Big man.

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That sums it up perfectly. There is no justification for this , basta. When I lived in Bavaria ( mid noughties) there was outrage when a bear was hunted down and shot by blood thirsty hunters as it had allegedly escaped from a zoo or circus and posed a threat. Fact was they could have easily tranquillised it. Strange this inner desire to kill things that lurks beneath some people. Let's see how long it is before the Tories find a way to justify hunting again to please and appease certain parties.Same thing as far as I'm concerned and on our doorstep.
 
I do not advocate hunting for killing's sake. What has happened to Cecil the Lion is appalling. If people like this dentist character want to go hunting to kill something dangerous in a useful way then perhaps the western world could licence specialist 'outfitters' to enable these types to contribute usefully by paying to hunt Jihadi scumbags in Syria, Iraq or Libya? That way we get rid of worthless vermin and our governments get paid for the privilege. Its a win win surely?
 
As a trained hunter myself, my biggest issue with this is that the dentist used the wrong tool for the job, thus causing the animal to suffer unnecessarily. The discussion on who led the animal out of the reserve etc is moot as all we know are rumours.

It is also funny how the vast majority of the early posters were wishing some form of painful death on the guy, about the death of a lion, who had outlived his natural lifespan by being put into a reserve. A reserve quite possibly paid for and maintained by the safari business in Zimbabwe. It is a proven fact that countries who offer 'big game hunting' have far improved conservation and higher numbers of wildlife than countries who don't, simply because people like the dentist are willing to pay huge sums of money into the economy to go hunting.


Also
 
So because the dentist paid big money to kill a defenceless lion he was indirectly helping conservation?
Sorry, that one won't wash with me. The sooner "big game" hunting is totally outlawed can't come too soon.

Outlived his natural lifespan? Are animals not allowed to grow old without being killed?
What a horrible outlook you have on the animal kingdom.

BTW, I wasn't calling for the dentist's head after this incident, but I'm really glad to see there is a possibility of him being extradited for an illegal killing.
 
Hunter.

Nuff said.
 
So because the dentist paid big money to kill a defenceless lion he was indirectly helping conservation?
Sorry, that one won't wash with me. The sooner "big game" hunting is totally outlawed can't come too soon.

Outlived his natural lifespan? Are animals not allowed to grow old without being killed?
What a horrible outlook you have on the animal kingdom.

BTW, I wasn't calling for the dentist's head after this incident, but I'm really glad to see there is a possibility of him being extradited for an illegal killing.

As I said it is a proven fact that big game hunting helps conservation, and in fact is the case in this country also, hunting and shooting organisations do massive amounts for conservation.

The natural life span of lions in reserves or captivity is extended by up to ten years. The truth of the matter is that Cecil would not have grown old and died gracefully in the wild, as the leader of a pride of lions he would have been fending off challenges from younger lions on a regular basis and, as is the case in nature, he would eventually be defeated, though usually he would not be killed outright but chased off to die alone of his wounds. If a realistic outlook is horrible, I am guilty as charged fella.

I too think he should be charged, if it turns out that he killed the lion illegally* then he should be charged with that, but at least with wounding the animal and then losing it for 40 hrs before it was finished off.

*I say this as, in some reports he claims he had a licence, in which case the Professional Hunter who guided him should be charged and jailed.
 
Hunter.

Nuff said.

Really? so you're going to judge me for being a hunter? but not for riding the same bike you ride or driving the same (model) of car you drive? Because you do those things, so they must be all right, but if I do anything you happen to disagree with it's 'nuff said'?

Sad, small minded, little man. Enough said.
 
It's just NOT hunting is it? it's slaughtering wild life to satisfy the ego of a neanderthal like brain dead yank & no better than that silly tart that killed the giraffe a while ago! No-one seems to have told these S**t H**ds that it is not socially acceptable any more, we are NOT still living in the 1930's.
 
He was only 4 years old. so clearly hadn't outlived his natural lifespan. He protected his young from other males, who will now kill those young to make sure their bloodline becomes the dominant one. So it's more than just one lion dieing here.

As for helping conservation. Wouldn't it be better to pay the $55.000 and let the animal live?

I'm all for culling to help keep the balance with deer and suchlike, here in the UK. But such animals as lions etc seem to be able to do that naturally. No need to hunt and kill them for that reason and certainly not simply for a trophy.
 
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The report I read said 13, as he and his brother were discovered in 2005, but as I said earlier, its all rumour.

As to your view on big game hunting, I couldn't agree more, I would no more shoot a lion than one of my dogs but, the fact is that people do want to, and the countries offer the service and benefit massively from it and it does serve the greater animal population (tho obviously not the individual). As for people who shoot for trophies, I am probably more dismissive of them, not to mention the tosspots who use a bow and arrow.





He was only 4 years old. so clearly hadn't outlived his natural lifespan. He protected his young from other males, who will now kill those young to make sure their bloodline becomes the dominant one. So it's more than just one lion dieing here.

As for helping conservation. Wouldn't it be better to pay the $55.000 and let the animal live?

I'm all for culling to help keep the balance with deer and suchlike, here in the UK. But such animals as lions etc seem to be able to do that naturally. No need to hunt and kill them for that reason and certainly not simply for a trophy.
 
As a trained hunter myself, my biggest issue with this is that the dentist used the wrong tool for the job, thus causing the animal to suffer unnecessarily. The discussion on who led the animal out of the reserve etc is moot as all we know are rumours.

It is also funny how the vast majority of the early posters were wishing some form of painful death on the guy, about the death of a lion, who had outlived his natural lifespan by being put into a reserve. A reserve quite possibly paid for and maintained by the safari business in Zimbabwe. It is a proven fact that countries who offer 'big game hunting' have far improved conservation and higher numbers of wildlife than countries who don't, simply because people like the dentist are willing to pay huge sums of money into the economy to go hunting.


Also
The money goes nowhere near the countries economy, it goes straight into the pocket of Robert Mugabe and his office.! BTW...
It is also a 'proven fact' that the Zimbabwe 'official game reserve' hunt & kill then export elephants to china for $25,000 each and up to 35 per annum! and none of them have 'out lived' their useful lives, they are bred for the purpose of making money only. And have you thought of the impact the lion's death will make on the rest of the pride? without an alpha male his cubs will be killed by the lesser males. (so .. 3 for the price of 1:mad:) how on earth is any of this justifiable? And before you ask... yes I do own guns but I shoot target and clays, I do not kill animals for fun or money, hunting for sport is NOT socially acceptable anymore, we are not still living in the 1930's :mad:
 
A) there are other countries, apart from Zimbabwe, which offer Big 5 hunting, so using a noted sociopath like Robert Mugabe and his regime as an example is hardly reasonable.

B) However an Alpha lion dies, his bloodline will be killed, please note that Cecil (that lovable lion) took over his pride when he, and his brother, attacked the alpha lion of a pride they discovered. Are you suggesting that Cecil (his brother and the alpha lion were killed in the fight) went against all his instincts and left his predecessors bloodline alone?

C) I do not hunt for fun, sport or money. I hunt to maintain numbers, control vermin, dispatch wounded animals (RTA etc) and because I like to eat game. It is not competitive, I don't keep trophies, nor does anyone pay me.

The money goes nowhere near the countries economy, it goes straight into the pocket of Robert Mugabe and his office.! BTW...
It is also a 'proven fact' that the Zimbabwe 'official game reserve' hunt & kill then export elephants to china for $25,000 each and up to 35 per annum! and none of them have 'out lived' their useful lives, they are bred for the purpose of making money only. And have you thought of the impact the lion's death will make on the rest of the pride? without an alpha male his cubs will be killed by the lesser males. (so .. 3 for the price of 1:mad:) how on earth is any of this justifiable? And before you ask... yes I do own guns but I shoot target and clays, I do not kill animals for fun or money, hunting for sport is NOT socially acceptable anymore, we are not still living in the 1930's :mad:
 
Inevitably some of us still display remnants of the same genetic traits that made us the top predator on the planet. Ironically a dentist killing a lion on the plains of Africa with a crossbow was simply a reinactment of an age old struggle that could have taken place millions of years ago. That's not to excuse it but may go someway to explaining why it happened. It's in our nature just as given the chance " Cecil " would kill and eat any of us without blinking either of those empty yellow eyes. While we wring our hands at the death of an individual animal we appear to spend most of time nowadays killing our fellow intelligent apes. This is OK however as we rationalise it as freedom fighting/ justifiable defense/ protecting our way of life / anti-terrorism/ religious crusade etc etc--- maybe------ its just in our genes.:dk:
 
Hunter!!! ... you said it ! (messing things up, one bad decision at a time):doh:

Generally I would reply to what I suspect as a criticism but, as you appear by your quote, to be criticising my decision to become a trained and certified competent person (which is what Hunter, or to give it's fully title Trained Hunter, means in the context it was used) do I presume you would rather an untrained person to do so? or are you saying that someone who controls numbers of animals, dispatches wounded animals, controls vermin or enjoys eating the most natural and humane of foods is someone who has made a mistake?

Maybe I should abdicate the moral responsibility of killing my food to another unknown third party, with no visibility of how those animals are reared and ultimately killed not to mention teaching children, by demonstration, that all my food comes wrapped in cellophane having been frozen and treated with hormones etc to extend its shelf life. Then, I could allow the numbers of rabbits, deer and foxes to grow to a point where they start to impact not only on your environment but on the well being of their species as a whole, or maybe you would prefer me to lie in my warm bed rather than come out to a deer you have hit in your car, which is now lying broken and bleeding it's last in the gutter, where you don't know how to dispatch it, and the police will call someone just like me?

Do tell, as I am truly interested.
 

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