The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[Tuercas viejas]

grober--Mate !
What special relationship?
That went away with Churchill being half American! (Long time ago now!)
A famous American president once said quote "The business of the United States is business " !
Understand that and you start to understand the dynamics involved

Here are another series of quotes which many will find poignant.

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Tuercas Viejas

 

[grober]

grober--Mate !
What special relationship?
That went away with Churchill being half American! (Long time ago now!)
A famous American president once said quote "The business of the United States is business " !
Understand that and you start to understand the dynamics involved

Here are another series of quotes which many will find poignant.

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

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Tuercas Viejas

I was being ironic . Most of us have now heard Donald Trump's oft repeated "America First" mantra

 

[markjay]

From Churchill And America by Martin Gilbert:

 

[markjay]

I was being ironic . Most of us have now heard Donald Trump's oft repeated "America First" mantra

This thing about Trump.... is that he comes, makes some very bold and controversial statements... then goes away... and nothing happens.

Not sure if it's a bad thing or a good thing though.........

 

[grober]

Here are another series of quotes which many will find poignant.

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Tuercas Viejas

In terms of Kennedy I have a soft spot for his Rice University speech for it reminds us of an optimism we perhaps have lost.
It also contains the phrase :- We choose to go to the Moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard; A truth most of our cowardly politicians are not prepared to remotely acknowledge.

We set sail on this new sea because there is new knowledge to be gained, and new rights to be won, and they must be won and used for the progress of all people. For space science, like nuclear science and all technology, has no conscience of its own. Whether it will become a force for good or ill depends on man, and only if the United States occupies a position of pre-eminence can we help decide whether this new ocean will be a sea of peace or a new terrifying theater of war. I do not say that we should or will go unprotected against the hostile misuse of space any more than we go unprotected against the hostile use of land or sea, but I do say that space can be explored and mastered without feeding the fires of war, without repeating the mistakes that man has made in extending his writ around this globe of ours.


There is no strife, no prejudice, no national conflict in outer space as yet. Its hazards are hostile to us all. Its conquest deserves the best of all mankind, and its opportunity for peaceful cooperation may never come again. But why, some say, the Moon? Why choose this as our goal? And they may well ask, why climb the highest mountain? Why, 35 years ago, fly the Atlantic? Why does Rice play Texas?[5]

We choose to go to the Moon! ...[6] We choose to go to the Moon in this decade and do the other things,[7] not because they are easy, but because they are hard; because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one we intend to win

 

[markjay]

There she goes again :

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[markjay]

It would be interesting to know who are the people who vote for her to represent them as MP elections after elections? The mind boggles....

 

[brucemillar]

Does anybody know what Charlie Elphicke is supposed to have done, allegedly, well maybe, might have, or possibly did do, or didn't?

 

[brucemillar]

Does anybody know what Charlie Elphicke is supposed to have done, allegedly, well maybe, might have, or possibly did do, or didn't?

I just read another report says he doesn't know what he did, but says he didn't do it anyway and even if he did know what he was accused of doing he would be denying it. That clears that up then, phew!!!

But seriously though. It says that this is in response to an allegation made to Theresa May immediately after she became PM. She took no action as the 'accuser' did not want any Police involvement. BUt Theresa May has now decided (almost a year later) that the matter should be dealt with by the Police regardless.

 

[Scott_F]

Does anybody know what Charlie Elphicke is supposed to have done, allegedly, well maybe, might have, or possibly did do, or didn't?

Took Ann Widdecombe up the wrong 'un.

 

[markjay]

Does anybody know what Charlie Elphicke is supposed to have done, allegedly, well maybe, might have, or possibly did do, or didn't?

Interestingly he spoke on Radio 4 the other day in defence of the men accused of sexual innuendo and touching (i.e. the least serious allegations) saying this is all taken out of proportion.

 

[brucemillar]

It is strange to see a man in office, suspended by his own party, who have reported him to the Police but (according to him) have not told him what he is accused off. He then denies any wrongdoing and claims that he has not been spoken to by either his party or the Police. By suspending him in this manner, it suggests that the Tory Party feel that he is guilty of whatever it is, that he is accused off, but claims to know nothing about.

 

[Scott_F]

Farage and the Leave campaign never said it would be like this.

£45 BILLION (and rising) just to get the EU to agree to talk trade with us:

Britain set to agree Brexit divorce bill with the EU, and at a huge cost

We were supposed to simply tell the EU what we wanted. If we didn't get it we would just stick two fingers up at them and walk away whilst saving ourselves a few hundred million a year.

It's a clusterfcuk and it's going to keep on getting worse and worse.

 

[AMGeed]

^ It was always a known factor that the UK would settle its outstanding obligations. Negotiating the amount without being held to ransome over trade deals was always going to be the difficult problem going forward. Obviously walking away is cheaper, but it appears the government are ready to settle.
6 Months ago the FT were reporting a £100bn bill.

 

[Scott_F]

^ It was always a known factor that the UK would settle its outstanding obligations. Negotiating the amount without being held to ransome over trade deals was always going to be the difficult problem going forward. Obviously walking away is cheaper, but it appears the government are ready to settle.
6 Months ago the FT were reporting a £100bn bill.

Walking away is most certainly not cheaper as it would lead to no trade deal and we would default to highly unfavourable WTO trading rules.

If walking way was cheaper we wouldn't be over a barrel and squealing that we'll pay 45 billion quid.

 

[markjay]

...If we didn't get it we would just stick two fingers up at them and walk away whilst saving ourselves a few hundred million a *week*.....

Fixed that for you

 

[Scott_F]

Fixed that for you

Can you also fix it for Nigel ?

Nigel Farage: £350 million pledge to fund the NHS was 'a mistake'

 

[Dryce]

Walking away is most certainly not cheaper as it would lead to no trade deal and we would default to highly unfavourable WTO trading rules.

If walking way was cheaper we wouldn't be over a barrel and squealing that we'll pay 45 billion quid.

One might have assumed that with the UK leaving there would be some assets or accumulated value to split.

Instead the EU rather shamefully seems to have nothing other than a cost to fill its own budget hole.

My gut feel after these 18 months is that we should just walk. My view of the EU has gone quite negative. As things stand there is enough sympathy and bias towards the EU within the UK political, civil government, and media that the UK's position is beig undermined from within - while the EU itself is not exactly functional either. The more we talk with them the more they will waste our time and the more they will try and suck out of us.

 

[st13phil]

One might have assumed that with the UK leaving there would be some assets or accumulated value to split.

Instead the EU rather shamefully seems to have nothing other than a cost to fill its own budget hole.

The EU is a financial disaster area, forged in the "too big to fail" mould. Germany and the UK have, to a large extent, propped up the political vanity project for a long time. France tries to look like a net contributor, but scratch beneath the veneer and you find that thing's aren't as they appear on the surface.

My gut feel after these 18 months is that we should just walk. My view of the EU has gone quite negative. As things stand there is enough sympathy and bias towards the EU within the UK political, civil government, and media that the UK's position is beig undermined from within - while the EU itself is not exactly functional either. The more we talk with them the more they will waste our time and the more they will try and suck out of us.

I formed a similar view some while ago. You can only have beneficial negotiations with a willing (and honest) partner. The EU have demonstrated beyond all doubt that they are neither.

 

[Scott_F]

One might have assumed that with the UK leaving there would be some assets or accumulated value to split.

Instead the EU rather shamefully seems to have nothing other than a cost to fill its own budget hole.

My gut feel after these 18 months is that we should just walk. My view of the EU has gone quite negative. As things stand there is enough sympathy and bias towards the EU within the UK political, civil government, and media that the UK's position is beig undermined from within - while the EU itself is not exactly functional either.

Walking away isn't an option. If the UK reverted to WTO trade rules that would be disadvantageous to the EU (they want to carry on trading with us on terms yet to be agreed) but it would be catastrophic for the UK (or it would be if we wanted the JLR, Nissan, Toyota, Honda, Mini, JCB etc. factories to remain here).

That's why we won't "just walk" anywhere.

The more we talk with them the more they will waste our time and the more they will try and suck out of us.

So now that we're seeing through all the bullsh1t about so-called "Project Fear", what exactly were you expecting would happen ?