C350e owners club

[seekay]

Had

Slow cranking is fundamentally down to two things. Poor battery or poor cuircuit path (including the starter itself). I’ve no clue how the battery monitoring is done on the car so can’t make any sensible comment about it TBH. Failing battery is probably the most likely culprit. Faced with the costs quoted, I might be tempted to try a few tests like connecting a battery booster pack to the jump points on the car then see how it behaves. These new Lithium packs seems quite remarkable in terms of energy density so with care, you could probably locate one under the bonnet (with suitable precautions around insulation etc) and do a short test drive. Failing that, just connect a jump battery and put it in sport, it should fire up immediately.

If it behaved as it should with a jump connection that’s probably good enough evidence to go for a new battery. Not 100% conclusive, but pretty good when factoring in age and mileage as well (mileage being a guide to how much work it’s had to do).

Had a short 5 miles trip in the morning, there was no issue with the start. Was driving in hybrid mode, engine kicked in 6-7 times without any problem or delay, no jerk at all.

 

[Deleted member 126969]

Nothing worse than an intermittent fault....

 

[seekay]

Nothing worse than an intermittent fault....

Oh yes, tell me about it... I think it was a one off luck...looks like sometimes the battery has enough juice to start the engine but with discharged EV battery the hybrid mode cuts in and out the ICE very often and the poor 12V battery just can’t handle it anymore. It’s getting worse now, constant jerk and already had a warning in dash twice, it said ‘collision prevention assist inoperable’ and also the abs light came on for a second and then both disappeared. It must be a battery thing...might worth visit the dealership where we purchased the car from less than 2 months ago, they might be able to do something as a gesture. I’ve got 3 years RAC warranty but battery isn’t covered unfortunately.

 

[Deleted member 126969]

The other alerts do suggest the main 12V is sagging under load don't they. Would have expected the warranty from the dealer to cover the battery?? It is only 2 months after purchase after all. Worth a go anyway.

 

[seekay]

The other alerts do suggest the main 12V is sagging under load don't they. Would have expected the warranty from the dealer to cover the battery?? It is only 2 months after purchase after all. Worth a go anyway.

Spoke to the dealership, the car has been booked in for next week. They’ll fix anything within the first 3 months for free of charge, even those parts what aren’t covered by the RAC warranty. So at least don’t have to worry about money wise, but still believe it’s a more complicated issue than seems to be and will be hard to diagnose. Now I’m quite sure this isn’t the battery because the random alarms stopped since we started using the car regularly (probably it was under the ideal voltage due to lockdown but now it’s ok according to my measuring) and also when the engine fails to start all I need to do is turn off the ignition and turn it back on and voila, magic! Engine starts straight away.

 

[Deleted member 126969]

Don’t underestimate the havoc a poor 12v battery can cause on a modern car. It’s basically a large collection of computers with 4 wheels, it really doesn't like a ‘soft’ battery. Transient dips in voltage cause all manner of problems. The fact it’s a bit better now you are using it regularly tends to support the poor battery scenario still.

Ours only gets used twice a week typically, for short runs, usually all on HV battery power, and has zero issues (at present!!)

Let us know what they say.

 

[Mikep2]

Haven’t posted any fuel consumption figures on my car for a while. So an update may be of some interest to someone thinking about a purchase who may have some reservations.
Owned my car for 9 months now and covered 2126 miles. During that time I have generally used the car locally for journeys up to 30 miles.
During this time I have usually driven the car in Eco and changed driving mode during a journey to try and get the best MPG.

Since last November I have filled up the car four times and from the screenshot you can see that I had the understandable learning curve with regards to how to get the best economy out of the car, culminating in my last tank giving me 821 miles with 2 bars remaining on the fuel gauge.
View attachment 100348

My overall average over the 2126 mile was 68.9 mpg with 1468 miles driven in electric.

View attachment 100349

After 9 months of obsessively changing modes during journeys to try and get the best economy I had decided that after this recent refuelling I am going to leave the car in hybrid mode for the next tank and compare results.
Also recently set the steering and suspension to sport along with eco mode in the individual drive mode as I found this gives the car a much tighter feel when driving rather than the more bouncy/floaty feel of the standard air suspension.
I have a journey of Approx 31 miles every couple of weeks and the best economy I have achieved for this is 80 mpg. For the same journey last week I decided to do the whole journey in Hybrid mode with the above settings just to prove that my method of manually managing the use of battery power was the best. How wrong was I, at the end I had 85 mpg showing on the car with 20% battery remaining, which really surprised me.

That’s what prompted me to try the next tank of fuel on hybrid all of the time charging the car 3 or 4 times a week.
Something else that was surprising that after refuelling last week I charged the car (it took 5.26 kWh) and it showed the usual 14 mile range (shown in above screenshot).
I then decided to reset my trip so I could start from scratch. Along with resetting to zero the range figure changed from 14 to 18 again surprising me (see attached screenshot). This I guess is the estimated range based on my recent driving.
View attachment 100350

This was a big surprise even though I have learned to monitor the battery level rather than the range figure.

With regards to the reliability I have had no issues other than an instance a few months back where Emode became unavailable for a couple of journeys even though battery was at 100%, this resolved itself after a day or so. The car has done 13800 miles and I can see that the back tires are approaching the tread limit so will need to be renewed shortly. I am assuming/ hoping these have been on since new.
Would be grateful for any recommendation for tyres when I renew them ?

Hope this has been of interest and will post how my next tank goes purely on hybrid.
Following tank will be on Hybrid with no charging !!!!

Just following up on my previous post. Refuelled my car yesterday and by leaving the car in Hybrid mode for the last 10 weeks the car has achieved just short of 84 mpg. This show I think that the car does a pretty good job of managing the economy without any mode changes. Previously changing driving modes within journeys I achieved 88 mpg.



With this next tank of fuel I’m going to drive in Hybrid with no charging at all from this I should be able to determine the benefit of charging the battery. Will let you know.

 

[seekay]

Don’t underestimate the havoc a poor 12v battery can cause on a modern car. It’s basically a large collection of computers with 4 wheels, it really doesn't like a ‘soft’ battery. Transient dips in voltage cause all manner of problems. The fact it’s a bit better now you are using it regularly tends to support the poor battery scenario still.

Ours only gets used twice a week typically, for short runs, usually all on HV battery power, and has zero issues (at present!!)

Let us know what they say.

Will do, once I have more information. To be honest, even if they fix it (whatever the problem is, apart from the battery), I’m getting really close to return/sell the car, just about to lose my faith. Don’t know how I could rely on this car, especially during a longer summer trip where we usually cover 3-4.000 miles.

 

[21bees]

quick update from me,
Only had the car for just over 2 weeks and after 124 miles i have the following economy figures:
from reset (when i filled the tank)
distance traveled: 124miles,
104 miles with the engine off
mpg of over 99.9. Me app showing 134.5mpg
I have used 3% of the fuel. and range is now over 360miles.

Love this car.
PS had a new E class 350D as a loan car while my maps were being updated. Did not like it and not worth the 55K price tag.
the only thing my C350E needs is the 13kW battery. Hope one can be fitted as an upgrade in the future.

 

[seekay]

quick update from me,
Only had the car for just over 2 weeks and after 124 miles i have the following economy figures:
from reset (when i filled the tank)
distance traveled: 124miles,
104 miles with the engine off
mpg of over 99.9. Me app showing 134.5mpg
I have used 3% of the fuel. and range is now over 360miles.

Love this car.
PS had a new E class 350D as a loan car while my maps were being updated. Did not like it and not worth the 55K price tag.
the only thing my C350E needs is the 13kW battery. Hope one can be fitted as an upgrade in the future.

Impressive figures. How often do you charge it? Do you happen to drive with no charge left at all sometimes or only use it within the electric range? What mode do you use? Hybrid, E-mode, etc? Also do you keep it in Comfort or switch to Eco?

 

[21bees]

Impressive figures. How often do you charge it? Do you happen to drive with no charge left at all sometimes or only use it within the electric range? What mode do you use? Hybrid, E-mode, etc? Also do you keep it in Comfort or switch to Eco?

i keep car in hybrid eco. sometimes put it into e mode near end of journey (although Sport+ eco is more fun!) I Charge it every night 9p/kWh and at work (free). Last nights charge time was 3 hours at 1.8kW. I have found the range to be higher than displayed, on full battery car says 12 miles range but it will do almost 14. i do not think reseting the trip is a good idea, as it looses a mile of range when i do this. Must me the maths being rounded down.

I now use the charge level as a range guide. On my 7 mile drive into work with car set to hybrid the engine only runs for about one mile. Yesterday with no charge left (showing11%) and keeping car in hybrid arrived home on 12% and an mpg figure of 63.7mpg.

The key is to always charge the battery. Hybrid mode and eco is best for economy / battery range. All it needs is the new 13kW battery to extend the e mode range to apron 25miles.

I had a new E class 350D AMG as a loan car yesterday while mine was having its maps updated. My Hybrid is far better than the e-class with its wheel obstructed long display and silly stop start feature. Also the ergonomics of the new touch pad are not as good.

 

[seekay]

i keep car in hybrid eco. sometimes put it into e mode near end of journey (although Sport+ eco is more fun!) I Charge it every night 9p/kWh and at work (free). Last nights charge time was 3 hours at 1.8kW. I have found the range to be higher than displayed, on full battery car says 12 miles range but it will do almost 14. i do not think reseting the trip is a good idea, as it looses a mile of range when i do this. Must me the maths being rounded down.

I now use the charge level as a range guide. On my 7 mile drive into work with car set to hybrid the engine only runs for about one mile. Yesterday with no charge left (showing11%) and keeping car in hybrid arrived home on 12% and an mpg figure of 63.7mpg.

The key is to always charge the battery. Hybrid mode and eco is best for economy / battery range. All it needs is the new 13kW battery to extend the e mode range to apron 25miles.

I had a new E class 350D AMG as a loan car yesterday while mine was having its maps updated. My Hybrid is far better than the e-class with its wheel obstructed long display and silly stop start feature. Also the ergonomics of the new touch pad are not as good.

14 miles this time of the year is very good. Are you very careful on the throttle and speed to achieve this range? I barely get 10-11 miles on my commuting but this includes a long bit of 50 mph dual carriageway and also some uphills on the way back home. What speed do you do on your commuting? Is it mainly flat road?

 

[seekay]

Don’t underestimate the havoc a poor 12v battery can cause on a modern car. It’s basically a large collection of computers with 4 wheels, it really doesn't like a ‘soft’ battery. Transient dips in voltage cause all manner of problems. The fact it’s a bit better now you are using it regularly tends to support the poor battery scenario still.

Ours only gets used twice a week typically, for short runs, usually all on HV battery power, and has zero issues (at present!!)

Let us know what they say.

Update:
12V battery has been replaced by the dealership for free of charge, then they carried out a road test, didn’t experience the problems anymore. They called me, the car was ready to collect. After picked it up, on my way home the fault came back. Same symptoms, whilst was driving in hybrid mode the engine either wouldn’t start or even when started it was very rough and jerky transition. The same error message also came up on the dash.
One thing I noticed, in neutral or park, the engine starts straight away 10/10, no issues at all. As soon as I try to start in D (during hybrid mode), either flick into sport mode or just simply put my foot down, the engine doesn’t kick in, fails to start and several warning lights come on, including ABS, engine management light and collision prevention assist failure. If keep driving on EV motor, after 10-15 sec ‘tick-tick-tick’ the ICE suddenly does kick in, it happens with a terrible, rough jerk. Only in gear. In neutral, no problems.

 

[seekay]

Update:
12V battery has been replaced by the dealership for free of charge, then they carried out a road test, didn’t experience the problems anymore. They called me, the car was ready to collect. After picked it up, on my way home the fault came back. Same symptoms, whilst was driving in hybrid mode the engine either wouldn’t start or even when started it was very rough and jerky transition. The same error message also came up on the dash.
One thing I noticed, in neutral or park, the engine starts straight away 10/10, no issues at all. As soon as I try to start in D (during hybrid mode), either flick into sport mode or just simply put my foot down, the engine doesn’t kick in, fails to start and several warning lights come on, including ABS, engine management light and collision prevention assist failure. If keep driving on EV motor, after 10-15 sec ‘tick-tick-tick’ the ICE suddenly does kick in, it happens with a terrible, rough jerk. Only in gear. In neutral, no problems.

Got the car back from Mercedes. It was the starter motor and finally ok now. Just went through the service history and this is the third starter motor in the car. It was also replaced 20k miles ago, in May 2019. Not very good sign is it...

 

[Deleted member 126969]

Hah, just catching up, read your post from the 22nd and was going to suggest maybe starter or start cabling..then saw your latest post underneath.

Result.

I think this squares with my entirely speculative idea that the starters on these get a proper workout given just how often the ICE can stop/start on even a short trip. Such a shame they couldn't use the HV motor for engine starting.

 

[seekay]

Hah, just catching up, read your post from the 22nd and was going to suggest maybe starter or start cabling..then saw your latest post underneath.

Result.

I think this squares with my entirely speculative idea that the starters on these get a proper workout given just how often the ICE can stop/start on even a short trip. Such a shame they couldn't use the HV motor for engine starting.

Got a new battery as well and they also replaced the starter motor relay along with the starter. Hopefully it’ll be ok now.
Its just a little weird that you never hear this sort of issues from a Toyota Prius...

 

[seekay]

Evening Gents,
Probably it’s been questioned many many times in this thread but as we are heading towards the winter and the EV range becomes shorter, need to figure out the most economical way to use the car. Once we run out of the juice (let’s say around 10-15% left), what operating (Hybrid?) and driving mode (Comfort, Eco?) would be the most beneficial? Any tricks?

 

[Mikep2]

Evening Gents,
Probably it’s been questioned many many times in this thread but as we are heading towards the winter and the EV range becomes shorter, need to figure out the most economical way to use the car. Once we run out of the juice (let’s say around 10-15% left), what operating (Hybrid?) and driving mode (Comfort, Eco?) would be the most beneficial? Any tricks?

After driving my car for a year now (mostly in ECO), if you know the journeys that you do depending on the terrain of the last few miles ensure you are left with enough battery to complete the journey.
The last few miles to my home is generally uphill so if I let the battery go down to 20% with 3 miles to go the last mile or two will be with the engine running and the mpg will drop quite quickly.

If I had gentle downhill roads to home then could let the battery go down to 15% and probably make it without the engine running too much.

I am driving my current tank of fuel on Hybrid with no charging at all, what I have found doing this is that using charge mode between 55 to 60 mph doesn’t impact your mpg as much as lower or higher speeds. I guess this is when the engine is operating at its most economical.
So if you have dual carriageway in the middle of your journey this will give the battery a boost for the backend of the journey.
In summary always use ECO, listen the haptic pulse. Coast as much as you can and light braking.

 

[C350ezoom]

Back in September it occurred to me that, in order to estimate the real-world cost/mile and compare it to a typical non-hybrid, it would be useful to have an accurate record of the charging cost. I only charge at home so I bought a cheap electricity meter but then forgot about it :-( I found the round tuit this weekend and installed the meter in the feed to the charger; I've also reset the MPG page in the car. I'll report back in a month or so.

 

[johnc0110]

Newbie here, looked though a LOT of the great info on here. Am looking to purchase a 350e in the next couple of weeks, 3 year old model. Driven one before for a few days but new enough to plugins so just wanted to see if there are any particular things I should look at before buying. Cheers