In all fairness , while we have every sympathy for , and no reason to disbelieve Darren's account of this matter , it would be nice if Phil would come on and give his side of the story , or explaination for his apparent silence .
Calling PhilJ - Please respond to my contact attempts.
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Whoever Phil is he doesn't need to give anyone except his customer his side of the story, it's a forum not crown court.
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That's as may be but Phil sells on here and if he wants to continue selling on here then a reply would be appropriate.
Its a shame though that this has happened and hopes it gets sorted amicably. Although I have never bought from him he certainly gets hold of rare and interesting stuff and would rather him be on the forum than not on it !
Its a shame though that this has happened and hopes it gets sorted amicably. Although I have never bought from him he certainly gets hold of rare and interesting stuff and would rather him be on the forum than not on it !
supaer
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I agree.... However if i was selling parts and wanted to continue a good rep i would explain the situation.... It has happened on many forums before that both parties have aired explanations. It is unfair what has happened and i would be annoyed.. Personally i would either go to a smalls claim court, if you have a business address he has used it will be pretty easy to track down a new trading address... You can try looking on companies house. Hope it gets resolved
mercboiuk
MB Enthusiast
I made a point of not going in to specific details, as I don't want this thread to become a public argument - the original purpose of this thread was to prompt Phil to respond to repeated contact attempts.
I received the reply (be it rather curt), so it worked in that respect. However he has gone quiet again, which doesn't really bode well.
Undoubtedly it would make more of a rounded topic if Phil were to respond - it would also mean that I could communicate with him - but I would prefer this to not degenerate into a "he said", "but you said" public kind of thing.
However whether factual points of view are to be published, I shall leave up to Phil, should he wish reply.
For now, I intend to seek some legal advice.
Darren
I received the reply (be it rather curt), so it worked in that respect. However he has gone quiet again, which doesn't really bode well.
Undoubtedly it would make more of a rounded topic if Phil were to respond - it would also mean that I could communicate with him - but I would prefer this to not degenerate into a "he said", "but you said" public kind of thing.
However whether factual points of view are to be published, I shall leave up to Phil, should he wish reply.
For now, I intend to seek some legal advice.
Darren
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The point of my post was not so that 'we' should in any way sit in judgement over this matter , merely that this thread has thus far painted one member in a rather negative light , and it is only fair that he should have an opportunity to put forward his viewpoint for balance .
I doubt that anyone wants to get caught in the middle of a dispute between two members , but thus far this thread is entirely one sided and the way things are going Phil may never be able to show his face on the forum again .
I would hope that the two of them sort things out privately between themselves .
Can't say I noticed this thread, nor did anyone alert me to it. It did not prompt me to reply to you whatsoever.
I saw you had threatened me with putting this in public, notice how it didn't change my stance or speedyness at bowing to your demands.
My curt replies have stopped because I have explained my stance on this over and over.
So for everyone else, lets have a summary of whats gone on.
I sold a suspension kit. This kit was on ebay with full pictures showing each component. I take a while to post, hold my hands up to that, apologies, not going to explain my life story, but I've moved a couple times.
Darren recieves kit, First he claimed a nut is missing. Later the boots are damaged, more weeks later YSR tell him the springs are apparently wrong (Read "YSR europe" a dealer not the manufacturer)
They've been updated, probably as 1400 lbs/in is quite racey, many people have fitted this same kit with the same springs, apparently this is reason for him to demand a refund. I refused.
Then suddenly a lower hub mount is missing from the box and he is demanding a refund. Apparently not noticing a large substansial piece of the kit was missing within a reasonable time period.
Most likely scenario is courier damage as I laid out all components on a table before packing them, they were all there. Now being months later, I cannot claim on the up to £1000 insurance I paid £20 for.
Also he has "spoken to YSR europe" I suspect he was sold another kit and is trying to return mine for due to this spring update. Then he "lost" the mount.
I'm very sceptical it takes someone months to notice a large piece was missing. Also that you found another reason I supposedly needed to refund you within weeks of me refusing the first.
Regardless Darren, you need to take a better time period than months to want to return a supposedly incomplete item, not to mention be a little less suspicious over it.
If Darren wishes to take me to court, so be it. If the forum court lynchmob wants to chuck me off, again so be it. I do not have the time nor wish to get into arguing this out on the forum.
I saw you had threatened me with putting this in public, notice how it didn't change my stance or speedyness at bowing to your demands.
My curt replies have stopped because I have explained my stance on this over and over.
So for everyone else, lets have a summary of whats gone on.
I sold a suspension kit. This kit was on ebay with full pictures showing each component. I take a while to post, hold my hands up to that, apologies, not going to explain my life story, but I've moved a couple times.
Darren recieves kit, First he claimed a nut is missing. Later the boots are damaged, more weeks later YSR tell him the springs are apparently wrong (Read "YSR europe" a dealer not the manufacturer)
They've been updated, probably as 1400 lbs/in is quite racey, many people have fitted this same kit with the same springs, apparently this is reason for him to demand a refund. I refused.
Then suddenly a lower hub mount is missing from the box and he is demanding a refund. Apparently not noticing a large substansial piece of the kit was missing within a reasonable time period.
Most likely scenario is courier damage as I laid out all components on a table before packing them, they were all there. Now being months later, I cannot claim on the up to £1000 insurance I paid £20 for.
Also he has "spoken to YSR europe" I suspect he was sold another kit and is trying to return mine for due to this spring update. Then he "lost" the mount.
I'm very sceptical it takes someone months to notice a large piece was missing. Also that you found another reason I supposedly needed to refund you within weeks of me refusing the first.
Regardless Darren, you need to take a better time period than months to want to return a supposedly incomplete item, not to mention be a little less suspicious over it.
If Darren wishes to take me to court, so be it. If the forum court lynchmob wants to chuck me off, again so be it. I do not have the time nor wish to get into arguing this out on the forum.
IMO the mods should remove these sort of threads.
There are two parties involved and they will both have their side of the story, the trouble is there are always other posters who like nothing more than to sit in their kangaroo court and in some cases stir things up although to be fair that hasn't really happened here.
If I was PhilJ I would have simply posted that this was between the OP and him and the rest of the 'vultures' will get no rise from their demands for him to explain himself whatever their claimed motivation for such demands.
There are two parties involved and they will both have their side of the story, the trouble is there are always other posters who like nothing more than to sit in their kangaroo court and in some cases stir things up although to be fair that hasn't really happened here.
If I was PhilJ I would have simply posted that this was between the OP and him and the rest of the 'vultures' will get no rise from their demands for him to explain himself whatever their claimed motivation for such demands.
mercboiuk
MB Enthusiast
I am pleased to see Phil has now replied, so thank you 
I read your extensive run down of events from your point of view, but it is perhaps unsurprising in this scenarios that unfortunately they do not entirely correlate with my recall.
I have the message and email contacts from the time, too.
There was no threat of negative posting. I point out we are both known MBClub members, so I didn't mind waiting such a long time for delivery.
I would point out that the Ebay photos were clearly stock photos of this kit, as the precise kit I received have gold top mounts, where the photos depict black ones.
I, too, hold my hands up to time, as it took a good few weeks to take it to my suspension engineer and after a brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm.
It was when everything was properly unpacked and fitting began that problems where encountered. Why would I begin an expensive fitment process if I know the kit to be incomplete?
No further kit has been purchased, no items damaged or lost at this end.
A nut was missing, which you also believed to be there. You dismiss it as just a "£1 nut", which is missing the point.
I never questioned the single damaged boot, as this was mentioned in the advert and I knew I had to pay for one.
The springs are an incorrect length. YSR Europe were conversing with the YSR directly and the confirmation came from them.
You still neglect to acknowledge that two front mounts are incorrect. You yourself admitted this in an Ebay message. No mention of this was in the Ebay advert, and I supplied you photos at your request. This message went unanswered.
You read it as sceptical for taking someone months to get the item fitted, only then mentioning problems, requesting a refund. I fully appreciate this point, but this is not the case.
I have been nothing but patient, polite, honest and courteous, albeit firm, throughout this and it pains me to have had very slow communications during the initial complaints process and having gone to such lengths to actually garner a response.
You claim to have not seen this thread, yet within a couple of days of its existence, during which time you had logged on, you privately replied to my email.
It took much time for responses and when I answered your requested information on Ebay, you just went silent.
During this precise period, Paypal's own 6 month claim limit expired.
Ebay's own Case limit expired before I even received the item.
The scepticism can work both ways.
I don't wish for any lynchmob for either one of us; I do not wish for anyone to be removed from MBClub; and I would like you to continuing selling what you like, where you like.
We could both have taken less time in delivery and fitment, that is a fact. However, what I would like is timely private communications, and to not have questions and points remain unanswered. The admittance of knowingly supplying two mounts which will not fit is the point which remains unanswered. The missing mount, incorrect length springs and missing nut are parts of the bigger problem.
Again, I am pleased you have responded to me, albeit on this public forum.
Thank you.
Darren
I read your extensive run down of events from your point of view, but it is perhaps unsurprising in this scenarios that unfortunately they do not entirely correlate with my recall.
I have the message and email contacts from the time, too.
There was no threat of negative posting. I point out we are both known MBClub members, so I didn't mind waiting such a long time for delivery.
I would point out that the Ebay photos were clearly stock photos of this kit, as the precise kit I received have gold top mounts, where the photos depict black ones.
I, too, hold my hands up to time, as it took a good few weeks to take it to my suspension engineer and after a brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm.
It was when everything was properly unpacked and fitting began that problems where encountered. Why would I begin an expensive fitment process if I know the kit to be incomplete?
No further kit has been purchased, no items damaged or lost at this end.
A nut was missing, which you also believed to be there. You dismiss it as just a "£1 nut", which is missing the point.
I never questioned the single damaged boot, as this was mentioned in the advert and I knew I had to pay for one.
The springs are an incorrect length. YSR Europe were conversing with the YSR directly and the confirmation came from them.
You still neglect to acknowledge that two front mounts are incorrect. You yourself admitted this in an Ebay message. No mention of this was in the Ebay advert, and I supplied you photos at your request. This message went unanswered.
You read it as sceptical for taking someone months to get the item fitted, only then mentioning problems, requesting a refund. I fully appreciate this point, but this is not the case.
I have been nothing but patient, polite, honest and courteous, albeit firm, throughout this and it pains me to have had very slow communications during the initial complaints process and having gone to such lengths to actually garner a response.
You claim to have not seen this thread, yet within a couple of days of its existence, during which time you had logged on, you privately replied to my email.
It took much time for responses and when I answered your requested information on Ebay, you just went silent.
During this precise period, Paypal's own 6 month claim limit expired.
Ebay's own Case limit expired before I even received the item.
The scepticism can work both ways.
I don't wish for any lynchmob for either one of us; I do not wish for anyone to be removed from MBClub; and I would like you to continuing selling what you like, where you like.
We could both have taken less time in delivery and fitment, that is a fact. However, what I would like is timely private communications, and to not have questions and points remain unanswered. The admittance of knowingly supplying two mounts which will not fit is the point which remains unanswered. The missing mount, incorrect length springs and missing nut are parts of the bigger problem.
Again, I am pleased you have responded to me, albeit on this public forum.
Thank you.
Darren
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A few observations I made on this thread
1. PhilJ has responded so they should continue via PM/email etc although PhilJ has given his stance and the OP needs to decide whether to take it to SC court. It is not for me (or anyone else) to decide who is right and who is wrong.
2. Whilst I partly agree it is between Phil and Darren, if someone directly or indirectly sells on forums, members should know how the dealing went. A forum/google search is normally a good indication on whether a person is worth dealing with.
Both sides have a valid argument - lets hope it gets sorted
1. PhilJ has responded so they should continue via PM/email etc although PhilJ has given his stance and the OP needs to decide whether to take it to SC court. It is not for me (or anyone else) to decide who is right and who is wrong.
2. Whilst I partly agree it is between Phil and Darren, if someone directly or indirectly sells on forums, members should know how the dealing went. A forum/google search is normally a good indication on whether a person is worth dealing with.
Both sides have a valid argument - lets hope it gets sorted
John Jones Jr
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I don't know how you came to that conclusion. It's clear from reading the correspondence between them that the Op received the incorrect parts. Just take the the top mounts as one example.
That way we can all watch, then discuss it in a very long thread...
I've seen him on TV ; he seems like a very nice chap !
As for this dispute , I have formulated my own opinion , but I'm keeping it to myself and not getting any further involved .
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I don't know how you came to that conclusion. It's clear from reading the correspondence between them that the Op received the incorrect parts. Just take the the top mounts as one example.
I was still posting when the Op made the post above mine. Yes agreed the front mounts remained unanswered.
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John Jones Jr
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Mrhanky
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Not knowing the specifics of the transaction and resulting commutation, it is impossible to form a reasonable opinion, other than that of face value.
Experience tells me that both parties will have their own version of the truth. Therefore I would not see the small claims court as a negative, simply a means of getting a fair and just judgement on what has happened.
Experience tells me that both parties will have their own version of the truth. Therefore I would not see the small claims court as a negative, simply a means of getting a fair and just judgement on what has happened.
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Hi John. I'm sorry I called your suzuki your first car and that has clearly rubbed you up the wrong way enough so that you feel the need to chime in here and do exactly what everyone has said you shouldn't do, months later. Or was it your inability to accept AMG didn't send cars half way round the world to fit a bodykit?
Well done on the post count by the way. I hear the queen sends you a letter when you get to 100,000? Keep going, you'll get there soon. Although I do suggest you learn to take in what you read a little better.
“I would point out that the Ebay photos were clearly stock photos of this kit, as the precise kit I received have gold top mounts, where the photos depict black ones. “
Top mounts, ah yes they are definitely incorrect because they are a different colour.
Thing is Darren knows full well the top mounts are not incorrect as I've explained why they are gold, but I'll do it AGAIN....
I bought one of the very first YSR kits, The black set were powdercoated. People complained the it came off, YSR sent out an updated pair of top mount plates that were anodised and laser etched, these were gold. I told Darren I had supplied him this pair.
The ebay photo was not a stock photo of the kit, reason I know this is because I took the photo myself.
Had I seen the thread I would have replied here, but I don't really come on here too much. I check the spotted on ebay, that is about it. I'm sure in this day and age this can be traced by the forum court. The only reason I noticed this was my name was hanging out of the general discussion forum as the last replied to thread.
“brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm. “
Any brief check would have noticed a large one of 4, 16” x 4” piece allegedly missing.
And the springs are too short? ON A HEIGHT ADJUSTABLE KIT? One which 20 other people have fitted the same springs and not complained? Did I mention that I test fitted them to a W202?
Maybe your suspension engineer couldn't fathom springs so stiff/short. I've already explained why they are like this to you. Do I need to go over it again?
“no items damaged or lost at this end. “
Considering it took you 3 months to claim a piece is missing, I don't think that's an honest assessment.
“You still neglect to acknowledge that two front mounts are incorrect.”
Again, I stopped replying to you because you just repeat the same tripe.
The picture shows 4 mounts. 2 of which are correct, 2 are not. I had no way of checking which was which so I sent both. That is how YSR supplied it to me, with 4 mounts, of which you only need 2. Yet it takes you 3 months to tell me that one is missing? One of the major, largest components in the kit?
Boils back down to:
“brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm. “
Any brief check would have noticed a large one of 4, 16” x 4” piece allegedly missing.....
Simple as that.
Lesson to be learned here, check what you buy against what you should get within a reasonable time frame.
Well done on the post count by the way. I hear the queen sends you a letter when you get to 100,000? Keep going, you'll get there soon. Although I do suggest you learn to take in what you read a little better.
“I would point out that the Ebay photos were clearly stock photos of this kit, as the precise kit I received have gold top mounts, where the photos depict black ones. “
Top mounts, ah yes they are definitely incorrect because they are a different colour.
Thing is Darren knows full well the top mounts are not incorrect as I've explained why they are gold, but I'll do it AGAIN....
I bought one of the very first YSR kits, The black set were powdercoated. People complained the it came off, YSR sent out an updated pair of top mount plates that were anodised and laser etched, these were gold. I told Darren I had supplied him this pair.
The ebay photo was not a stock photo of the kit, reason I know this is because I took the photo myself.
Had I seen the thread I would have replied here, but I don't really come on here too much. I check the spotted on ebay, that is about it. I'm sure in this day and age this can be traced by the forum court. The only reason I noticed this was my name was hanging out of the general discussion forum as the last replied to thread.
“brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm. “
Any brief check would have noticed a large one of 4, 16” x 4” piece allegedly missing.
And the springs are too short? ON A HEIGHT ADJUSTABLE KIT? One which 20 other people have fitted the same springs and not complained? Did I mention that I test fitted them to a W202?
Maybe your suspension engineer couldn't fathom springs so stiff/short. I've already explained why they are like this to you. Do I need to go over it again?
“no items damaged or lost at this end. “
Considering it took you 3 months to claim a piece is missing, I don't think that's an honest assessment.
“You still neglect to acknowledge that two front mounts are incorrect.”
Again, I stopped replying to you because you just repeat the same tripe.
The picture shows 4 mounts. 2 of which are correct, 2 are not. I had no way of checking which was which so I sent both. That is how YSR supplied it to me, with 4 mounts, of which you only need 2. Yet it takes you 3 months to tell me that one is missing? One of the major, largest components in the kit?
Boils back down to:
“brief check it appeared all was present and correct which I did confirm. “
Any brief check would have noticed a large one of 4, 16” x 4” piece allegedly missing.....
Simple as that.
Lesson to be learned here, check what you buy against what you should get within a reasonable time frame.
John Jones Jr
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Sadly the Court is unlikely to be able to make a decision based on pure evidence - these type of cases are often judged on mud-slinging by the buyer.
Sadly, I speak from experience.
