C220 CDI hesitation/missing

Discussion in 'Engine' started by Doctor Z, Sep 26, 2011.

  1. Doctor Z

    Doctor Z New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Car:
    C220 CDI Estate
    I have a 2005 C220 CDI Estate that has an annoying problem that seems to be getting worse. I've not had the car long and the garage I got it from (Hyundai main dealer) gave me a 12 month warranty so I can hopefully get any problems sorted. However, given that they are a Hyundai dealer I want to see if I can give them some idea of where to look.

    Problem was that when sitting on a reasonable road (dual carriageway, motorway) at between 60 and 70 on a light throttle in top gear I'd get a slight hesitation. Watching the rev counter for when it did it again I noticed a drop in revs and then it picked up again. It's only momentary and actually feels like the auto box is trying to change up (but can't as there's no more gears...)

    Over the weekend, this seems to have got worse and I'm getting the same thing in other gears (at about 2000ish revs) and it feels a bit lethargic. When you boot it, its fine, doesn't seem to be an engine problem, more the engine and the gearbox having a bit of an argument over what to do.

    Typically, it was fine on the drive in to work this morning - I can't make the car do it, it seems to be random.

    No faults showing on the dash and otherwise everything seems fine.

    If anybody has any ideas I'd be very grateful

    Ta

    Dr Z
     
  2. Tinkerer

    Tinkerer Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    May 5, 2011
    Location:
    Norfolk
    Car:
    W210 E220 CDi
    I would go for the MAF as this can give the symptoms that you talk of although many will say get it on STAR!
     
  3. OP
    OP
    Doctor Z

    Doctor Z New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Car:
    C220 CDI Estate
    Thanks Tinkerer, but you are going to have to help out a poor ignorant sole here. MAF, I get (Mass Airflow Sensor) but you have me with STAR
     
  4. rf065

    rf065 Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    STAR is Mercedes diagnostics, main dealer or good indy will have it.
    Also check the auto box oil level, if low on oil gearchanges can be strange. Check if the autobox oil and filter has ever been changed too. Should have been done at 37,000 miles.

    Russ
     
  5. Pale rider

    Pale rider Member

    Messages:
    52
    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2011
    Car:
    c class 220 diesel
    Doctor Z , you are not alone with this issue i fear.
    I have just purchased the same vehicle as you and whilst I have now done over 800 miles in a couple of weeks with next to no issues, i have experienced two occasions when at low speed i pressed the accelerator pedal to change up and nothing happened for a split second.....this was long enough for my system to produce an adrenalin rush / panic reflex:eek:. I dismissed it as a minor glitch but it has got me thinking now I have read your entry.

    Nothing has happened for a few hundred miles since but i am keeping a little eye on this to see if it returns. Hopefully it never will, but it was there and gave me the jitters on an overtake.
    Keeping an eye on the thread and will be interested to see how you get on with the suggestions offered and any resolution.
     
  6. OP
    OP
    Doctor Z

    Doctor Z New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Car:
    C220 CDI Estate
    Still there - no solution yet

    OK, so I took the car back to the Hyundai dealer for them to investigate. they are being very helpful and I have no complaints other than they couldn't find anything wrong....

    They put it on their diagnostics (Snap-On) and it showed nothing wrong anywhere. They took it out for various test drives and could not reporduce the fault. Had the car 2 days and turned up zero. I mentioned the MAF and EGR but their view was that this would have shown up on the diagnistics.

    So, I got the car back, and I still get the same problem, every now and then, and I can't actually make it do it so can't go back to the dealer and get them to come out with me to show them it (as the german sense of humour that my car has would kick in and nothing would happen). Their view was that it will probably get worse, so bring it back when it does and they'll have a look then.

    I'm tempted to go to a Merc specialist and ask them to put it on STAR (now that I know what it is) and see if anything comes up. Does anyone know whether that is likley to help or do you think anything obvious should have shown up on the Snap-On diagnostics?
     
  7. WG M-B

    WG M-B Auhorised Forum Sponsor Authorised Forum Sponsor

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    Location:
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    Fault codes do not always get entered when problems occur. Live data needs to be read and various tests carried out with the engine running. This can only be done with snap on diagnostics to a certain extent. A decent independent specialist with a star machine would have a far better chance of getting to the bottom of your problem!
     
  8. silver_star

    silver_star Hardcore MB Enthusiast

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Leicestershire, England, 3rd Rock From The Sun
    Car:
    W203 C220CDI Auto Elegance
    Unplug the MAF and see if it is any better.
     
  9. BlackC55

    BlackC55 Authorised Forum Sponsor Authorised Forum Sponsor

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    Dont unplug the MAF. It proves nothing.
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Alex Crow

    Alex Crow Hardcore MB Enthusiast

    Messages:
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    Sep 30, 2011
    Location:
    Super Suffolk
    Car:
    S210 320cdi

    But it is such a popular suggestion Olly!

    Long after the break down of society, when we are living in a post apocalyptic world of hunger and death, all technology is dead, and health, food and shelter are our daily struggles - people will still mumble to each other 'try unplugging the maf' and 'change the brake pedal switch' :D

    My guess on this one is a lock up clutch fault, they can do this on this model at this speed...
     
  11. BlackC55

    BlackC55 Authorised Forum Sponsor Authorised Forum Sponsor

    Messages:
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    Car:
    C43 AMG with a 55 engine and supercharger, E55 AMG, S500, etc
    +1

    There is a valve on the valve body that gets sticky that can cause this fault.

    I just dont understand the "unplugging the MAF" suggestions. It makes no sense!
     
  12. OP
    OP
    Doctor Z

    Doctor Z New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Car:
    C220 CDI Estate
    Guys

    I'll leave the MAF plugged in (I don't know where it is anyway). That particular suggestion seems to have touched a nerve and now I'm not sure whether the next set of suggestions are real or a reaction to the MAF issue....

    So, "lock up clutch fault" - any more clues on what that might mean or where I would begin to look.

    And, "valve on the valve body gets sticky" - doesn't give me much to go on.

    I booked the car back in with the Hyundai dealer to come out with me for a drive as it "always does it when I drive it" and it hasn't done it since! It's really spoiling my enjoyment of an otherwise lovely car as I am waiting for it to hesitate every time I'm driving it and I'm wary about my wife driving on her own inc ase the whole thing just packs up and leaves her stranded (she's not the most confident of drivers at the moment following a recent accident and this might push her over the edge).

    OK, I'm just rambling now - any useful suggestions on things I might try to start eliminating things that this might be, along with an indication of where I might start poking or cleaning things would be gratefully received.

    Ta - Dr Z
     
  13. BlackC55

    BlackC55 Authorised Forum Sponsor Authorised Forum Sponsor

    Messages:
    18,745
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    Location:
    Horndean, Portsmouth, Hampshire, Southsea
    Car:
    C43 AMG with a 55 engine and supercharger, E55 AMG, S500, etc
    My advice is to take it to a MB dealer or specialist to get diagnosed properly.
     
  14. Beno

    Beno Hardcore MB Enthusiast

    Messages:
    343
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    Aug 4, 2011
    Location:
    Essex
    Car:
    C350 CDI
    I've seen similar problems with Ford's. normally traced to air leaks (Spilt hoses) on the pressure side of the intake, unmetered air gets in causing the engine stumble.
     
  15. OP
    OP
    Doctor Z

    Doctor Z New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Car:
    C220 CDI Estate
    I'm going to try to get to a MB Specialist in the next couple of weeks - I'll post again if I get a solution

    Thanks for the help and advice - much appreciated
     
  16. Kinko

    Kinko New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2012
    Car:
    C220 CDi
    Same problem - has anyone diagnosed it yet?

    I also have a 2005 C220 CDi estate (90,000 miles) and have had exactly the same problem develop recently. When cruising on the motorway (not on cruise control) the car hesitates momentarily and then carries on. There are no warning lights and no other seemingly associated problems.

    I have seen a few posts on the web about similar issues, although this one was most similar to my issue. However, I have yet to see a diagnosis or anyone have anything more than a reasoned guess on the topic. Has anyone had any experience of resolving this problem? Is Doctor Z still around to report on his experience?
     
  17. foxygrabon

    foxygrabon New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2010
    Location:
    Leeds
    Car:
    C250 CDI Sport with Manual Box
    Hi,
    I have a C250CDI with manual gearbox and intermittently get this same issue. Most noticeable around 2,000 RPM in 4th.
    As a separate issues it also sometimes feels like clutch is slipping in higher gears but no smell and not consistent and only seems to happen around 2 - 2.5K revs. Looks like there are two types of clutch / flywheel options, 1 dual mass and 1 normal flywheel. Anyone know how to tell which is which and if this is a symptom of a slipping clutch?

    Thanks in advance
     

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