722.6 Alternative ATF.

[JohnnyW202]

Quality Granville Fully Synthetic ATF-MV Automatic Transmission Fluid 5LTR | eBay

Found this, allegedly it has the MB236.10 rating and also mentions NAG1.

It's allegedly fully synthetic too

And I've been running it with no problems for the last 10,000 miles.

Might be a worthy alternative for people who don't want to fork out on the Mercedes-Benz/Shell stuff, also I don't recommend buying the febi bilstein stuff listed on ebay most of it is Dexron IID and quite misleadingly listed because it's for the older 722.4 boxes.

But this £50 for 10 litres... Bargain I think.

 

[grober]

Might be OK for the early 5 speed boxes but I would hesitate to use it on the 7 speeds. SOME BACKGROUND they have some well known names under that Granville brand

http://www.granville-oilchem.co.uk/downloads/Cato-2010-web.pdf

 

[Olivier]

Hi Johnny,
It look good A lot cheaper indeed and is this the proper requierement for the 722.6 on the E300TD?
Cheers.
Olivier

 

[JohnnyW202]

Thanks Grober, I noticed they own Big Wipes, Gunk and other well known brands, which are of good quality. I certainly wouldn't use it in a newer 7 speed box especially since it only carries the 236.10 certification not the newer 236.14 for the 7 Speed Box, and Olivier, it should be fine to use in your E300TD, although any box troubles you're having are likely to be electronic, but if you're doing standard maintenance, this a new filter and sump gasket, every 50k and you should considerably lengthen the life of your box over the nasty lifetime fill stuff.

 

[BlackC55]

That ATF is not good enough for the 722.6 or the 722.9. The 722.6 should use the .12 or the .14 spec fluid and the 722.9 should use the .14 spec.

.10 spec ATF is for the older boxes. I have just had a 722.6 fail because the owner used the incorrect fluid for it. He used the .10 spec. When the box was stripped it showed signs of the fluid breaking down causing wear. The electrical plate was like a banana due to overheating.

 

[JohnnyW202]

That ATF is not good enough for the 722.6 or the 722.9. The 722.6 should use the .12 or the .14 spec fluid and the 722.9 should use the .14 spec.

.10 spec ATF is for the older boxes. I have just had a 722.6 fail because the owner used the incorrect fluid for it. He used the .10 spec. When the box was stripped it showed signs of the fluid breaking down causing wear. The electrical plate was like a banana due to overheating.

Can you explain to me how the 236.10 specification isn't right for the 722.6 Pre-Triptronic Transmission also known as NAG1 that got Triptronic Manual Selection in MY1999?

Surely it's better to have nice fresh fluid and filter, even if it isn't this gold dust that Mercedes-Benz claim to fill their boxes with from the factories, also Miller Oils and Smith And Allen Lubrications both expressed concern over the filled for fill policy and both agreed their fluids would be more than upto the job.

Also these are old cars now sub £1500, people cannot afford to keep changing parts at the cost Mercedes-Benz wants for them, star diagnostics etc. They want practical, cheaper DIY Solutions, I'm pretty sure that people who have S600's, S500s, High Powered AMG Variants can't their cars carefully serviced by specialists, but to be honest I know some of the monkeys that work in our local Synther and I wouldn't trust them with a 300,000 mile 190d, never mind a brand new car.

It would be ashame to see W202, W210s, W201's in a scrapyard all because someone couldn't afford the upkeep when they can do it themselves.

It's keeping these cars running well, with minimum outlay not giving them more reason to go bang.

Otherwise we'd go buy Mondeo's, with their cheap pattern parts.

 

[BlackC55]

It is not the right specification according to MB WIS. Not using the right oil could cost you more in the long run. Your only going to save a few quid using this .10 stuff. The consequences of not using the correct ATF is going to cost you more.

I have seen for myself the damage done by the wrong grade ATF being used. Just use the right stuff.

 

[JohnnyW202]

It is not the right specification according to MB WIS. Not using the right oil could cost you more in the long run. Your only going to save a few quid using this .10 stuff. The consequences of not using the correct ATF is going to cost you more.

I have seen for myself the damage done by the wrong grade ATF being used. Just use the right stuff.

Well apparantly the correct fluid is actually Shell Spirax S4 ATF 3403/Shell ATF 3403 M-115 (A 001 989 21 03)

Has anyone had the good sense to get Fresh Mercedes Supplied Fluid Chemically analysed and compared to Dexron III and other standards of ATF to see if it is indeed miracle fluid or if in fact we're being ripped off.

I think someone should end this one and for all.

 

[grober]

Well apparantly the correct fluid is actually Shell Spirax S4 ATF 3403/Shell ATF 3403 M-115 (A 001 989 21 03)

Has anyone had the good sense to get Fresh Mercedes Supplied Fluid Chemically analysed and compared to Dexron III and other standards of ATF to see if it is indeed miracle fluid or if in fact we're being ripped off.

I think someone should end this one and for all.

While I applaud your aspiration to save forum members a bit of cash it would take a monumental analytical effort to back-engineer a synthetically blended ATF which no single individual could afford. Mercedes do in fact publish lists of approved fluids that meet certain spec approval other than MB'S own.

Mercedes-Benz Specifications for Operating Fluids: Overview Sheets

BlackC55's advice is sound in so far as its a) fail safe and b)not much more expensive to use the approved fluids

 

[johnsco]

I have no hesitation in using Miller's Dexron III in my old E300TD.
So - I'm not wedded to using expensive MB fluid when other fluids meet the same spec.
BUT
These various ATFs have different "friction-modified" characteristics and different temperature characteristics.
Get this wrong and you can easily do very expensive damage to your auto-transmission.

 

[JohnnyW202]

I'm in the same boat as you Johnsco, a 1998 C200 is hardly putting any strain on that tranmission particularly as they run bloody v12 biturbos, I can understand why the fluid would be important on these monsters but not very ordinary underpowered 202 like mine.

722.6 is a fantastic box! 722.9 in comparison isn't fitted to the monsterous cars as it can't handle the maximum torque they produce... also it was designed to fit in the same footprint as the 5 speed and thus won't creep/hold itself on a hill... a very poor idea for an automatic box indeed.

 

[kth286]

the way I see things when looking at options to original parts/fluids for our Mercedes is as follows:

its' the 'difference in price' what's being discussed.

I look at that 'difference' as being the premium I am willing to pay to an insurance policy (if you will) to get total peace of mind.

Peace of mind that the part will fit properly first time, and will last another 16 years without any hassle.

183000+ miles and 16 years and RAD just recently changed first time, because I use original Mercedes coolant (because it's worth it).

 

[BlackC55]

I'm in the same boat as you Johnsco, a 1998 C200 is hardly putting any strain on that tranmission particularly as they run bloody v12 biturbos, I can understand why the fluid would be important on these monsters but not very ordinary underpowered 202 like mine.

722.6 is a fantastic box! 722.9 in comparison isn't fitted to the monsterous cars as it can't handle the maximum torque they produce... also it was designed to fit in the same footprint as the 5 speed and thus won't creep/hold itself on a hill... a very poor idea for an automatic box indeed.

The internals of a C200 722.6 box and a S600 722.6 box will be different.

I have seen with my own eyes the consequence of not using the right ATF. It does make a difference.

 

[Olivier]

also I don't recommend buying the febi bilstein stuff listed on ebay most of it is Dexron IID and quite misleadingly listed because it's for the older 722.4 boxes.

just to say about this that Franey sell the Febi gearbox oil and its 236.12
then if anyone is looking for some good oil at good prices check with him first before going to fleebay.

Also on the old one I used the Valvoline MAXI life, 40,000 miles no problems at all.

 

[JohnnyW202]

TITAN ATF 3353- Ultra high-performance DEXRON III-generation-ATF for automatic transmissions as well as any other ATF-applications. Developed for the latest generation of Mercedes-Benz 7-step-automatic transmissions (NAG 2), applicable as well for the predecessing 5-step-automatic transmissions (NAG 1). Offers fuel-efficiency potential.
This is actually listed on Mercedes-Benz approval list (MB 236.12 - Automatic transmission fluids (ATF, Specification 236.12) - Mercedes-Benz Specifications for Operating Fluids)

So it is just synthetically blended dexron III?


Ultra high-performance DEXRON III-generation-ATF for automatic transmissions as well as any other ATF-applications. Developed for the latest generation of Mercedes-Benz 7-step-automatic transmissions (NAG 2), applicable as well for the predecessing 5-step-automatic transmissions (NAG 1). Offers fuel-efficiency potential.

 

[grober]

Fuchs now recommend TITAN ATF 4134 for the 7 speed boxes although from the technical spec its almost identical to the TITAN ATF 3353---- One assumes some improvement- possibly based on experience of running the 3353 initially in the seven speeds?

tech data sheets [TDS] here:-- Fuchs Lubricants - South Africa

 

[elite_504]

Is it not just easier to use the correct stuff rather than worry about it? Just my 2 pence...

 

[JohnnyW202]

So who can get me 236.14, so I can see if it offers smooth change characteristics, myself?

8 Litres. Best price I've found is £60. Someone PM'd me about getting me fluid and never got back to me... Any advances on this price, this is for FEBI ATF 134.

 

[grober]

Mercedes-Automa

6.75 euros per litre plus postage. 20 litre container.