Anyone know what new speed gadget might be?

[db1]

I was driving along today and on the side of a dual carriageway A road was a marked van. I didn't see whether it was Police marked but I think it was.

Interestingly outside, in front of the two rear doors (ie in front of where the cameras would normally be) was a tripod with something mounted on top. It looked to have a flat dark blue glass front, but I didn't get a good look. The doors of the van were not open.

Further down the road was a police car with someone unlucky in front and further still was a police motorcycle on the side of the road.

I thought the vans just took videos and then mail you the NIP. If so, are they now doubling up - ie videos to catch everyone and a laser, motorcycle AND a police car to mop up the rest!

I must say the resources they are putting into trapping cars is unbelievable - can this really be justified??

Anyone have any ideas what this new contraption might be and does anyone know what the minimum speed is that the video vans etc are set - ie is it still the 10%+3mph, which on an A-road would make it 80mph.


DB1

 

[GrahamC230K]

Sounds like APNR?

If I recall correctly Automatic Number Plate Reader.

The van reads your number plate, computer looks you up for any outstandings, lack of road tax or insurance etc.

Operator passes details to BiB further up the road to nick you.

APNR is fine in my book, good idea. Just as long as it doesn't measure your speed!

 

[fgaffney]

Sounds like APNR?
If I recall correctly Automatic Number Plate Reader.
APNR is fine in my book, good idea. Just as long as it doesn't measure your speed!

Automatic Number Plate Recoginition (to be really petty but correct!!!). They also have a growing number of fixed sites for these cameras with The Forth Road Bridge being my closest example.

It's a very clever piece of kit and they not only look out for tax and insurance dodgers but can also very quickly cross refer the number plates viewed with a Central Intelligence Database to see if the vehicle has come to the adverse attention of a number of agencies such as Police, Department Of Transport, Customs & Excise and D.V.L.A.

As well as your Tax and Ins. dodgers they are primarily used to identify/track vehicles known to be used by disqualified drivers or criminals and bogus workmen who travel from one Force area to another to commit crime. If these vehicles can be identified entering a Force area at the earliest opportunity they can stopped and 'checked out' before any intended crimes are committed.

The mobile cameras record the images to the nearby police vehicle and the images from the fixed sites are sent direct to a manned control centre. These cameras are becoming more common... you just have to check the kit on top of the majority of Police traffic cars these days. The white tube thingy with a large black lens normally situated behind the light bar and generally facing backwards is ANPR.

What with the normal video recording capabilities in these vehicles and now ANPR Big Brother is truly watching you!!!

 

[db1]

Interesting, thanks for the update. I support it if it reduces crime - perhaps my skepticism that this is another speed trapping device is misplaced...no doubt they will provide both technologies in one soon!

 

[Richard W]

At a recent Police exhibition (I was exhibiting in a professional capacity and having a nosey at the gadgets) I saw an ML with 3 computers, 5 cameras (inc - 1x ANPR, 2 x IR), uplinks and downlinks (to helicopters and control rooms) a touch screen on the dash to control it all. I asked if this was a demo vehicle for the technology and was told 'no, it's operational, we've borrowed it back from the force, 'cos they've fitted our technology....'

The driver could have all your details (from PNC) on screen within 15 seconds of acquiring your number plate (slower than a dedicated ANPR vehicle) to tell if there was anything outstanding against you.....

BIG BRO is out there!

 

[Plodd]

Anpr

At last a subject I can speak on with some degree of expertise

We have been working with ANPR for more than 3 years now although is seems a lot longer. It checks with DVLA data for untaxed/unregistered vehicles and can be loaded with other types of intelligence data, but unfortunately it CANNOT be used to check insurance.
This is due to the insurance companies who compile and maintain that database not allowing us to use it for speculative searches.

I believe their database could be fed with postcode details and together with DVLA data would fire back a list of uninsured vehicles in that area but as I said they will not allow that. I don't know why you would think it would be in their best interests in the long run.

And just to clear up a small point, the tube thingy on top of the car behind the light bar will be the infrared lamp, the camera is inside the car.

As another small aside this device is one reason the Police will be cracking down on illegal number plates. If the machine can't read 'em that evidence can be used to assist a prosecution. Maximum fine £1000 get done twice and DVLA can withdraw the number and will not pay compensation.

 

[frog1520]

At last a subject I can speak on with some degree of expertise

We have been working with ANPR for more than 3 years now although is seems a lot longer. It checks with DVLA data for untaxed/unregistered vehicles and can be loaded with other types of intelligence data, but unfortunately it CANNOT be used to check insurance.
This is due to the insurance companies who compile and maintain that database not allowing us to use it for speculative searches.

Very interesting! Does anyone know about the IT technology lying behind this? (Type of database, speed of response, type of network connection etc)..

I've also often wondered about the IT behind the automatic speed cameras; especially the ones that determine average speed on the motorway. How many number plates can those things scan? Must be a lot of data being built up somewhere?

 

[Plodd]

Very interesting! Does anyone know about the IT technology lying behind this? (Type of database, speed of response, type of network connection etc)..

Believe it or not our database is updated by CD received from DVLA about every 4 weeks

The other data placed on there is up to us. We can have the entire force intel database of just a few specific vehicles.

As for speed..... it's almost instant, and very accurate.

 

[Tigger]

unfortunately it CANNOT be used to check insurance.
This is due to the insurance companies who compile and maintain that database not allowing us to use it for speculative searches.

Is this for definite?

The only reason I ask is that I was stopped earlier in the year whilst driving a hire car and when I asked why I was stopped, I was told that my number plate had been rung through and it was showing as not having any insurance.

I explained it was a hire car and showed them the docs and was allowed to go on my way.

 

[fgaffney]

Is this for definite?

... when I asked why I was stopped, I was told that my number plate had been rung through and it was showing as not having any insurance.

As well as storing vehicle and keeper details the Police National Computer also stores information on whether a valid insurance certificate exists for the vehicle in question.

It's likely a vehicle check of the hire car was carried out on PNC which subsequently flagged that no insurance details were recorded.

The Insurance details are linked to PNC as unlike ANPR it's a non-speculative check of the vehicle. Something has drawn attention to either the vehicle or it's occupants thus warranting a PNC check be carried out.

Help me out here Plodd....

 

[Plodd]

As well as storing vehicle and keeper details the Police National Computer also stores information on whether a valid insurance certificate exists for the vehicle in question.

It's likely a vehicle check of the hire car was carried out on PNC which subsequently flagged that no insurance details were recorded.

The Insurance details are linked to PNC as unlike ANPR it's a non-speculative check of the vehicle. Something has drawn attention to either the vehicle or it's occupants thus warranting a PNC check be carried out.

Help me out here Plodd....

No help needed mate you appear to know exactly what you are talking about.
Either that or you bluff very well
Well almost, the insurance database is seperate from PNC. We can also now do a roadside check of your driving licence details :bannana:

 

[Sp!ke]

The Insurance details are linked to PNC as unlike ANPR it's a non-speculative check of the vehicle. Something has drawn attention to either the vehicle or it's occupants thus warranting a PNC check be carried out.

Help me out here Plodd....

The *big* flaw in this scheme is that not all insurance companies provide this info yet.....

Its also a shame ANPR is considered speculative though with something as important as insurance , I mean in whose interest is it exactly to not have your vehicle checked for insurance by ANPR ?

what was the latest London stats? 1 in 5 stopped were uninsured - you wouldnt want 3rd party insurance now would you based on those figures.

 

[Sp!ke]

Very interesting! Does anyone know about the IT technology lying behind this? (Type of database, speed of response, type of network connection etc)..

I've also often wondered about the IT behind the automatic speed cameras; especially the ones that determine average speed on the motorway. How many number plates can those things scan? Must be a lot of data being built up somewhere?

Loads of data.

The thing that I find even more strange is that instead of having 1 huge DB, with different levels of access, there is completely different systems all over government all holding massive amounts of data on us all, of which a lot is duplicated accross the databases. no-wonder blunders like the soham case happen.

Think about it, we got at least 1 each for the PNC, NHS, local governments, central governments, intelligence services, DVLA, .... etc etc all based around the same name, DOB and addresses. All that duplicated data???

This kind of data will hopefully be stored on 100TB+ arrays like THESE

 

[gareth_r]

ANPR is just the start. They have also been working on face recognition. Why do you think they want photocard driving licences, id. cards, CCTV everywhere, electronic voting? Driving test fraud, 9/11, crime are the excuses, control is the reason. One day you will wake up in the REAL 1984...

Paranoid? Moi?