260E Ethanol Conversion

[Bosco]

Is it possible to convert a 260E to use Ethanol? The kits are cheap enough and the installation videos make it look easy in general terms but I have never seen any specific videos for my model. TBH when I look into the engine bay I can see no connectors that look even vaguely like anything in the videos. Am I missing something really obvious?

My level of mechanical expertise is best described as novice so please be helpful first then you can poke all the fun you like.

 

[neilrr]

How much cheaper than petrol is Ethanol?

 

[Bosco]

The price locally, I'm in France, is €0.90 per litre V €1.55 per litre for 95 unleaded. The kit for a 6 cylinder engine is €168. I do about 35,000 km per year. Even with a possible 15% to 20% drop in fuel efficiency I should save about 30% on fuel costs.

 

[grober]

Most ethanol conversions appear to function by increasing the period of time the injector is open to allow more fuel [ ethanol] into the engine. While this is relatively easily achieved on electronic fuel injection systems by altering the engine ECU characteristics it might be difficult on the mechanical CIS [ continuous injection system] Jetronic KE system you have on your 190 2.6? Morrisons Supermarket seem to supply the fuel in selected stores in the UK ? Personally I would go with LPG.

 

[Bosco]

it might be difficult on the mechanical CIS [ continuous injection system] Jetronic KE system you have on your 190 2.6?

Now we're getting somewhere. Although you say 190 where it's a 260E, is the CIS radically different than that show here?

[YOUTUBE]B11fXI67-Q8[/YOUTUBE]

Presumably it is all contained in the metal enclosure that looks vaguely like an air filter housing? And is therefore not a possibility?


Should I be looking for something more like this? http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00506KD7O/

 

[Pendragon]

Go for a good LPG system like Romano. I had it put on my C240 in February and I have saved £'s on fuel and it runs smoothly with no problems and I pay just 68p per litre.

Cheap than buying Ethanol.


Keith

 

[Bosco]

What did the conversion involve? Do you mind if I ask the cost?

 

[grober]

An explanation of JETRONIC injection as follows :-

Mechanical fuel injection. The 'K' stands for German: "Kontinuierlich", meaning continuous. This is different from pulsed injection systems, in that the fuel flows continuously from all injectors, while the fuel pump pressurises the fuel up to approximately 5 bar (72.5 psi). The air that is taken in is also weighed - to determine the amount of fuel to inject. Commonly called 'Continuous Injection System' (CIS) in the USA. This system has no lambda loop or lambda control.
Gasoline is pumped from the fuel tank to a large control valve called a fuel distributor, which separates the single fuel supply pipe from the tank into smaller pipes, one for each injector. The fuel distributor is mounted atop a control vane through which all intake air must pass, and the system works by varying fuel volume supplied to the injectors based on the angle of the air vane, which in turn is determined by the volume flowrate of air past the vane, and by the control pressure. The control pressure is regulated with a mechanical device called the control pressure regulator (CPR) or the warm-up regulator (WUR). Depending on the model, the CPR may be used to compensate for altitude, full load, and/or a cold engine. On cars equipped with an oxygen sensor, the fuel mixture is adjusted by a device called the frequency valve. The injectors are simple spring-loaded check valves with nozzles; once fuel system pressure becomes high enough to overcome the counterspring, the injectors begin spraying.
K-Jetronic E (Lambda)
Electronically controlled mechanical fuel injection. The engine control unit (ECU) may be either analog or digital, and the system may or may not have closed-loop lambda control. Commonly known as 'CIS-E' in the USA. The later KE3 (CIS-E III) variant features knock sensing capabilities.

So your fuel system is a volume controlled system whereas later systems are timing controlled systems. It would appear that most conversion systems operate by causing a lengthening of the injection time and in the video what she is doing is inserting the electronic connections to produce that open/closure delay to each individual injector. The box is just some fancy electronics piggy-backing on to the existing system nothing more.

IT WOULD NOT WORK ON YOUR CAR SORRY!

 

[Pendragon]

What did the conversion involve? Do you mind if I ask the cost?

I had mine done a little cheaper £1350.00 for the Romano multi-point system because I did the training video for the Autogas Industry a few back but the cost would be around the £1800 mark...give or take a hundred or so £'s but well worth it.

Mine was done by MINT at Autogas Worldwide Newport Gwent (Don't have a MINT system put in as the injectors are not the best)

Keith

 

[Bosco]

I'm afraid that £1,800 is actually more than the value of the car so I can't go to that expense but thanks anyway.

That was a very full explanation of fuel injection systems grober but tbh most of it went over my head. Is there no possible way to use ethanol? What about something like this? Amazon.com: EZ85 Flex Fuel E85 Ethanol Conversion Kit for Throttle Body Injector Engines: Automotive

When SWMBO finds out that I have walked into a money pit fuel wise she will kill me stone dead. Please tell me that there is some option.

 

[Pendragon]

Well, you can get a single point injection system fitted for around £800.00

It depends on whether you intend to keep the car for a fair while and if so then you will get your money back in saved fuel costs.

Keith

 

[grober]

I'm afraid that £1,800 is actually more than the value of the car so I can't go to that expense but thanks anyway.

That was a very full explanation of fuel injection systems grober but tbh most of it went over my head. Is there no possible way to use ethanol? What about something like this? Amazon.com: EZ85 Flex Fuel E85 Ethanol Conversion Kit for Throttle Body Injector Engines: Automotive

When SWMBO finds out that I have walked into a money pit fuel wise she will kill me stone dead. Please tell me that there is some option.

Nope --with your design of injection system simply not possible the clues are in the advert :- "electronic monopoint or multipoint port fuel injection system" your system is alas essential mechanical injection

Cheer up these Jetronic E systems are bullet proof if kept clean and the 260 190 is a great car and will respond to a gentle right foot!

 

[Bosco]

Thanks again. I was afraid you were going to say that. I'm a dead man.