Agony aunt time - anxiety disorder
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I'm predicting this is going to be a bit wordy so apologies and make sure you have a comfy chair and a nice cup of tea!
From what I know now, mine was caused by a combination of three things.
Firstly I used vitamin supplements in my younger years. Whilst my diet was actually quite good, I suppose these were a bit of an insurance to ensure I met the RDA for everything (OCD one might say). I didn't realise at the time but in certain situations, I can remember feeling very mild anxiety. So for example, I lived on the end of the Met Underground Line for a few years after graduating (98 > 02) and the prospect of night out in the square mile in London made me a little bit anxious. Which was strange because I commuted by train into London for my degree for 4 years (94 > 98) previously. Weird but I just assumed that was how it was. After all, you don't suspect either that there is a cause and certainly not bloody vitamin pills.
This more or less remained the same for a few years until the second thing kicked in which was...
My mum first got ill with cancer in Summer 2008, and whilst I didn't truly grasp the gravitas of this at the time, it obviously caused me a great deal of stress which crept in without me realising.
You might remember Bruce's story on here and what a rollercoaster that was - full of ups and downs. It was the same which is why I refer to cancer as a rollercoaster albeit it lasted nearly 7 years. Sometimes we thought she was cured but you always wondered if it would come back so mixed feelings / positive and then the inevitable kicks in the nuts as we went along.
Things gradually deteriorated from there and the third thing came in (or at least became more of an issue) - basically some of the things I was eating caused me issues physically, which although sound laughable now, but at the time what with the other two things, I was basically a wreck (like mature cheese with lots of Tyramine can give me arrhythmia lasting for hours (bit scary when you are new to it!), pastrami/strong cured things give me a grumbling appendix, anything dairy eaten too quick or I eat too much (I mean lots), my heart does a weird mini-arrhythmia etc. can get headaches and the stress itself caused physical symptoms - so although I know what does what now, when you are unwell your mind conjures up all sorts of doomsday scenarios for you and there are other probably things I've forgotten about).
By 2009, things were pretty bad. Lots of celebrities died in the Summer that year and at once stage for a period of time, I spent my hour lunch reading through the pages of deaths on Wikipedia.
I look back now and seriously - WTF?
But at the time, no alarm bells were ringing like they would if I told myself that is what I was doing.
Anyway, things gradually got worse but I still didn't know I was unwell and I was getting the clinical symptoms of stress and the anxiety - the anxiety was already there of course but the stress of the situation made this worse of course.
Over the next 3 years, I had a few trips to hospital (some blue-lights and wailers) due to things I didn't understand the cause of and / or things caused by the food thing above, or once I pulled a muscle lifting something heavy at work and the second you tell medical professionals you have pain in the centre of your chest, they tell you you could be having a heart attack and that really helps when you aren't well albeit could have been the case.
Somethings like a duodenal ulcer caused by too much Ibuprofen so back to A&E one Christmas Eve : were just more relentless kicks in the nuts and unfortunate but this was becoming a pattern...
Back then I didn't understand it all like I do now, as it was all new to me and happening in quick succession, that it made things worse coupled with the stress too.
It was in that 3 year period I had the hopes of not waking up when I went to bed like I mentioned before - as I felt dreadful.
Things came to a head in late 2012 when I went to see a couple of shows in London with my other half. I spent the whole time (not literally thankfully) shitting myself through We Will Rock You and two weeks later, shitting myself somewhat through a tribute to Michael Jackson by Cirque du Soleil.
I spent a lot of time from 2009 until maybe 2014 periodically checking my pulse when I had anxious periods to be sure my heart had not stopped. So in those shows, I basically had my thumb on my wrist and did this with sweaty-clenched palms, a racing heart and just wanting to die throughout We Will Rock You and through much of the second show. Not enjoyable and this is how I can truly understand anxiety in others!
I also got bouts of vertigo throughout this same 5 year period - very weird walking on a solid concrete bridge and it feels like it is made of jelly. Just something else to pile on top of the many things really. I also got missed heartbeats periodically throughout the day - which I now know were caused by stress.
There were times I thought I was getting better and even when I bought my E55 in March 2011 when I joined here, I thought I was getting better. But I wasn't overall... just having better periods.
As you can imagine, working out what causes what out of that lot was going to be quite a challenge and as I look back, it bloody was. To make it trickier, anything caused by food didn't present at the same time and not straight after eating (sometimes a short while after, sometimes 4 hours later, sometimes 8 hours later and sometimes the next day - things were consistent but all mixed together).
Nightmare.
Of course you cannot research the above as it isn't one problem so I pursued the heart / health thing first. That was all clear but took a while to get to a point where I got it and it couldn't be a physical health problem.
The NHS were very good were they had something they could help with but they couldn't help at all with my situation and when I think how complicated it all was, I am not surprised really. I am grateful for their support and help when I needed it though.
So at the end of 2012 at what was probably my worst as mentioned above, and on the recommendation of some helpful soul on a heart health forum which I can remember posting up on stating I thought it might be what I was eating causing my issues, she recommended seeing a nutritionist.
By then, I was such a wreck I was willing to try anything.
Nutritionist was really good and basically stripped my diet of everything except a relatively constant diet containing everything you needed.
There I was drinking lemon and hot water every morning, nothing really nice to eat at all (basically she took my suggestion of thinking dairy was giving me jip and stripped it out too) and to keep that going.
Of course she had stripped out the vitamins etc. too and after 2 or 3 months, of course I started to feel better and the anxiety lessened so I naturally presumed all my issues were caused by food not realising what the supplements were doing!
Anyway, I still had occasional issues but way better and the anxiety dropped out completely eventually.
Tried CBT in 2013 but this didn't work because it couldn't cure my mum of cancer, stop me eating vitamin supplements albeit I'd stopped them nor tell me what food would cause what weird thing to me!
I believe CBT only works in cases where there is a cause which can be discovered, talked about, vented and dealt with.
Anyway, once I finally got to the stage where it seemed I was pretty much fixed at some point in late 2013, I then started introducing food that I wasn't allowed to eat.
By a few chance discoveries and trial and error, I was able to work out what caused what and what I could tolerate which took a few years.
I did initially reverse some of the food stuff and habits I was told to do but over the last 5 years I re-introduced some of it as I realised it made me feel better (keeping GI level, better diet etc.).
I went on holiday with my other half in 2014 for the first time in years because the anxiety had gone and it looked like my mum was going to be fine after an operation in late 2013. I really enjoyed it again compared to not wanting to even go out for a meal for shitting myself a couple of years earlier! (This is how I understand when someone feels anxious and can't do something).
So then two of the things had been sorted (anxiety and food) and then my mum died in 01/2015. I was also able change various things including my job (hated my MD by then as he treated other good employees like shit) as I needed a fresh start which all happened early 2015 fortunately.
Although grief and sadness were unbelievable, the stress began to subside because the source of it was no longer there.
The excitement of getting a new job which I really enjoyed, and still do, as well as novelty and fresh start from working with a happy and positive bunch of people from many nationalities also helped me enormously.
I joined the gym in 2017 to improve my fitness and things gradually improved wholesale and then I was able to look back and workout what caused what over the last 4.5 years.
The anxiety cause was further confirmed when I started on Vitamin D supplements one Autumn a couple of years ago. Within a month I had weird missed heartbeats and I could feel the anxiety, even though I wasn't actually anxious if that made sense. A sort of "fake" anxiety, which I guess before was combined with stress which made it feel real. So that's when I realised the cause of my anxiety originally! It took another month to go so a build up of some sort.
So after 7 complicated years, I've learnt a lot about a lot of things to do with my own health, what to look for, mental health, what I should be eating and to keep stress out of my life where possible!
I doubt I will ever be that ill again because those three factors won't co-exist.
I've been tested since though...
I was able to support my other half with the death of her father in early 2017 and I was absolutely fine - I couldn't have done that 5 or 6 years prior.
Then I even ate too much mature cheddar late 2017 without realising it was that mature (I'm talking 3 chunks) and I was blue-lighted to A&E midday the next day with arrhythmia and then in ICU until 04:00am the next day (with the possibility of my heart being shocked unless it fixed itself which fortunately it did) and I coped easily with the whole episode. Again, previously I would have been a wreck.
All of this tested my troubleshooting skills to the limit...
I have developed a personal interest and done a fair bit of reading and watching programmes on the whole mental illness thing - as well as the training I did at work. Now I try and help others where I can whether it be on here or in person... and I stay away from those Wikipedia death pages even though I know I could read them like a TV guide!
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Respect John you’ve through the Ringer mateso glad your feeling brighter bud
Cheers dude. It's only when I look back I realise how unwell I was. You just don't realise at the time when you are in it. I do feel for others who are not having a great time of it. I know some on here have also been open about their demons.
One big part of it was I kept it so well-hidden that no one would have had a clue as it is all on the inside...
It's only my other half who really knew because I told her but throughout all of it, something that helped with some respite at times was talking about it despite the underlying causes still being there.
So even though they didn't fix my problems, it helped a lot...
I had several months of doctors and testing for light headedness and dizzy spells when mine started back around 2012, which has now given me a healthy dose of white coat syndrome! It was actually a random link whilst searching for heart attack information that sent me to a nomorepanic forum and I discovered there were hundreds of people with all manor of "real" health issues caused by anxiety!
Worth a look if anyone is worried about a physical condition, I'm not suggesting to avoid the standard medical testing but have a read of some of the experiences on there as it always helps to overcome something if you understand it.
No More Panic | Support is just a click away
Worth a look if anyone is worried about a physical condition, I'm not suggesting to avoid the standard medical testing but have a read of some of the experiences on there as it always helps to overcome something if you understand it.
No More Panic | Support is just a click away
Its not until you talk to people that you realise just how much it affects people. Like @John said you keep it well hidden until something , and it can be the smallest and simplest of things can just tip you over the edge (sorry for bad term) because all the little things have been pushed down inside eventually have to go somewhere!
My brother had a terrible time and we had no idea as he hid it so well. People say to me, surely you'd know, but you dont, we are good at keeping it inside. If you were to meet him, you wouldn't think anything would trouble him, He is 6.4, heavily tattooed, piercings, big biker guy. But a few years ago he was a completely different person, he became just a shell, my brother looked the same but wasn't the same person inside. His journey through the mental health system was different to mine as he took the 'emergency' route in (I'll not go into detail but just to say witnessing the lows that someone can go to is eye opening). Time inside a secure unit and quite drastic treatment has brought him back to his 'normal' self.
As I said before, I dealt with some of my issues by meditating, my mind was such a busy place from the minute I woke to the time I went to sleep. I found with meditation I was able to just note my negative thoughts and let them go (a concept Id struggled with for years) but with daily meditation I have been able to let a lot go and free space for more positive thoughts. Some simple situations can still be difficult and I do go into panic mode (still working on those) but others Ive seen positive results. I had to have root canal treatment, I had no idea what was involved before I went (just aswell I didnt google it). I used my meditation and was so relaxed I fell asleep. The dentist said he'd never seen anyone fall asleep whilst having root canal treatment. I was actually snoring apparently. Ive used it for mri's too when up until a few years ago that would have been very difficult for me.If anyone is interested in the meditation I follow, maybe best to PM me (Im not sure forum rules allow me to promote it).
Some truly amazing and very emotional stories guys, really appreciate you sharing.
My brother had a terrible time and we had no idea as he hid it so well. People say to me, surely you'd know, but you dont, we are good at keeping it inside. If you were to meet him, you wouldn't think anything would trouble him, He is 6.4, heavily tattooed, piercings, big biker guy. But a few years ago he was a completely different person, he became just a shell, my brother looked the same but wasn't the same person inside. His journey through the mental health system was different to mine as he took the 'emergency' route in (I'll not go into detail but just to say witnessing the lows that someone can go to is eye opening). Time inside a secure unit and quite drastic treatment has brought him back to his 'normal' self.
As I said before, I dealt with some of my issues by meditating, my mind was such a busy place from the minute I woke to the time I went to sleep. I found with meditation I was able to just note my negative thoughts and let them go (a concept Id struggled with for years) but with daily meditation I have been able to let a lot go and free space for more positive thoughts. Some simple situations can still be difficult and I do go into panic mode (still working on those) but others Ive seen positive results. I had to have root canal treatment, I had no idea what was involved before I went (just aswell I didnt google it). I used my meditation and was so relaxed I fell asleep. The dentist said he'd never seen anyone fall asleep whilst having root canal treatment. I was actually snoring apparently. Ive used it for mri's too when up until a few years ago that would have been very difficult for me.If anyone is interested in the meditation I follow, maybe best to PM me (Im not sure forum rules allow me to promote it).
Some truly amazing and very emotional stories guys, really appreciate you sharing.
Bellow
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
That's one hell of time you've had John - good to see you come through it.
Picked out the above as I want to add a comment.
I've never had CBT but am aware of its origins - NLP (neuro linguistic programming). Very simplistically it deals with taking charge of your 'inner dialogue' - the voice in your head that is the running commentary of your life. What goes on there can have profound effects and small changes can bring massive benefits.
A variation on the theme is phrases that can bring us back to sense. A useful one a friend imparted to me is useful for those who, with the prospect of some event or other (which may or may not happen) then extrapolate all sorts of ensuing crises emanating from it and drag themselves into a vortex of panic in the process - just stop. And say 'hasn't actually happened'. Try it - the effect is way beyond the three simple words.
There are lots more little expressions (we all have them anyway) but some have use way beyond what may be imagined. Taking control over that voice in our heads is important. Our unconscious mind hears all of it, stores it, and looks for opportunities to make real what interests that voice. 'Be careful what you wish for' summarises it reasonably well. Self fulfilling prophecy is its realisation.
Picked out the above as I want to add a comment.
I've never had CBT but am aware of its origins - NLP (neuro linguistic programming). Very simplistically it deals with taking charge of your 'inner dialogue' - the voice in your head that is the running commentary of your life. What goes on there can have profound effects and small changes can bring massive benefits.
A variation on the theme is phrases that can bring us back to sense. A useful one a friend imparted to me is useful for those who, with the prospect of some event or other (which may or may not happen) then extrapolate all sorts of ensuing crises emanating from it and drag themselves into a vortex of panic in the process - just stop. And say 'hasn't actually happened'. Try it - the effect is way beyond the three simple words.
There are lots more little expressions (we all have them anyway) but some have use way beyond what may be imagined. Taking control over that voice in our heads is important. Our unconscious mind hears all of it, stores it, and looks for opportunities to make real what interests that voice. 'Be careful what you wish for' summarises it reasonably well. Self fulfilling prophecy is its realisation.
Bellow
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
I saw you mention this earlier and wasn't sure if it was a typo for 'medication' - thankfully not.
It's heartening to see kids now being taught the rudiments (simple breathing exercises) in school now under the guise of 'wellness'. This I think in decades to come will greatly improve the quality of life in this country.
For anyone who hasn't tried (even simple breathing exercises) the calming effects are extraordinary - way beyond what could be imagined. The craziness is that we are merely (when we engage with it) returning to a state we knew when we were very very young but forgot as we approached adulthood. It being kept alive in school kids will (IMO) benefit us all. And, it's never too late to get stuck in.
Missy D: I can't see why there would be objections to you posting more about this if you want to. The worst that can happen is a mod deleting it I'd guess. Your call IMO.
The meditation I follow is Meditation and Sleep Made Simple - Headspace. You can access certain areas of it for free or subscribe to get more options. Ive used it for over 2 years now, and worked through the different specific area sessions and now do the daily meditation. There are other meditation apps but I found this one worked for me. I also do self hypnosis.
I think its always good to hear what others use to help.
I think its always good to hear what others use to help.
Light-headedness / dizzy spells are a classic in my experience. Lost count of the number of times I had them in the worst periods. They are just before the vertigo in my experience.
For me, and probably others, understanding what the hell is going on, and what is or isn't wrong, is immensely useful. Maybe that comes from having a technical brain but you can deal with something a lot better knowing what it is.
Absolutely... it didn't take much to push me over into a panic. I'd often have to leave the room and go outside at home, wherever I was, just to get some air and try to calm down.
I'm sure most people who meet / have met me would be surprised to learn of my previous experience as I don't appear to be the sensitive caring type!
If I told them I once spent an evening anxious as anything throughout a tribute London show for a rock band, they'd probably piss themselves laughing.
I'd have done the same prior to experiencing it.
Cheers.
It's interesting on that "hasn't actually happened" because in looking into this sort of stuff, that's one thing I've picked up previously.
If someone cut me up in the car previously, I did used to get rather unhappy about it and they would know about it.
Telling yourself nothing actually happened as a result of being cut up, that no one got hurt and normal service is resumed - is a way out of it.
It does work.
Except the cause of the anxiety in my case was the supplements and no amount of telling myself anything changed anything. I just had to wait for it to pass.
But I can see how using the part of your brain to state "hasn't actually happened" followed up by nothing happening, because usually of course it won't, you would start to believe it.
We started using this a couple of years ago too for relaxation and to help switch off a busy mind to sleep.
Recommend it and they cover a lot of stuff.
Can't see it as any different to recommending a non-sponsoring inde for servicing...
What strikes me about this thread is the number of posters who have suffered from anxiety in one form or another and are prepared to talk about their experiences on an anonymous bb, albeit some of you may know one another.
It goes to show you that these thoughts and feelings are not unique to one another but are in fact felt by the majority of people at some point in their lifetime. Anxiety is thus normalised and it is ok to feel this way.
In this day and age it’s good to talk about your thoughts and feelings because there is so much information and help out there. Its also reassuring to realise that you are not alone.
In my youth anxiety was never discussed and on many occasion felt very alone and isolated because I felt as though there must be something wrong with me to keep having negative thoughts and feelings, which as an adult I learnt to hide.
The message I take away from this thread is it’s good to talk. It is important to find someone who has personal experience of anxiety to understand your thought process, whether this is a friend or professional therapist.
Don’t forget just about everybody in the US has a therapist.
Best wishes to all.
It goes to show you that these thoughts and feelings are not unique to one another but are in fact felt by the majority of people at some point in their lifetime. Anxiety is thus normalised and it is ok to feel this way.
In this day and age it’s good to talk about your thoughts and feelings because there is so much information and help out there. Its also reassuring to realise that you are not alone.
In my youth anxiety was never discussed and on many occasion felt very alone and isolated because I felt as though there must be something wrong with me to keep having negative thoughts and feelings, which as an adult I learnt to hide.
The message I take away from this thread is it’s good to talk. It is important to find someone who has personal experience of anxiety to understand your thought process, whether this is a friend or professional therapist.
Don’t forget just about everybody in the US has a therapist.
Best wishes to all.
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I’m another sufferer. I can’t add much to the fantastic posts that have been made already. I’ve been on various meds, CBT and all sorts. As said, once you admit you have an issue, you are half way there. I have found a happy place now through talking and getting professional help. One link to MBClub is that I bought my CLK as a reward when I finally came out of the dark. I was at a penultimate session with a counsellor who said I was ready to be discharged. She asked me ‘what would you love to do if you could do anything in the next month?’ I paused and told her that I’d always wanted a Mercedes convertible. We had talked endlessly about my fear of spending money on anything that wasn’t strictly essential even though I had a well paid job. I had an irrational fear of ever treating myself or doing anything beyond basic living (stemmed from a f&&&ed up childhood as it turns out). It was irrational in the extreme. So I went out and bought the CLK! Went to my next session and told the counsellor. She was amazed (and pleased) as I would NEVER have done that before treatment.
Everyone can be helped if you ask and are open to assistance! Best of luck!
Everyone can be helped if you ask and are open to assistance! Best of luck!
My journey to Mercedes was similar @Eddy77. The marriage I was in wasn't a good one (could have a whole different thread on that!) And I wasn't allowed alot of things for myself. I'd always wanted a Mercedes, didn't matter which one tbh it would have just been something for me. So when I was finally divorced I went to the local car dealers and asked if he could get me a Mercedes . As I said it didn't matter which one, so when he called a few days later to say he had found one , I was so excited. I saw it had a test drive . That was funny because when I got in I said where's the handbrake? He said you you've never driven a Mercedes then. I loved it and bought it and then found my way to you guys and haven't looked back.
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Edited ... this was the 124
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I still haven't phoned EAP (who offer some free CBT sessions), I just don't feel like they can help me. I already know what is wrong with me, and why I think things the way I do, and I know what I've done and how I've acted. I wish things were different and could go back and change it, but that's about coming to terms with loss rather than how to move forward? Maybe the answer is to go and buy another Mercedes!
If the CBT is free what have you got to lose? it's not going to hurt or put you back in anyway,
I didn't think it would help me which on the whole it didn't, "everyone is different", but i did learn alittle and learnt certain aspects which help from it.
I didn't think it would help me which on the whole it didn't, "everyone is different", but i did learn alittle and learnt certain aspects which help from it.
I hate talking on the phone, especially when I don't know what to expect. I tried emailing EAP but they said I have to phone them for initial assessment.
I was exactly the same, TBh i broke down during the assessment, But the Lady on the other end was absolutely lovely, professional and non judgemental she just listened then moved onto the next question.
Then they decided which form of CBT would work best for me, i did my CBT all over the Internet. But there are various forms of it you can do.
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By the time I got help I’d already messed up one marriage due to this problem. Luckily I found an amazing second wife and she has been a rock. Happily married eight years now. The destructive power of mental health issues is huge. To the OP....don’t be afraid to ask for help and don’t be afraid to try something you think may be a waste of time. You never know what might help. Whatever you are feeling and whatever you say, an expert in the field will have heard it before. So give it a go. Don’t suffer alone.
I tried buying an AMG in part to expand my hobby (cars) but it's merely a distraction and it doesn't fix the underlying causes.
That's what I found anyway.
When I reached my lowest point in 2012, I was so desperate to sort out the causes that I would have tried most things regardless of what they were.
I can understand why anyone would not want to a look a fool of course... but you have to accept you are not well, and all that entails first, before you can fix anything I think.
People on the end of a phone line offering counselling will do this kind of thing day in and day out.
Professional counsellors are not there to pass judgement - they do it to help other people to get better.
If you broke your leg badly, you wouldn't walk yourself into A&E like nothing was wrong to save face...
The alternative to not pursuing all avenues is carrying on as you are now. And whilst I was too stubborn to accept how I was back then for the rest of my life, as I look back now I thank god I did all I could to solve it even though some things didn't work.
Keep an open mind, grit your teeth together and take a leap of faith... ask yourself what is the absolute worse that can happen - at every turn...
That's what I found anyway.
When I reached my lowest point in 2012, I was so desperate to sort out the causes that I would have tried most things regardless of what they were.
I can understand why anyone would not want to a look a fool of course... but you have to accept you are not well, and all that entails first, before you can fix anything I think.
People on the end of a phone line offering counselling will do this kind of thing day in and day out.
Professional counsellors are not there to pass judgement - they do it to help other people to get better.
If you broke your leg badly, you wouldn't walk yourself into A&E like nothing was wrong to save face...
The alternative to not pursuing all avenues is carrying on as you are now. And whilst I was too stubborn to accept how I was back then for the rest of my life, as I look back now I thank god I did all I could to solve it even though some things didn't work.
Keep an open mind, grit your teeth together and take a leap of faith... ask yourself what is the absolute worse that can happen - at every turn...