C43 Crabbing

[f17ant]

We have 2018 Cayenne Turbo and a 2019 Bentley Continental in the family They crab like hell in the cold. The C63 now owned by F17ANT crabbed too on 19s.
None of them are on winter tyres, maybe they would stop crabbing in them.
In the good old days , my very good friend had an Evo X. It crabbed worse than a real crab !
Is it just a AWD cold tyre flaw (apart from the C63) ?

even my GLC crabbed a little bit if it was really cold outside! I noticed my GLC crabbed less than my mates (I had different alloys with bigger tyre walls)

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

even my GLC crabbed a little bit if it was really cold outside! I noticed my GLC crabbed less than my mates (I had different alloys with bigger tyre walls)

Taller side walls help prevent skipping, they are better able to absorb lateral forces by flexing. Smaller stiffer sidewalls cannot flex as much, and so the lateral force results in the tyre skipping sideways resulting in the shudder or clunk.

 

[warrens]

I am aware that this issue has been previously discussed but just want some further advice.
I recently purchased a 2019 C43 Cabriolet fitted with 19 inch wheels and with 6k on the clock from a MB dealership. They did make me aware of the crabbing issues with this car at the time of purchase. However I must admit that I didn't fully appreciate the problem and it really started to annoy me. On contacting the dealership with the problem they were very sympathetic and agreed to change the tyres. They informed me that the MB recommended replacement tyres for the Pzero run flats were Continental Conti Sport 5P. The Pzeros have now been changed for the Continentals and the crabbing has not improved at all, although the ride quality is better. I reported this issue to the dealership and they informed me that they could do no more as these were the recommended replacement tyres by MB to resolve the matter.
Does anyone else have these tyres on their C43 and are still having the crabbing issue.
Any advice as to what action I may be able to take with MB to resolve the issue would be most appreciated.

I had the same issue, it’s a simple fix get rid of the Continental runflats and put a good quality non run flats on, it transforms the car. Obviously you need a space saver or a tin of dreaded foam and a pump.

 

[Steeve]

Winter tyres are like witchcraft. It's a night and day difference which has to be experienced to be believed but unfortunately the evangelistic reviews from people who use them (like me) makes those who don't even more robust in their belief that it's snake oil!

In the UK we collectively believe that Winter tyres are only useful in snow, and even then not really useful because "I live in the South" or "It hardly ever snows" or "I can work from home if I have to" or my personal favourite "I've been driving for 40 years and not needed them yet".

In the snow they make the difference between a comfortable drive home or a nightmare, and for the rest of the time they make cars with high performance summer tyres perform beautifully all year round, without the need for excuses.

Hey Bobby, I read from this you're running Winters all year round, do I have that right?

Would I be right in thinking the main downfall of that is a theoretically lower fuel economy than summers? But then probably a slower wear that offsets somewhat?

I've always been too lazy with the faff of switching between summer and winter tyres, but hadn't considered running Winters year round, so very interested, thanks.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Hey Bobby, I read from this you're running Winters all year round, do I have that right?

Would I be right in thinking the main downfall of that is a theoretically lower fuel economy than summers? But then probably a slower wear that offsets somewhat?

I've always been too lazy with the faff of switching between summer and winter tyres, but hadn't considered running Winters year round, so very interested, thanks.

I have run winter tyres all year round on a few different cars, and on a few occasions over the years, and I personally noticed no negative differences in summer..

I’ve read online that fuel consumption, tyre noise and wear rate are a problem when using winter tyres in warmer weather, but I’ve not found a noticeable difference.

Perhaps some cars and tyres are affected more than others. I’ve done it with both a C-class and an ML and they were both absolutely fine, no complaints.

On the C-class I managed to get more than double the distance out a set of rear tyres when using winter tyres all year round, than summer tyres all year round. Surprising!

Personally I prefer to make the switch, but when I stored wheels & tyres all at home it was a chore and hence I didn’t switch tyres on some cars in some years.

I now use a tyre hotel which makes switching much easier, and frees up my storage space at home. It’s worth looking to see if there is one in your area.

That said in 2020 I didn’t bother switching our MLs - one stayed on summer tyres and one stayed on winter tyres - I used both all year round, albeit biased by season.

Personally I believe that in the UK, and especially further North, winter tyres are a better all round proposition - with fewer compromises - than summer tyres.

That said there are comprises - a seasonal tyre will always perform better in the season it was designed for - so switching offers best performance more of the time.

However the need to store and switch two sets of wheels & tyres is also a compromise, so working out which compromise is right for you is key.

One caveat, the above is all true in my experience for cars with very low profile, very high performance tyres, with very stiff sidewalls.

Very high performance tyres tend to be compromised on fuel consumption, tyre noise and wear rates, so are often similar to winter tyres in those respects.

But because winter tyres tend to be designed to flex more - to generate heat and minimise skipping - they tend to be more comfortable.

One final caveat is that ultimately winter tyres will not perform as well on the limit in very hot temperatures, like summer tyres don’t very cold temperatures.

 

[Warwickduo]

I had the same issue, it’s a simple fix get rid of the Continental runflats and put a good quality non run flats on, it transforms the car. Obviously you need a space saver or a tin of dreaded foam and a pump.

The tyres that I have had fitted are Continental Sport 5P all season tyres which are not run flats. However although these are a more conventional tyre, ie not run flats, the crabbing/skipping issue is just as bad as it was on the Pirelli PZero run flats.

 

[cws196]

I had it with Michelin PS4’s which were fitted when I bought my C43 and it still does after changing to Conti SC6. I knew about it advance and it’s not a big issue to me-I only notice it on hard lock in and out of my drive in the cold which is fractional on how long I drive the car overall.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

The tyres that I have had fitted are Continental Sport 5P all season tyres which are not run flats. However although these are a more conventional tyre, ie not run flats, the crabbing/skipping issue is just as bad as it was on the Pirelli PZero run flats.

I believe the 5P is a Summer tyre, rather than all season tyre.

 

[Warwickduo]

That's interesting re your comment that the 5P is a summer tyre as the MB dealership who fitted them assured me that they were an all season tyre.

 

[grober]

post a picture of your tread pattern---all-weather and winter tyres have distinctive a tread pattern

 

[SpikyMikey]

That's interesting re your comment that the 5P is a summer tyre as the MB dealership who fitted them assured me that they were an all season tyre.

Having recently looked at Continentals for my wife's car, I think as has been stated the Sport 5P is a summer tyre ; the AllSeasonContact is Conti's all season offering ( the clue's in the name I guess )

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

That's interesting re your comment that the 5P is a summer tyre as the MB dealership who fitted them assured me that they were an all season tyre.

I can only go by what Continental say about the 5P. They consider it to be a summer tyre according to their website.

Did you have runflats on before? If so, changing your regular non-runflats will reduce sidewalk stiffness and therefore reduce likelihood of tyre skip.

 

[Warwickduo]

It would appear that the MB dealership misinformed me re the tyre info. Shows you can't believe what they say, doesn't surprise me really!
Yes previously the car was fitted with Pirelli run flats and although the Continentals are not run flats there they have made little difference to the skipping problem.

 

[W1ghty]

I can only go by what Continental say about the 5P. They consider it to be a summer tyre according to their website.

Did you have runflats on before? If so, changing your regular non-runflats will reduce sidewalk stiffness and therefore reduce likelihood of tyre skip.

It’s funny how many times throughout the thread you have had to say fit winters to resolve it and they still aren’t fitted

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

It’s funny how many times throughout the thread you have had to say fit winters to resolve it and they still aren’t fitted

I can only conclude that some people either enjoy the sensation; or enjoy telling others about how terrible their expensive new car is; or wrongly expect that their wide-tread low-profile stiff-sidewalled high/performance summer tyres should be able to do anything and everything without compromise including use in cool and cold condition.

 

[Steeve]

Winters question.

I know ideally all 4 corners should be on winters. But if my fronts are more worn than me rears, what happens if only fronts go on winters and rears are summers!? Odd combo, but seems a shame to change out the rears when they aren't worn

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Winters question.

I know ideally all 4 corners should be on winters. But if my fronts are more worn than me rears, what happens if only fronts go on winters and rears are summers!? Odd combo, but seems a shame to change out the rears when they aren't worn

You’ll get quite different levels of grip which could make the handling unpredictable in extreme situations, ie extreme weather, extreme manoeuvring, etc .

it would be fine most of the time in normal driving conditions, but when you really need your tyres to perform they’ll surprise you (and not in a good way).

If you’re making the change, then bite the bullet and replace all four at the same time.