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1500 mile range electric car battery.
- Thread starter clk320x
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grober
MB Master
Interesting development 
but the " battery" is an aluminium-air fuel cell which cannot be recharged. 
It may have a 1500 mile range but after that you evidently have to buy another one!
The immediate consequence of that its a discrete physical object obtained by purchase --- and therefore easily TAXED at point of sale which might make a difference to the cost per mile !
[ not sure if the comparative calculated costs per mile with other IC technology takes any potential "fuel cell" taxation into account]
ps irrc that aluminium smelting/extraction is very energy intensive and performed via electrolysis which you've guessed it uses a lot of electricity!
Clever development all the same as it confines the energy "CO2 pollution" to large central locations rather than individual vehicles as does current battery tech but with the advantage of an extended range.
In a way you could call it an electrolysis reversal process where all that electrical energy used to produce metallic aluminium [ the potential chemical energy] is reclaimed. Bit like battery charging but with increased storage density
Aluminium smelting - Wikipedia
Aluminium smelting also uses Cryolite (Na3AlF6, sodium hexafluoroaluminate) which produces perfluorocarbon gases -- strong greenhouse gases with a long lifetime.
but the " battery" is an aluminium-air fuel cell which cannot be recharged. It may have a 1500 mile range but after that you evidently have to buy another one! The immediate consequence of that its a discrete physical object obtained by purchase --- and therefore easily TAXED at point of sale which might make a difference to the cost per mile ! [ not sure if the comparative calculated costs per mile with other IC technology takes any potential "fuel cell" taxation into account]ps irrc that aluminium smelting/extraction is very energy intensive and performed via electrolysis which you've guessed it uses a lot of electricity!
Clever development all the same as it confines the energy "CO2 pollution" to large central locations rather than individual vehicles as does current battery tech but with the advantage of an extended range.
In a way you could call it an electrolysis reversal process where all that electrical energy used to produce metallic aluminium [ the potential chemical energy] is reclaimed. Bit like battery charging but with increased storage density
Aluminium smelting - Wikipedia
Aluminium smelting also uses Cryolite (Na3AlF6, sodium hexafluoroaluminate) which produces perfluorocarbon gases -- strong greenhouse gases with a long lifetime.
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IIRC many aluminium smelting works are powered from a very green source, hydroelectric?
That said, the fact one would need to replace the fuel cell, rather than recharge could be both positive and negative
D
Deleted member 126251
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IIRC many aluminium smelting works are powered from a very green source, hydroelectric?
That said, the fact one would need to replace the fuel cell, rather than recharge could be both positive and negative
Hydroelectric if it is available. I've worked in the building of aluminium smelters and bus bar connections under all the pots are massive IIRC about 2' square in cross section.
grober
MB Master
The problem I would forsee would be one of scalability. In other words can a coke can level of technology be effectively translated into battery packs big and cheap enough to power car sized eVs? An obvious one would be an adequate supply of oxygen to a large array of cells if packed together and keeping them cool if that was an issue. Most advanced eV Li-ion Battery packs now have sophisticated cooling systems- something that is not deemed necessary or desirable in Li-ion powerpacks you find in power tools for example.
Hydroelectric is not as green as it might appear. Methane is a much more powerful greenhouse gas than CO2 and methane emissions from hydro-reservoirs are considerable.IIRC many aluminium smelting works are powered from a very green source, hydroelectric?
That said, the fact one would need to replace the fuel cell, rather than recharge could be both positive and negative
Hydroelectric dams emit a billion tonnes of greenhouse gases a year, study finds
Hydroelectric Dams Emit Surprising Amount of Methane
Hydropower is NOT Clean Energy: Dams and Reservoirs are Major Drivers of Climate Change - Waterkeeper Alliance
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The cleanest form of energy production in terms of emissions is probably nuclear... but due to cost and bad press not likely to become prevalent in the UK (unlike in France for example). But EVs powered by electricity generated in nuclear power plants is probably our best bet in terms of emissions.
Interesting development
Much denser, Much cheaper, no toxic elements (I note nothing mentioned about explosive or flammable), replacement in 90 secs (lets say 10 minutes), and no impact on the national grid.
It seems it has a LOT going for it, other than the minor point of not rechargeable (!). One would have thought there are loads of applications where it's host of benefits outweigh it's negatives, in whcih case why hasn't it been bought up for many £100's of millions ? I don't buy that it's because too many are invested in traditional tech.
D
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Deja vu all over again.
exhaustflames71
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The technology sounds futuristic but the swap it part is the biggest downside.. I think most people who own electric cars at the moment will get charging points installed at home or at the office to avoid running out of battery anway?
Speaking of battery swapping, Tesla considered that this might become a big thing and designed the S for the battery to be swapped out in 90 seconds using a jig that unclips and removes the battery from underneath. This seems to have been abandoned in favour of superchargers as a better solution. I’m not sure if the mode 3 has the same fast-swap design.
grober
MB Master
One problem with fast charging seems to be it shortens effective battery life with currrent battery technology - effective battery life being defined as a reduction to 75-80% of capacity from factory. Can't put any more precise figures on this annecdotal evidence or offer any explanation but may be related to battery termperature at cell level during the charging process-sorry.
D
Deleted member 126251
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Not anecdotal - a fact - fast charging shortens the life of the battery.
They could design a car that uses both systems - the aluminium battery for when you want to do a long trip and a normal rechargeable battery setup for doing the school run and shopping.
grober
MB Master
Or a "hybrid" dual battery type system even?
D
Deleted member 126251
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That is what I was implying......
grober
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Bizarre as it may first appear, we may well need better battery technology to extract the last of the world's oil resources.
Lithium ion batteries explode at circa 165 degC. There are wells where the downhole temps will be 175 degC. The downhole tools are battery powered.
Lithium ion batteries explode at circa 165 degC. There are wells where the downhole temps will be 175 degC. The downhole tools are battery powered.
