Another mobile speed camera being introduced.

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We are using statistics to prove our case but like Darrell has just suggested, do we know what they mean when they refer to 'speed'?

Examples
You are travelling along a country road and as usual, at certain times of the day, farmer Blogs is moving his cows. This road has a speed limit of 60mph and our friendly Mercedes driver negotiates a bend at 40mph when ker-splatt, liver chops for dinner. He has ploughed into those cows, killed a few and he has been taken to hospital just for a quick check-up. Statistic records this as a serious injury road traffic accident where speed is a causation.

Poor Mercedes driver gets a new car as the other one has been wrote-off, this time he is in the centre lane of a busy roundabout, this roundabout is situated on a de-restricted dual carriageway and as he negotiates this roundabout at 30mph, he hits some diesel and poof!! He rams the car in the nearside lane. One driver is again taken to hospital for a check-up as they have a pace-maker and the ambulance crew want this person just to be checked over. Yup, another 'serious' injury road traffic accident and again speed will be a causation.

It is not our Mercedes drivers day because they are now driving on a motorway in heavy rain. Our driver is perhaps not cautious enough as they have 30" :) low profile wheels and yup there is a very shallow puddle and because they have these wide tyres, everything goes quiet as they aquaplane, go broadside and roll-over. Yup even though they wore a set-belt, the air-bags did there trick, off they went to the hospital for a quick check-over. yup yet another serious injury road traffic accident and once more speed is a caustion.

I have not mentioned fog or that dreaded undertaker but hopefully folks are getting the message? Speed is being blamed but no car is breaking any speed limit!! Yup, I love statistic :eek: :eek:

Local authorities will use these statistics to justify the siting of speed cameras even though no speed limits were exceeded. To me I still want more average speed cameras outside our schools and at locations where shops are next to busy roads and yes, make sure they only work when these venues are open.

Another quick moan
Near where we live we have a very large roundabout with each junction controlled by traffic lights. No complaint about that but........

This is an open roundabout where a driver can see every junction and every car on that roundabout. I have personally witnessed a car driver being booked for going through a red light at that roundabout at 3am in the morning. The only other vehicle in the vicinity was an unmarked police car behind the offender!! I am not sure but I think these junctions might now have cameras that catch these offenders. During the day when the road is busy, hammer those drivers that drive through a red light but why not switch off these traffic lights during set periods?

If I stand for school idiot and ten folks including me are entitled to vote but I am the only person who voted and I obviously nominate myself.🤓🤓 Can I say I won with an overwhelming majority? Only one person voted out of the ten that could but did I get 100% of the votes that were cast? Never in the history of democracy has anyone ever get such a statistic.

Apologies for my daft post but I've been awake all night and am still in a degree of discomfort :(
Hope you feel better.
 
So much for the myth that these cameras are meant to me placed at accident black spots. 😤

This:

Speed cameras that generate revenue are not a 'cost'... improving A and B roads, is.

True, but if you look at the lists of 'most profitable' speed cameras (disclaimer - I haven't gone and stood by each one with a notepad for 12 months, so I'm only going by published data :doh: ) a surprisingly high proportion of them are actually in 30 and 40 mph zones where presumably there is a real safety benefit. I still believe that putting profit-making (or at worst 'cost neutral') cameras on motorways (where there is little scope for reducing death/injury rates) is an abuse of a valuable tool for improving road safety, which seriously damages public perception/acceptance of them.

Going off at a slight tangent, I've never understood why red light cameras haven't taken off in the way that speed cameras have. The cost of including a couple in major junction builds/rebuilds must surely be negligible yet I'm not aware of this happening nowadays ... all the ones I see have been there for years (or even decades). Empirically you would expect people running red lights to be a significant cause of injury accidents, but maybe this isn't really the case? I don't think I've ever seen any data on this.
 
I realise that I’m throwing myself open for further criticism/abuse from someone who has so far only visited this thread to complain about some of the posts whilst making no material contribution himself, but I’m going to quote some “gumph from the internet” that apparently comes from other children.

Something I’d never considered before but is an extremely valid point is this:
I still believe that putting profit-making (or at worst 'cost neutral') cameras on motorways (where there is little scope for reducing death/injury rates) is an abuse of a valuable tool for improving road safety, which seriously damages public perception/acceptance of them.
OK, I appreciate that it’s not something I know about and just something I read on the Internet, but it seems logical that what appears to be unnecessary and overused will not be viewed kindly. In fact I can understand why it could even have an effect that’s opposite to what it was intended to achieve. An annoyed motorist is a dangerous motorist.

When deciding to install those antagonistic “safety cameras”, I‘m unwilling to accept the common belief that they’re just erected as money makers. But I have to agree with what one of my other classmates said:
I hate to throw a spanner in the works of folks that love statistics, and yes I hate them... here I go, 'They make liars out of experts and experts out of liars'
I happen to like statistics, but hate the way they’re so often misused, whether intentionally or not. I’m as guilty as most others of this, but I try to make a point of not relying on available statistics alone when making important decisions. There use can be invaluable as part of a decision, but not the sole contributor. (Using them here to support my argument is perfectly fine in my opinion ;) ) Having seen for myself (so I’m allowed to say this) how local authorities can make ridiculous decisions based on statistics, it sounds to me perfectly plausible that many speed cameras get placed with just as little structured thought.
 
Do any of you know if what you’re quoting is correct? Or do you think it’s correct because you read it online?
Greece has had only 3003 deaths and 115000 cases. They are in full lockdown until the first week in January.
In Skiathos where I lived there have been zero deaths or cases.
How do you know what you’re quoting is correct? I hope it wasn’t something you read online ;)
 
I may well be coming across as anti speed camera but I honestly believe they have a place for making our highways safer for everyone. My thoughts however that over time, those responsible for locating them MIGHT have lost their way.

Is the camera designed to make our roads safer? If the answer is 'Yes' then should they be seen to be seen? In other words, make them LOUD and make them proud. make them stand out so that all drivers are aware of their presence and should the great majority be average speed cameras that will stop locals from brakaing just before the camera and then taking off like a scolded cat after that camera. Have one part of an average speed camera set up at the beginning of a village with no footpaths and have the second camera on leaving the village. job done and we can all think of betyter examples.

Now back to me in my role of criticising speed cameras and average speed cameras :) oops

This first picture shows the beginning of a dual carriageway in a rural-ish area with no hazards, no pedestrians and is the main route from torquay to Exeter and as we can see it has average speed cameras set for FIFTY MILES A CHUFFING HOUR!!!!!! seriously. Why you might ask :dk::dk::dk: Answers on a postcard and I will blab shortly

Picture a.jpg Now hopefully we will come to picture two. This is the same road but if gives us all a better view of all the hazards on this dual carriageway that warrants this ludicrous 50mph limit.

Picture b.jpgThat small red cross bottom right is where the warning is for the speed cameras. the upper left red lines denote a narrow country lane with the national limit of 60mph!! Yup, you cannot make this up.

Now let's look at the postcards from folks who have guessed why that 50mph speed limit on a very nice, very safe dual carriageway.

Are you sitting comfortably? Is it because as we have been told due to the amount of accidents?? good point and well considered but Nope...

Are we ready?? The road is considered to be too noisey and tyre noise can disturb residents!!!!!! Yup just look at all those houses that are way too close to that dual carriageway. Who here suggested planting bushes, or trees to improve our carbon footprint or perhaps deaden traffic noise.

It is however a good location for catching speeding motorists who can all see the signs and I guess they are not paying attention to their driving but is this the correct use for speed cameras?
 
I may well be coming across as anti speed camera but I honestly believe they have a place for making our highways safer for everyone. My thoughts however that over time, those responsible for locating them MIGHT have lost their way.

Is the camera designed to make our roads safer? If the answer is 'Yes' then should they be seen to be seen? In other words, make them LOUD and make them proud. make them stand out so that all drivers are aware of their presence and should the great majority be average speed cameras that will stop locals from brakaing just before the camera and then taking off like a scolded cat after that camera. Have one part of an average speed camera set up at the beginning of a village with no footpaths and have the second camera on leaving the village. job done and we can all think of betyter examples.

Now back to me in my role of criticising speed cameras and average speed cameras :) oops

This first picture shows the beginning of a dual carriageway in a rural-ish area with no hazards, no pedestrians and is the main route from torquay to Exeter and as we can see it has average speed cameras set for FIFTY MILES A CHUFFING HOUR!!!!!! seriously. Why you might ask :dk::dk::dk: Answers on a postcard and I will blab shortly

View attachment 105886 Now hopefully we will come to picture two. This is the same road but if gives us all a better view of all the hazards on this dual carriageway that warrants this ludicrous 50mph limit.

View attachment 105887That small red cross bottom right is where the warning is for the speed cameras. the upper left red lines denote a narrow country lane with the national limit of 60mph!! Yup, you cannot make this up.

Now let's look at the postcards from folks who have guessed why that 50mph speed limit on a very nice, very safe dual carriageway.

Are you sitting comfortably? Is it because as we have been told due to the amount of accidents?? good point and well considered but Nope...

Are we ready?? The road is considered to be too noisey and tyre noise can disturb residents!!!!!! Yup just look at all those houses that are way too close to that dual carriageway. Who here suggested planting bushes, or trees to improve our carbon footprint or perhaps deaden traffic noise.

It is however a good location for catching speeding motorists who can all see the signs and I guess they are not paying attention to their driving but is this the correct use for speed cameras?
As someone who absolutely hates those drivers who travel along 60mph roads at 45, then pass through 30mph villages at 45, I’m with you on this one. BUT (there’s always a but isn’t there) if said village has sharp bends, roundabouts and other places that necessitate even the fastest driver slowing considerably or even stopping, average speed cameras don’t catch the ones going too fast elsewhere. I don’t know what the answer is though.

My postcard re the average speed cameras on the A380 would have been a complete guess along the lines of something about the road being extremely busy during the summer months, with visitors too busy looking at their phones/sat navs checking on their holiday destination. You possibly heard me laughing whilst shaking my head at the real reason. Does the local councillor live in that noise shattered village?
 
Is that the best you can do? Trawl through my previous posts to catch me out. :rolleyes:

You can tell who the retired members are here!! ;)
Well worth the effort :D

You can tell who the workers are here who spend too much time on their phones!! ;)
 
Don't you feel more comfortable knowing that cars won't be speeding when they drive through your village?

BTW, personally, when driving through a village, I always make a point of slowing down to the speed limit (typically 30) and watching my speed carefully regardless of any cameras, simply as an act of respect to the locals whose village I am driving through.
I do feel more comfortable with it there yes, but (there's alway a but) it has very little effect as many drivers just slow down on approach the the bend then once past the camera they floor it through the rest of the village. @markjay is always welcome to our village. :)

The worst are the convoys of HGV's that thunder through the village during the night (Mobile cameras don't work nights) when the A75 is closed for maintenance. no immediate danger to most but by god they dinny half shake the house!
 
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As someone who absolutely hates those drivers who travel along 60mph roads at 45, then pass through 30mph villages at 45, I’m with you on this one. BUT (there’s always a but isn’t there) if said village has sharp bends, roundabouts and other places that necessitate even the fastest driver slowing considerably or even stopping, average speed cameras don’t catch the ones going too fast elsewhere. I don’t know what the answer is though.

My postcard re the average speed cameras on the A380 would have been a complete guess along the lines of something about the road being extremely busy during the summer months, with visitors too busy looking at their phones/sat navs checking on their holiday destination. You possibly heard me laughing whilst shaking my head at the real reason. Does the local councillor live in that noise shattered village?
Definitely take your point regarding villages with sharp bends, roundabouts etc. But be blowed if I would roll over and not try to reduce speeds where the public is vulnerable.

Good point about summer traffic although ice cream sellers used to do a good trade walking along the congested dual carriageway, but that was in the days when we had those beautiful sunny days for weeks on end :) :)

Far be it for me to confirm or deny that a local councillor may or may not have been involved in that speed reduction decision but 50mph on that excellent, safe road??

I do feel for home-owners who are victims of undue road-noise , speed cameras will not solve that problem but trees, shrubs or hedgerows will
 
I do feel more comfortable with it there yes, but (there's alway a but) it has very little effect as many drivers just slow down on approach the the bend then once past the camera they floor it through the rest of the village. @markjay is always welcome to our village. :)

The worst are the convoys of HGV's that thunder through the village during the night (Mobile cameras don't work nights) when the A75 is closed for maintenance. no immediate danger to most but by god they dinny half shake the house!
Mrs Ant probably thought it was you making the earth move for her ;)
 

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