219]

Aircraft operate in far less dense environment.

Pilots are very highly trained and regularly retested.

Cars on the otherhand are operated in close proximity to pedestrians, cyclists, and other cars, by..... well, almost everyone.

This is why autopilot for aircraft was first developed back in the sixties, while 60 years on we are still struggling with self-driving cars.

As for driverless cars... we don't have driverless passanger-carrying aircraft nor will we have it any time soon. We only managed to get as far as driverless trains, and only a handful at that.

It's the future, yes, but it is far from imminent.

Oh indeed , but my point was that the legal position of the pilot still being in charge of the aircraft, even though he has little or nothing to do , will be the same as that of a driver in charge of an autonomous vehicle .

 

[slade1]

There will probably be similarities with the position of a pilot in charge of an airliner on automatic pilot - some aircraft can take off , fly to a destination and land , all automatically.

Exactly, the person behind the steering wheel is responsible or we going to have “the satnav took me there”

 

[Rich H]

BMW will be ok because their drivers are exempt from the law

 

[Tiim533]

I hope that sort it out in the next 20 years or so, as by then I'd be too doddery to drive probably. And it would be dead handy for the pub!

 

[Deleted member 6183]

I hope that sort it out in the next 20 years or so, as by then I'd be too doddery to drive probably. And it would be dead handy for the pub!

Share the driving, you drive to the pub and the car drives home.

Actually, I can't wait for driverless cars to take me from pub to pub while I pull moonies from the back seat.

 

[Dippo]

Problem is, you would have to give the car a destination. After a night in the pub, who knows where you would tell it you wanted to go.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Problem is, you would have to give the car a destination. After a night in the pub, who knows where you would tell it you wanted to go.

Somewhere inappropriate.

 

[grober]

What perhaps hasn't been touched on in this scenario is a possible change in car ownership. By the time truely autonomous cars come along the concept of owning a car may be long gone. Just summon one with an app when you need one. Breaking the bond between driver and car may also break the bond of ownership also??

 

[clk320x]

BMW will be ok because their drivers are exempt from the law

Sigh

 

[markjay]

So.... the future is driveless cars driven by mindless drivers.....? I'm glad I won't be around to see it

 

[st13phil]

Breaking the bond between driver and car may also break the bond of ownership also??

That's a very good point, and I can see it working in high population density areas (that's lots of people per unit area, not lots of thicko's, BTW ), but it's a much less attractive proposition in rural locations.

It's interesting - and in some ways unsurprising - that much of the focus is on autonomous personal transport in towns and urban conurbations, yet that's where mass transit systems are prevalent and can offer a viable alternative. By contrast, in rural settings I can see people having to rely upon driving themselves around for much longer.

 

[TheFoX]

Will these self driving, or driverless, cars be able to avoid the potholes that are occuring faster than the councils repair them?

On my commute to work I regularly have to slow down to avoid the gaping gaps in the road. Most of the potholes are on the edge of the road, but there are the occasional midway holes. How would a self driving car navigate this minefield of car damaging crevices?

The concept is noble, but is our road network up to vehicles that may not be able to discern a dip in the tarmac that could cause damage.

 

[artyman]

Would it just brake to avoid a collision or swerve as well, taking to a grass verge for example, I wonder if it would be intelligent enough to make those sort of decisions

 

[Steveml63]

Hi,
This is a picture of the dashboard of a 2019 GM Cruise AV.


I wouldn’t like to be in a GM vehicle with a steering wheel - let alone one that I could not control!

Cheers
Steve

 

[190]

Will these self driving, or driverless, cars be able to avoid the potholes that are occuring faster than the councils repair them?

It seems ironic that we have the advanced technology to produce a driverless car but can't master the very low tech provision of an adequate road surface.