Best MB V8 engine? or other

[confusionhunter]

So then.... bit of a hypothetical debate....
IF you had a lightweight mid engined kit car or building one and were inclined to favour an MB engine... What engine would pack the most bang for buck. No electronics involved traction control or ABS, no power steering etc and probably a stand alone ECU. Forget about SVA rules etc....Room for a big engine ....(so V8s win it for me....)

First two obvious answers to me would be the
- M113k 5.5 supercharged V8 ... bings of torque and a smooth power delivery to help things go in a straight line, I know turbos would be more powerful but in a lightweight car steady predictable delivery is probably king.... and so very tuneable with a pulley and map.

- M156 6.3 V8, the noise alone would probably win that one, but also its a revvy engine, if the car is light weight you don't need a massive surge of torque at once and means you probably have to think about it before going quickly.... bit like 4 cylinder bike you need to use the power bands to go uber fast rather than get there by accident like a v twin of the supercharged V8.... bit pricier than the M113k but potentially more reliable?

discuss.... any other contenders..... is the above BS or not... any examples???

 

[Marku]

I would say of course the M117 450 as I have one which I have rebuilt with much sweat and tears. But how about the M100 6.9 not only was it fitted to the W116 but also the legendary 600. The smoothest take off that ever existed.

 

[AMGeed]

I would argue the M113K engine has less known problems than the M156, but both are superb engines. Neither would disappoint, but if its torque you want the M113K wins hands down.
It is also a far easier engine to extract more power relatively inexpensively.

Of course, fans of the later 5.5 and 4.0 V8 biturbo engines will say they are better and they are probably correct if cost was not important.

 

[E55BOF]

M113K every time, but I'm not keen on revvy engines. Bulletproof reliability, huge torque, and a lightweight car with it would be ludicrously fast. So it would with an M156, but as I said, I'm not keen on revvy engines, and the M156 is arguably more likely to give trouble at higher mileages than the 113K.

 

[Petrol Pete]

Look no further than USA V8 'crate' motors for Phat torque , simple lumps (some of them) . Everything from cast iron push rod to £40K race ready. They usually have low power/cc ratio but plenty torque and abysmal fuel consumption.

probably considerably cheaper than anything from Germany...and easier to fettle/fix.

But probably twice the weight ! I think most GT40 replica cars have such an engine, and you don't get more 'lightweight mid engine' than those things.

 

[barclay03]

M113k...mostly because I have one and know how silky smooth and powerful it is lol

 

[grober]

I always had a soft spot for the Yamaha built all alloy 60 degree V8 the B8444S
as used by the Noble M600 developing some 600 horsepower with the aid of 2 turbos.
Volvo B8444S engine - Wikipedia
until I read this
The Dark Side of Volvo's Excellent V8
Mind you I think anyone who washes an engine needs councelling.
here's one I tweaked earlier. https://www.autoblog.com/2013/12/09/volvo-polestar-v8-supercars-engine/#slide-1916186

 

[Deleted member 37751]

The M113K is the best AMG V8 they’ve ever made.

Now we’ve got that out of the way, in a kit car I’d actually go for the M112k supercharged V6 a la C32; exactly the same nature as the ‘55K but lighter and quite easy to get it over 400bhp.

 

[Major774]

Has to be that special K

 

[E55BOF]

Mind you I think anyone who washes an engine needs councelling.

Don't tell them in the OCD - sorry, Detailing - forum...

 

[E55BOF]

The M113K is the best AMG V8 they’ve ever made.

Now we’ve got that out of the way, in a kit car I’d actually go for the M112k supercharged V6 a la C32; exactly the same nature as the ‘55K but lighter and quite easy to get it over 400bhp.

Good point, but it might be a lot harder to find a decent used M112K, and if it needed attention, harder and more expensive
to find the parts as well, than for the 113K.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

IF you had a lightweight mid engined kit car or building one and were inclined to favour an MB engine... What engine would pack the most bang for buck.

Lightweight mid-engined sports car? If it has to be a Mercedes V8 then I would say M156 - or better still M159

I assume RWD?

Personally, I would be looking for naturally aspirated and manual gearbox. Finding a manual gearbox capable of dealing with the power/torque of the M156 would be a challenge, but easier than the forced induction engines. The progressive and predictable power delivery and torque curve would lend itself better to a lightweight application too, making it much more driveable, and possibly quicker/faster in most circumstances.

The torque of the M157 (or M113K) would make it more difficult to get the power down without throttling the engine and removing one of the characteristics of the engine - the torque. That torque is great in a heavy hot rod saloon/estate/SUV, or even a (relatively) heavy sports car, but it might just be too much for a lightweight mid-engines sports car.

 

[alabbasi]

Bob Norwood was setting land speed records in Ferrari's with small block Chevy engines. It's the logical choice as they're cheap, and there are plenty of bolt on performance bits available to get serious power out of them, as well as kits that mate them to a transaxle. There's an old hotter called Jim who rented a shop next to my old one. He had a Fiero with an SBC 355 motor in it that was terrifying. He sold it and now has a Corvair with the same engine and a Corvair pickup truck with a 500CI Cadillac engine.

I just found the video for the pickup here:

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Minor note. M100 engine fitted to the 6.9 was not the same engine as that used in the Grand 600.

 

[WDB124066]

Just in case you didn't want a V8 or V6 try this...

Might be a bit topendy though.

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[WDB124066]

Here is it is in action Sir Dr grober...

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[confusionhunter]

Petrol Pete, You are right very hard to beat the chevy crate motors! So I think the staple V8 to beat is the Chevy Ls3 which is very very hard to beat. You can easily get a reliable 525hp from the 6.2l Alu block and fuel injected.... Still 2v per cylinder and pushrod engine, but if it aint broke dont fix it I suppose! The mega LT4 engine with is the latest corvette engine is also availble and is 650bhp as std! Used in Cobras, Ultimas and T70s etc all favour the LS3 and are ready for em. Because the LS3 is very hard to beat its very popular too (which also means tuning gets easier).
Chevrolet LS3 376/525 V8 Engine | Partsworld Performance

For a laugh I prices a new M156 engine from MB and it came in at £46,500
I thought an MB engine might be a bit special, Becauase all these engines produce up to 500bhp its more about delivery type and the noise than all out power!
The fact the M113k even has a compressor is pretty cool so its got a little advantage there and both engines are relatively cheapish on the 2nd hand market.

E55BOF: I agree torque is awesome but in something thats under a tonne an M156 would feel car more torquey and too much torque would just induce wheelspin easier.... hmmm
Grober.... of to google that engine later!
SPX: Agree logically... but V6s just don't have the same attitude as a V8!
Bobby: RWD The answer here is an old school Porsche G50 911 turbo box mounted upside down with the appropriate. In an under a tone car good for 1000bhp Agree with Everything else you say, the the pull of a 'K' would be strong!

 

[WDB124066]

Flat four Lycoming aircraft engine...?

Nice and light - and low down COG.

lycoming special - Google Search

 

[confusionhunter]

used in the red bull racing planes! something for a superlite, dingle seater!?

 

[WDB124066]

The torque curve is very much on your side too with aero engines, could be a great project if you have the time and engineering ability to do something unique. Not sure what classes you'd qualify for though...?

 

[confusionhunter]

I think it would end up being a 'funny car' that would be a total hoot and very popular at shows etc but not something I'd dare drive to Le Man or such like!!