ADVICE PLEASE - NOTICE OF INTENDED PROSECUTION - M1 SOUTHBOUND MIDNIGHT - VARIABLE SPEED LIMIT

[rockits]

#1
Just got my first of these things ever and it all seems a little harsh to me. Anyone had one similar and have opposed it?

I had left home at 5.30am to drive to Leeds to do a job on Weds 1st Aug last week. Nice drive up the A1 as I'm not far from A1. Took 3 hours and 15 mins with a 15 mins stop. Left Leeds after a nice successful days work at 9pm. Decided to go down M1 home as more services/stopping points and a bit safer (so I thought!) as mainly 3-4 lanes. Also less dark areas etc. so all good starting off. Unbeknown to me there was to be a ton of roadworks and a myriad of variable speed limits contraflows and all sorts. End up taking me 4 hours to get home with less traffic than there was driving up the A1 earlier that morning. However I'm no rush so take it easy and I get home whatever time it takes.

Starts to get very confusing with Lanes 1-3 closed then 40mph contraflow along 4th lane. Then national speed limit/70mph for a bit. Then more roadworks coming up so 70mph to 60mph then 50mph, then 70mph. Then they close Lanes 22-4 and contraflow down Lane 1. Goes on like this for many miles of roadworks, then none, then roadworks, then none etc. All the time there are a ton of lorries, cars going past me, me going past slow cars/lorries. Flashing lights everywhere with massive bright flood lights for some areas. Tons of traffic with bright headlights coming the other way. All very difficult to keep in the right lane, not crash, keep at the right speed to the ever changing variable limits.

I am doing about 60mph through variable 60mph overhead gantry sign, then 60mph again through another then a car comes flying passed me and jumps on his brakes a bit. I get to the next gantry sign and it is suddenly 50mph so I start to ease off my speed to get down to somewhere near 50mph but too late. As I go through the first 50mph overhead gantry sign I get flashed. A little annoying as it is hard to see what the sign says in advanced to reduce the speed before you hit the camera. The first 50mph camera is in the gantry so it doesn't really give you any warning to slow your speed in advanced of the camera at all. A few yards after the camera I have slowed enough and am at roughly 50mph now before I hit the next 50mph then I'm OK. Then it is 40mph through contraflow then 70mph national speed limit as you come out again. This must have continued for 10 junctions it seemed.

I had just invested in a cheap dashcam after a little recent incident where some idiot decided on purpose to jump on the brakes to a stop immediately after leaving a red to green light. Currently all being investigated it looks as though it is one of these crash on purpose, whiplash, cash claim things. Anyway I had the new dashcam that day so have all the footage of the drive back. It is midnight on a main motorway that would normally would be fairly quiet and safe. The constant roadworks and variable speed limits with flashing lights and floodlights makes it utterly confusing and downright dangerous in my opinion. Without the roadworks or with better planning and smoother flow there are no issues. Instead we have chaos and confusion. Also I get a ticket when I am not driving silly and not doing too much wrong really.

For anyone interested the footage of this bit is here:
https://rocksolutions-my.sharepoint...1EtMlxMHrwQUsBFq5LGytWqEiAGOwe4XoNyg?e=xV3exx

Sorry for the audio....you might want to turn it down or off! Not sure what I was listening to or what radio station. Just wanted something soothing and relaxing

My question is if anyone has had a similar incident? Or any advice or help as to if I should pay the fine and take the points or do the Speed Awareness Course? Or oppose the situation as it seems a little unfair, dangerous and gives no real time to adjust your speed safely. Surely it can;t be a good thing to jump on your brakes to wipe off circa 10mph in a few yards. Should you not be given until the next gantry to have adjust your speed or 30 secs to safely do so?

Anyone know if there are any rules, regulations or practices around any of this?

Thanks in advanced all or any of you hopefully wiser more experienced heads.

 

[rockits]

BTW excuse my temp middle lane hogging! My lane discipline is normally exemplary and this is a short isolated lapse. Just didn't like being on the inside lane through all these roadworks as there were tons of cones virtually on the white line for much of this.

 

[neilrr]

You will get a lot of well intentioned inaccurate 'my mate down the pub had this happen to him and...' kind of replies here. If you are not already a member join the forum which specialises in this stuff - http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=5 & post your thread there for the experts to aid you.

To save time & to avoid pissing people off, in your opening post you should include ALL sides of ALL the paperwork you have received including photos, blocking out ID'ing things like name, address, reg # etc. Just like on Dragnet they want just the facts, not your life story.

Good luck.

 

[Benzmanc]

PePiPoo: UK Motoring Law - FAQs and Forums

 

[m2287]

I know exactly how you feel, it’s the same on the m25 near cobham services, 40mph signs on the side of the road but overhead it says 40/50/60/NSL, so confusing and everyone else just seems to be doing 70 anyway!

 

[merc85]

PePiPoo: UK Motoring Law - FAQs and Forums

Please Go to the PePiPoo forum, they are very helpfull, i know

 

[wu56Shoozz]

"Just didn't like being on the inside lane through all these roadworks as there were tons of cones virtually on the white line for much of this"

I'm not having a go here as I know what you mean, however, can you imagine if something had happened and say your called as a witness or something, Can you imagine how plod will react to an answer like the above.. it could cost you 3 points as they will find away to make their quota..
I had a similar situation on the Kingston bridge where plod was "setting up" a diversion, there are 4 lanes, I'm on the very inside lane tootling along as there's something afoot.. then from the very outside lane comes plod in his X5 cuts across all 4 lanes into mine then proceeds to start slowing me down, no blues & twos nothing..I try to overtake him, but by this time the traffic has started to "nose to tail it" and I can't get out.. next thing I know plod fires on his STOP light and proceeds to stop me. His first question is " Why am I in this lane?" I explain that its the safest lane possible until I see what's going on, I may have to exit the motorway.. he then goes on to say that I was in the wrong lane and as a result could face prosecution..there was no indication of lane closure/ accident/ incident.. no citrax nada..just setting up and I was in the wrong place apparently.. I got a caution and allowed to merge, but you see what I mean...

Pepipoo is the best site, trust me I nearly lost my license for having a random thought.. it was my trucker mate that recommended it, and I can't praise them enough.. well recommended..

 

[John]

I notice someone else got flashed at 17 seconds from the same gantry!

I normally ensure I am not going through any more than early 50s on a 50 gantry if slowing down from a 60 gantry.

Of course the camera can be set at 51 but I've yet to experience an issue.

Being devil's advocate and if it were me, I'd take it on the chin and be annoyed with myself for not braking (as I usually just decelerate too).

If I don't think I am going to make a low enough speed, just a dab on the brakes resolves. You don't need to brake hard to get from mid 50s to 50.

 

[pmcgsmurf]

Car that overtook you seemed to have hit the brakes so must have noticed the sign or knew the area.

If you've been offered an awareness course and no fine/points I'd take that and as John says just take it on the chin.

 

[rockits]

Thanks all.

It had been a long day & although I wasn't too tired to drive at all I wasn't as fresh as I was first thing in the morning & the darkness with lots of flashing lights all over the place certainly doesn't help.

It was only my 2nd trip to this customer with the 1st three months ago. I don't go up/down the A1 or M1 much these days although used to some years back. Not really familier with the current roads or works. Wish I'd gone back South down the A1 now the same as I did 3 months back. That M1 south during those times is ridiculous & no way I'm going that way home again at those times.

 

[rockits]

Car that overtook you seemed to have hit the brakes so must have noticed the sign or knew the area.

If you've been offered an awareness course and no fine/points I'd take that and as John says just take it on the chin.

Crazy thing is the car that sped past me that was sharper to break hard probably hasn't got a NIP! However in the real world he is driving much more dangerous.

 

[wu56Shoozz]

Waze App, maybe of benefit?

For Future reference - Abs may the expert on this..

 

[rockits]

Already have Waze & use it all the time and have done for a long time. Just a case of sensory overload at the time I think.

I'm not sure if any Nav including Waze is fully dynamic though is it?

 

[artyman]

I was clocked at 35 in a 30, on the Speed awareness course and they stressed that the speed limit starts at the sign, not after a coasting down to speed a few yards later. Just take the course and like me be extra vigilant in future.

 

[markjay]

Already have Waze & use it all the time and have done for a long time. Just a case of sensory overload at the time I think.

I'm not sure if any Nav including Waze is fully dynamic though is it?

My experience is that in most cases Waze will not be aware of temporary speed restrictions and will just show the default speed limit for thar road.

And while it would have shown the speed cameras en route, it would not have sounded an audible alert as it would not know that you were speeding.

 

[markjay]

So what speed were you driving at according to the NIP?

 

[baxlin]

I was clocked at 35 in a 30, on the Speed awareness course and they stressed that the speed limit starts at the sign, not after a coasting down to speed a few yards later. Just take the course and like me be extra vigilant in future.

I’m also of the 'take it on the chin and choose the Awareness course' brigade, sorry to sound unsympathetic.

On my course (37 in a 30, but also 'out of hours'), the above quote was also pointed out, with the additional comment that we often anticipate the derestriction sign, and speed up before reaching it, so why don’t we anticipate the speed restriction sign?

FWIW, I found the course to be very informative: we were not treated as criminals, but more as 'students' who were there to learn.

 

[paul73mt]

i believe i'm also right in thinking on the variable speed cameras above the gantry's when then change from 50-40, 60-50 etc etc a timer starts (60 seconds i believe)where the camera isn't active, this allows (so they say) to stop people hitting the brakes when their at the cameras, A few months ago i was driving on the m25 and a 50 sign was up . i set the speed limiter to 53 (so im doing 50/51) went through a camera and it flashed now the car in the 3rd lane did pass me but didn't fly past. I never heard anything but cant say if they did either

 

[clk320x]

Dean, if you have been offered a speed awareness course then this is the option I would take.

This way you do not get any penalty points, and your insurance premiums shouldn’t be affected. It does mean you lose a day of time though

I hate variable speed limits too.

I am going to assume the car which overtook you, knew there was no camera fitted on the 60mph gantry. (Waze etc. would show this) and then slammed on the brakes for the 50mph. As MJ said it wouldn’t beep as Waze wouldn’t know the reduced limit (it does know fixed average speed zones during roadworks however) but it would show on screen and is quite visible.

I go up/down the M1 a lot and it’s a nightmare.

 

[rockits]

So what speed were you driving at according to the NIP?

64mph allegedly