E300 Hybrid or E350 Bluetech?

[ghibbett]

Hi All,

The C63 goes back in Sept (

) and I'm looking at a new E-estate. Specifically I'm looking at either an E350 Bluetech or E300 Hybrid. I know the E350 is a big V6 diesel, which I love the sound of, but am concerned it's only going to be a high 30's mpg car.

On the other hand I like the idea of the E300 being a hybrid and the 50mpg economy, but not so enamoured about the 4 cylinder diesel motor.

Has anyone driven or owned either (or both!) of these cars?

 

[Smatt]

If you are coming from a 63, I would suggest the 350cdi.
...unless you are after 7 seats in which case neither the 350cdi or the 300h are available post facelift with 7 seats
-would either need a pre-facelift 350cdi non bluetec or alternatively a pre or post facelift 250cdi(which is the same engine as the 300h but without the electric motor).
Of course you could consider a 250/350cgi which would be less of a culture shock coming from the C63
The 350cdi should give 30-40mpg depending on driving style. See recent thread on hybrid- may not give you that good an economy unless you alter driving style to encourage the diesel engine to switch off on reg basis

 

[ghibbett]

No need for 7 seats.

I currently have another car which I use for the daily slog, and that averages 45mpg (petrol), so I'm looking for high 40's minimum.

Do you have a link to the recent Hybrid thread?

Thanks

 

[Smatt]

sorry, I see it's not actually a recent thread, but just one that I recently looked at!

here

-I found it informative
Regards

 

[gIzzE]

No need for 7 seats.

I currently have another car which I use for the daily slog, and that averages 45mpg (petrol), so I'm looking for high 40's minimum.

Do you have a link to the recent Hybrid thread?

Thanks

Well, many owners are saying 40+ average and 50 on a run with the hybrid.
You will be more like mid thirties and 40+ on a run with the latest E350cdi.

Are you doing loads of miles per annum?

 

[ghibbett]

15k - 20k p/a.

I'm test driving a 350 Bluetech this weekend, so will be interesting to see what the OBC says.

 

[gIzzE]

15k - 20k p/a.

I'm test driving a 350 Bluetech this weekend, so will be interesting to see what the OBC says.

Definitely report back.

And make sure you take it out with the OBC reset and then turned off, otherwise you will start MPG nannying and not get a true idea.
I do that every time and then end up disappointed.

 

[ghibbett]

Will do

 

[ghibbett]

So yesterday I managed to test drive both an E350 Bluetech and an E300 Bluetech Hybrid. The E350 was a dealer demonstrator with 35,000 miles on it eek whereas the E300 was a brand new car showing 12 miles.

Having the E300 to test drive was an unexpected bonus, however as it was a brand new car we could only take it 'around the block', thus I couldn't replicate the route I did in the E350.

E350 Bluetech
The route I had planned out was actually pretty boring, but replicated a shorter version of a typical commute. It consitied of about 80% dual carriageway with the remainder being A-roads interspersed with traffic lights and roundabouts. As Gizze has recommended, I got into the car, started it, reset the OBC, then flicked back to the digital speed screen and got on with driving the car.

Just under 40 miles later when I returned, I checked the OBC to find it stating 39.2mpg. I'd been using cruise control at between 75-80mph, along with a few spirited acceleration runs to see how she performed. Overall I thought this wasn't too bad.

E300 Bluetech Hybrid
Just having a car there to drive was an unexpected bonus, so I wasn't worried that the test drives routes were different. Even it they'd been the same, the E300 was a brand new car and the engine felt very tight. However the 'round the block' route was still a good 12 miles and gave me ample opportunity to get a feel for the car. The route was a mix of back-lane B-road and fast A-roads, so not much opportunity to take advantage of the hybrid facility other than when sailing up to a junction. Overall the car averaged 42mpg according to the OBC.

Preconceptions
So before I drove these cars, and from reading various posts & reviews, I had a few preconceptions about both vehicles; I thought the 350 would be extremely refined with monster torque and would really show the lack of the refinement in the E300. I also expected there to be a sizeable performance difference. I expected the E300 to be nice, but far more unrefined and just that bit lacking compared with the E300. Basically I thought there'd be a gulf between the 2 cars in terms of refinement, performance and desirability.

I'm very pleased to say that this wasn't the case.

Refinement
This is the E350's trump card. The engine is incredibly smooth, and not just for a diesel. Yes you can (just) hear it's a diesel, but the engine spins very sweetly, there are no vibrations through the seat/wheel/pedals at idle, and it wafts along beautifully.

The E300 was actually pretty damn good! Far better than I was expecting in fact. Yes it's a 4 cylinder diesel, but at low speeds and at idle the engine switches off to use the batteries. Pulling away in electric, along with sailing up towards junctions was just magic thumb. When the engine switches off in sail mode, I only knew this from looking at the rev counter. The engine kicks back in smoothly, but there is a very slight delay as it does so. Certainly it's not as refined as the E350, but the difference between the two was less that I'd thought.

Performance
I found the E350 rather underwhelming here. All this talk of C63 rivaling torque had me thinking it would be some form of tyre shredding monster. It absolutely is not! It may have a similar amount of torque as a C63, but there is no comparison. However in fairness, it does hide its acceleration well. What the E350 is is a very smooth diesel with okay-ish grunt.

And the E300? Well it was a new car, no doubt with a tight engine, but I still gave it some welly. It actually surprised me by feeling almost as quick as the E350. I reckon there'd not much between them in a straight line.

So overall my preconceived gulf between the two cars was more a small gap. I think my ideal combination would be an E350 Hybrid, however between the two tested I would plonk for the E300. I just loved the Hybrid technology

 

[c63chris]

The 350 is a good engine and I switched from a C63 estate to a C350 CDi estate. It is not the same as the C63 obviously. it does make for a fast car just not as fast as a C63. regarding mpg. I would get 44-47 on a motorway run and low 30s haring around. For this one I think the choice comes down to what type of driving you will be doing.

 

[ghibbett]

I think the thing for me was that I was expecting the 350 engine to be some form of diesel hotrod (i.e. BMW 335d-esque), but it just wasn't. In coming down from a C63 I feel I'm going to be easily bored with the 350, whereas at least I can play the econo-game with the 300 Bluetech.

And when I want to have fun, I've got a Caterham Supersport to fulfil those needs

 

[c63chris]

I got bored with mine which is why I'm now in an A45. Its more like a 330d than a 335d in comparison.

 

[Teflonso]

I got the E350, despite some strong encouragement from a salesman to go for the E300. My logic was simple - if buying a car with someone else's money I'd consider a hybrid but with my own money it's a no brainer. After six months and a mere 3500 miles it's only just starting to loosen up. But here's some observations:

• mpg over the entire time has increased from an initial 32.5 average to 32.9. Around town it does 30, on a long gentle run it manages 39-42, depending on whether we're on the flat or crossing the Pennines.

• Last week, I sold my Golf GTI. On paper, the two cars have almost identical numbers, but the boss lady wasn't happy in it. The difference is that my missus was constantly on edge in the GTI at anything slightly beyond pootling speeds whereas in the E350 she's completely relaxed even when cars are shrinking rather quickly in the mirror.

• Recently we were on the back roads and as an experiment I gave it the beans for about 20 minutes. She figured out what the game was, even without the dynamic seats gripping her at every bend, but commented that she had been quite relaxed. In the Golf she'd have been holding the door handle and pressing the imaginary brake pedal, even though it handles the twisty bits better. The E does hide it's performance well and the slush box auto isn't a problem beside a double clutch offering.

• I'm so pleased I didn't go for the 4 pot 220 or 250. Nothing wrong with either car on a test drive, but that V6 3 litre is a peach.

If you want to shred tyres E63 style, buy an E63. If you want an estate that's going to cart a lot of stuff around for 5-7 years the E350 is top of the heap. If someone else is paying, or if you are leasing and handing back, the hybrid might be worth a punt.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

I got the E350, ...

• mpg over the entire time has increased from an initial 32.5 average to 32.9. Around town it does 30, on a long gentle run it manages 39-42, depending on whether we're on the flat or crossing the Pennines.

Interesting. Those figures are very close to my C350 petrol (overall average 32.5 and 38-39mpg on long not-so-gentle runs). I'm guessing that the E-Class is a bit heavier, but not by much. With the difference in fuel prices for diesel and petrol, I reckon my petrol version may be slightly cheaper to run!

 

[Teflonso]

Interesting. Those figures are very close to my C350 petrol (overall average 32.5 and 38-39mpg on long not-so-gentle runs). I'm guessing that the E-Class is a bit heavier, but not by much. With the difference in fuel prices for diesel and petrol, I reckon my petrol version may be slightly cheaper to run!

Yeah, it's a disappointment compared with the brochure - same figures on paper as my previous car but that one averaged 42mpg over it's lifetime and would do 52mpg on the motorway.

There's been a noticeable improvement over the most recent couple of fills as things loosen up, so I'm hopeful that the numbers will get better. Fill to fill numbers are quite encouraging and I'm conscious that there's often a boot full of stuff, which isn't helping the numbers. If I ran part tanks instead of the full 80 litres it would help!

.

 

[gIzzE]

I averaged 33mpg in my E350 cdi estate too.
26mpg at the very worst, but more like 29 round town, and then 38 maybe 39mpg on a steady long run.
Of course there were times when I was on the motorway in 50mph traffic for an hour or more where I saw 45mpg, but being realistic most long journeys were 36mpg.

I have been seriously considering a BMW i3 for running around in.
Doing 15k miles a year I would spend £200 a month on fuel if I averaged 40mpg.
I had a quote for £370 a month including vat for one.
15k miles in the i3 would cost me £10 a month max, saving me £190, meaning it has cost me £180 a month to be in a brand new i3.
Being zero emissions also means I could have it as a company car and pay 0 BIK tax, and we could write the lot off against profits, saving us corporation tax at the end of the year.
£40 a week for a brand new car is not bad, well, I say £40 a week, there is £2200 deposit too, but I prefer man maths.

When is Mercedes proper electric car come with a range extender? I think that appeals more than a Hybrid.

 

[ghibbett]

Just to mention that I have now ordered an E300 Bluetech Hybrid.
Arrives in September.

 

[cp3377]

I don't think you could go wrong with either car. I really love the Hybrid tech and it's kept me amused. I also understand why people love the smoothness of the 350 - if it was a private purchase that would be tempting. What spec did you go for? And keep us posted with your views when you get it.

 

[ghibbett]

Yes will do

Spec wise, it's the AMG Sport (5 dr) variant and I have specified the following:
Cavansite Blue
LED Intelligent Light System
Panoramic Roof
Reversing Camera
Privacy Glass
Speed Limit Assist+
Full tyre pressure monitoring

Look forward to playing with the Hybrid tech