C63 Coolant Leak

[Bozman]

Hi everyone,

Newbie here and am looking for some help / advice.

I bought a 2013 plate C63 with 30k miles on the clock from MB approved used just over 2 years ago. About 9 months in i had the coolant level warning appear on the dash, the car was under warranty so i took it back to the dealer, they couldn't find anything wrong with it, topped up the levels and that was that.

Fast forward another 6 months and the light reappears, it goes back to MB who investigate, pressure test and still find nothing wrong, albeit the levels have dropped again which is topped back up. Im advised if it happens again then to bring it back in. The car has been serviced by MB since owning it, since owning it i have only covered 7k miles and not driven the car hard.

Fast forward to now, the car is out of warranty and the light reappears, subsequent investigation results in them finding

Coolant leaking through timing case, requires complete engine strip down to gain access to timing case

Re-seal timing case dependant on findings once strip down has commenced

Air Con Condenser replacement

Alternator belt replacement

Water pump and housing replacement

The above works are going to cost £6.5k, £4.5k of which relates to the coolant leak. I have bitterly argued that this has to be the same issue that occurred twice under warranty, they are arguing that they investigated both previous times and found nothing wrong, my counter argument is because they didn't find the fault it doesn't mean it didn't exist, engine coolant does not just evaporate and it clearly in my view its the same issue. They didn't even correctly identify the real cause when initially investigating this time around as they thought it was something else, it was only when they started to pull the car apart to fix it they found the real issue deeper in the engine.

After a lot of back and forth they have agreed to cover half of the cost of this coolant leak but i am still left with a bill of £4.5k.

My questions therefore are, what is the opinion of other people who have way more mechanical knowledge and understanding than i do. DO MB have a valid opinion or should i be challenging this even further than i have.

Secondly on the basis of the car has only done 7k miles since i bought it and also been regularly serviced at MB, should i expect to be replacing the air con condenser, alternator belt and water pump for something that is approved used and meant to have a 50 point check before selling? I spent the extra and went approved used to avoid this very scenario.

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Chris

 

[rf065]

Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, you can reject the car up to 6 years after you bought it. Best have a read through this to understand fully your legal rights and determine how hard you are prepared to fight your corner.

Your rights if something is wrong with your car

 

[Bozman]

Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, you can reject the car up to 6 years after you bought it. Best have a read through this to understand fully your legal rights and determine how hard you are prepared to fight your corner.

Your rights if something is wrong with your car

Thanks for the reply and advice, is this a realistic option in reality? Has anyone ever gone down this route and been successful?

 

[rf065]

Is there a finance company involved? Do you have free legal cover with any insurance policies?
I suppose the dealer will only back down if he realises you are not fighting this alone.

 

[Bozman]

Is there a finance company involved? Do you have free legal cover with any insurance policies?
I suppose the dealer will only back down if he realises you are not fighting this alone.

There is no finance but its a good shout looking at other policies and legal cover, I will take a look, thanks

 

[rf065]

Many years ago I bought a used Lancia Thema Turbo, intermittantly it would refuse to start and the garage tried to fix it 3 or 4 times without success. Eventually realising they were not up to the task, I was given the "it's a used car, what do you expect" treatment and they refused to do anymore.
It had refused to start so many times, I'd joined the RAC who incidentally offered free legal advice. As the garage and I had come to a stalemate, I contacted the RAC who advised me to document everything in a letter and how to word it, and ending it by telling them I was rejecting the car as unfit for purpose.
This resulted in a complete climbdown by the garage, who picked up the car and towed it to a Lancia dealer who repaired it and it was returned to me at no cost. (amazingly the fault was only a loose connection to the ECU).
I've no doubt Mercedes have the legal expertise that the garage I used could never match, so any help you can get may help them re-evaluate their position in your favour?

 

[paulr2006]

I would also consider contacting Mercedes Customer Service department, they might well look favorable given the circumstances after you explain the events, hope you get this issue resolved to your satisfaction.

 

[Bozman]

I would also consider contacting Mercedes Customer Service department, they might well look favorable given the circumstances after you explain the events, hope you get this issue resolved to your satisfaction.

Thanks, i did speak to them on the phone and the woman suggested i am lucky they have made a gesture due to the age of the car. Not the response i was hoping for

 

[paulr2006]

Thanks, i did speak to them on the phone and the woman suggested i am lucky they have made a gesture due to the age of the car. Not the response i was hoping for

Personally I think that is a very poor reply especially as on at least two occasions you had reported the issue and given you have used Mercedes servicing. I would be tempted to have another go, after all you are not the expert which is why you took it in for expert opinion! Good luck.

 

[Yex]

Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, you can reject the car up to 6 years after you bought it.

The limit under your statutory consumer rights is 6 months, not 6 years. Given your first issue occurred well past 6 months after you purchased the car I would think they no longer apply in his case. That’s the bad news.

The only good news is MB have agreed to fund some of the repair after the car is out of warranty. Not ideal I know but it is at least something that they are under no obligation to provide.

Not what you expect after a car has been under warranty for 2 years but unfortunately that is the way it goes with high performance cars on rare occasions.

 

[rf065]

The limit under your statutory consumer rights is 6 months, not 6 years.

Have you even read the link I put up?

"In fact, you’re legally allowed to return it up to six years after you bought it (in Scotland, it’s five years after you first realised there was a problem).

But it gets more difficult to prove a fault and not normal wear and tear is the cause of any problem."

 

[unimog]

The best question to ask is was a 'coolant in oil' or any form of oil analysis performed on the two occasions you reported the coolant leak. If coolant was entering the timing case it would have contaminated the oil enough to be detectable by analysis. This would (should) be the first step in fault finding any coolant leak as far as I am concerned, its easy to do and it establishes if it is indeed an internal leak. In conjunction with both hot and cold pressure tests it should have revealed it first time round. If they have not done this or can't furnish you with test results, its good grounds for an escalation that proper inspection and diagnostics were not used.

Regarding the AC condenser, I think these are a weak link on the 204 C63, I have seen a few forum users have had this done. The waterpump exchange (and belt) will be belt and braces as it probably has to be removed to get access to the timing case.

 

[Yex]

Have you even read the link I put up?

"In fact, you’re legally allowed to return it up to six years after you bought it (in Scotland, it’s five years after you first realised there was a problem).

But it gets more difficult to prove a fault and not normal wear and tear is the cause of any problem."

I'm a realist and I doubt there has ever been a case where a 6 year old car has been accepted as rejected by a dealer.

No need to shout by the way, we're generally polite here.

 

[rf065]

I'm a realist and I doubt there has ever been a case where a 6 year old car has been accepted as rejected by a dealer.

No need to shout by the way, we're generally polite here.

I never shouted, but if taking legal advice, the Consumer Rights Act 2015 is what a lawyer would refer to, not what some guy on the internet thinks is correct and that is why I posted the link. And, it doesn't make any difference if a dealer does not accept a car as been rejected or not, the law will determine who is right, not the dealer. And don't tell me how polite we are on here as I've been here a hell of a lot longer that you.

 

[GillyC63]

I've read the link & it contradicts itself:

You have a right to reject something faulty and you are entitled to a full refund within 30 days of purchase in most cases.

After 30 days you lose the short-term right to reject the goods.

In fact, you’re legally allowed to return it up to six years after you bought it (in Scotland, it’s five years after you first realised there was a problem).

You must give the dealer details of your reasons for rejecting the car in writing, and within six months of taking delivery of it.

Or am I being thick?

 

[rf065]

You need to read the full law, there is no contradiction, up to 30 days you are entitled to a full refund. Up to 6 months, it's assumed the fault was present at purchase and it falls on the dealer to provide evidence that it was not. After 6 months and up to 6 years, you must provide evidence that the fault was present, not the dealer.