antifrezze change on 190e

[48 TG]

hi all im new to forum my dad owns a 1991 190e 2.0l with 50k on clock,
i would like to change the antifrezze as this has never been done. also i have read on the net that you should only use mb antifrezze as it has a special formula in it is this true? and could anyone tell me procedure on how to change the antifreeze.

many thanks
tony

 

[Will]

Hi Tony,

MB Antifreeze isn't that expensive so I'd consider using that if your parts dealer is local.

Make sure to dilute it with distilled water and drain the block as well as the radiator.

There's a (22mm?) drain plug on the block, just below the exhaust manifold near the back. On the radiator, there's a small drain off point with a plastic tap on it.

Drain both, then ideally flush out with plain water before refilling with antifreeze and distilled water.

Will

 

[219]

By all means use MB antifreeze if you want to .

However , any antifreeze 'which meets MB spec' will be fine .

I always used Bluecol without any problems . Lately it has been harder to find in the shops and I have used Halfords Advanced Coolant instead - with no I'll effects .

This has been on a wide range of MB cars , ranging from the 1950's up to the 1980's and including two 190's .

If you are lucky enough to live in Scotland , you don't need distilled water - our tap water is fine . If you live in the chalky-hilled south and have problems with limescale , then distilled water is a must .

 

[Will]

For the relatively low cost involved, it's probably worth considering distilled water.

All tap water contains quite a lot of impurities, and having seen the significant damage that can be caused by poor coolant quality it's money well spent for peace of mind IMHO.

M102 8-valves seem to suffer quite a lot of head gasket failures, seemingly due to blocked water passages in the head/block.

http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/engine/82861-lack-coolant-changes.html

Distilled water and MB coolant is far cheaper than a replacement cylinder head - for a 50k mile example it's money well spent IMHO

Will

 

[48 TG]

hi will thanks for reply just looking at pics of your merc nice job you done.
do i need to warm the car up before i drain water out. also is it nessary to drain the water out of block.?

how would you flush the system?
and when you fill up do i need to bleed or anything for air blocks?
it says in handbook i need 4.25liters of antifreeze?

regards
tony

 

[219]

I have recently used Halfords two part flushing solution .

Heater controls set to HOT throughout to ensure heater gets flushed out too !

Drain down system , flush through every which way with garden hose until water runs clear .

Refill with first bottle plus water and run up to temperature as per instructions .

Drain down and rinse thoroughly again as above .

Refill once more with anti-reagent and run to temperature .

Final drain down and rinse through

Refill with new coolant , run up to high-ish revs to bleed air out of system . Check heater blowing toasty-hot air when finished .

 

[Scott_F]

If the coolant has never been changed then I would seriously consider removing the radiator and doing a reverse flush by pumping water through the aperture for the bottom hose and letting it flow out through the aperture for the top hose.

As well as clearing out rust and sediment from the very bottom of the radiator it will also give you an opportunity to thoroughly inspect the condition of the 20 year old radiator and to decide whether it needs replacing before new coolant goes into the car.

 

[lupi]

hi, tony,will and pontoneer,

All your comments are correct, but i wish to add something to these
posts, MB coolant is Okay, but you have to ask dealer for the coolant
which is suitable for your model, nowadays there are different types of coolant
and as far as i know they cannot be mixed with each other.
Tony you do not need to warm up the engine to drain the coolant ( if temp.is more then zero cent. cellsus) and yes it will be better to take out the drain bolt at
the engine block,but if you suspect the drain bolt is not healty enought,it`s better not to disturb it,there is another way you can go round it; will will need to flash the system several times with plain water preferable distilled or pure water from a well,
for the first flash,there are products on the market which you can use with the water. Remember to put the car`s heater controlls to the maximum before doing the job, this is needed to flash also the heater unit.
To flash the engine you will need to run the engine so that the water circulates
the system.
Regarding the final coolant refill, as far as I know there is no bleeder screw,so fill up
the system slowly until the correct level in the expansion tank is reached, usual while doing this I press/pump one of the rubber hoses which is fitted to the radiator to push the air out, but even so you will need to run the car for a few miles until you get the normal running temp.,put in garage and check again the level the next Morning before start up, which is most probably short, put in some more coolant to get correct level.
Usually I check for the second time, after another run,which most prob.will
be correct.

That`s a long story guys, buy I explain this way because from the threadstarter, I recon. this is the only way to give a full explaination, Tony needed full explaination.

Thanks for reading.

Lupi.

 

[Will]

Best bet for the OP is to just use MB coolant and distilled water, IMHO

If the cooling system is furred up and needs a flush, use citric acid - it will descale as required, and is used as an approved MB service product. Flush well afterwards, as you'd expect.

It is vital to drain the block as most of the sediment/sludge accumulates here. The radiator only holds about half of the coolant anyway, just remove the drain plug on the engine block - no problems

Will

 

[48 TG]

thanks lupi and pointer for coments as regards to reverse flush im not that advanced to do that. when im flushing rad should i leave the plug holes open and run a hose direct to the expansion tank while engine is running? with the water on or do i do it with enging of.

 

[48 TG]

If the coolant has never been changed then I would seriously consider removing the radiator and doing a reverse flush by pumping water through the aperture for the bottom hose and letting it flow out through the aperture for the top hose.

As well as clearing out rust and sediment from the very bottom of the radiator it will also give you an opportunity to thoroughly inspect the condition of the 20 year old radiator and to decide whether it needs replacing before new coolant goes into the car.

scott how would i do this and is it easy to do.?

 

[Scott_F]

scott how would i do this and is it easy to do.?

I've not done this job on a W201 but have done it on various other cars and it is pretty straightforward.

The top, bottom and expansion tank hoses will all need to be disconnected. They are probably held on by jubilee clips although the last time I did this job on a Vauxhall the hoses were held on by spring clips that were a bit of a pain to squeeze and open. Also disconnect the wiring to the fan and the temperature sensor.

The radiator will probably be held in place by a couple of brackets at the top which should be easy to remove. Unfasten these after the hoses have been disconnected if you can as it is easier to wiggle the hoses free when the radiator is still held firmly in situ.

The radiator should then lift out - ensure you don't damage it as you do so. Turn it upside down and run the hosepipe through the bottom hose aperture until it runs nice and clear. If you are in any doubt as to the condition of the radiator (damaged cooling fins, rusty areas etc) then now is the time to replace it.

 

[Will]

To remove the radiator on a W201 190E is really quite easy.

Drain coolant from the radiator by undoing the drain tap located on the bottom (usually red plastic). You can fit a hose to the drain off point to collect the old coolant.

Once drained, disconnect the top and bottom hoses by undoing the hose clips and carefully pulling the hoses off.

If the car has an automatic gearbox, you'll need to undo the two pipes that go to and from the gearbox fluid cooler that is part of the radiator itself. Cap off the two hoses to prevent dirt entering and excess fluid being lost. You'll obviously need to drain the ATF from the rad too (not a lot, but you'll need to top up and check the level again afterwards )

Remove the metal spring clips (x2) securing the fan shroud to the radiator and lift it out of the way (rest it over the cooling fan)

Remove the plastic rivet-screws that secure the radiator to the plastic panels on either side (x4 IIRC, cross head)

Remove the other two metal spring clips securing the radiator to the slam panel.

The radiator should now be drained, disconnected and will just lift upwards. It sits on two rubber bushes at the bottom.

Refitting it the reversal of removal

Having said that, you'll find that an awful lot more sediment will be apparant by draining the block - you really must do that as well

I would consider replacing the thermostat housing if it still has the original plastic type fitted. They become brittle with age and the new MB-supplied part is made of alloy to overcome this problem

Will

 

[48 TG]

thanks for that scott will try it.

 

[alabbasi]

Any Antifreeze that uses G05 chemistry is fine MB recommends a citric acid flush.

 

[48 TG]

To remove the radiator on a W201 190E is really quite easy.

Drain coolant from the radiator by undoing the drain tap located on the bottom (usually red plastic). You can fit a hose to the drain off point to collect the old coolant.

Once drained, disconnect the top and bottom hoses by undoing the hose clips and carefully pulling the hoses off.

If the car has an automatic gearbox, you'll need to undo the two pipes that go to and from the gearbox fluid cooler that is part of the radiator itself. Cap off the two hoses to prevent dirt entering and excess fluid being lost. You'll obviously need to drain the ATF from the rad too (not a lot, but you'll need to top up and check the level again afterwards )

Remove the metal spring clips (x2) securing the fan shroud to the radiator and lift it out of the way (rest it over the cooling fan)

Remove the plastic rivet-screws that secure the radiator to the plastic panels on either side (x4 IIRC, cross head)

Remove the other two metal spring clips securing the radiator to the slam panel.

The radiator should now be drained, disconnected and will just lift upwards. It sits on two rubber bushes at the bottom.

Refitting it the reversal of removal

Having said that, you'll find that an awful lot more sediment will be apparant by draining the block - you really must do that as well

I would consider replacing the thermostat housing if it still has the original plastic type fitted. They become brittle with age and the new MB-supplied part is made of alloy to overcome this problem

Will

hi will whats the procedure with the citric acid flush how its done ? going to get the bits tommorow from mb and attempt to have a go at weekend.

 

[Will]

Drain cooling system, flush out with plain water, fill with water and citric acid mixture, run up to temperature, drain and flush a few times with water again.

Once all flushed out, refill with coolant and distilled water (or clean/soft/de-ionized/RO water )

 

[219]

Citric acid or any proprietary flushing solution such as Radflush basically involve draining down the system , rinsing through under pressure with the garden hose inserted into any of the hoses and run until only clean water comes out ( do this in as many different directions as possible , disconnecting only one hose at a time to force the water through the entire system in as many directions as possible ) . Once the system is thoroughly flushed out under pressure - reconnect all hoses , add the flushing solution and top off with water until the system is full - then run the car up to temperature - take it for a drive to get it fully heated up - refer to the instructions with the flushing solution as to how long you can leave it in there as some are corrosive ( intentionally to dissolve rust particles etc lurking in the system ) and don't leave it in there any longer than stated . Some flush solutions , such as the Halfords two part one I use have a reagent and an anti-reagent which MUST be put in afterwards to neutralise the first solution . As always , follow the instructions on the bottle(s) to the letter and you will be fine . Rinse through thoroughly between each stage with the garden hose .

At the end , add a small quantity of water , then the correct amount of anti-freeze , topping up with water . While doing the final fill up , run the engine to circulate water round the system - this will also pump air out - squeeze the top radiator hose during this process and you will see excess air bubbling back into the reservoir tank - only fit the pressure cap to the reservoir after the correct level is maintained and no more water can be added . Check that the heater is blowing hot air to confirm water is circulating properly . With the car warmed up , take it for a brief run , keep an eye on the temperature gauge which should read normal ( if it rises high , stop immediately and check for leaks ) . All being well , on return lift the bonnet and check all hose connections for leaks - DO NOT RELEASE THE PRESSURE CAP WHEN THE ENGINE IS HOT - RISK OF SCALDING ! . If the level has dropped , wait a while until the engine has cooled before opening the cap to add more water . Keep an eye on coolant level for a few days until satisfied it is stable .

Before starting this job , inspect all hoses for cracks or leaks , the time to replace any suspect hoses is BEFORE you start this job , not afterwards .

Good luck , it is not that hard a job , and quite a satisfying one to do .

BTW , if you don't already have a copy , and are just starting out on DIY maintenance , there is a Haynes manual for the 190 which covers this and lots of other common jobs in some detail . Most branches of Halfords stock it and you would probably find it very handy .

 

[48 TG]

thanks very much derek for your help i will atempt doin this at weekend and let you know how i got on.

 

[48 TG]

Drain cooling system, flush out with plain water, fill with water and citric acid mixture, run up to temperature, drain and flush a few times with water again.

Once all flushed out, refill with coolant and distilled water (or clean/soft/de-ionized/RO water )

thanks will for your help mite need your help on saturday if your around and i get stuck.

regards

tony