Cancelled holiday

[artyman]

Surely the first relaxation should be industrial production, whilst leisure is a big sector, life would continue without it, if the risks are still persisting.

 

[Dryce]

The comment that particularly resonates is "a short, temporary shutdown to rapidly build emergency care capacity", the second part of which has certainly been happening.

It ignores the issue of control - post lockdown.

And that's what is being talked about as the post lockdown world.

 

[st13phil]

It ignores the issue of control - post lockdown.

And that's what is being talked about as the post lockdown world.

Unless I'm missing the point you’re making, I don’t think it does ignore that:

then a reopening and progression towards herd immunity, hopefully accelerated by a vaccine if and when it emerges, making use of the massively expanded care capacity and enforcing selective isolation.

 

[flowrider]

But you must admit though that as an OAP you’ve got more chance than catching Covid19 than your younger wife has.

Not a higher chance of catching Covid19 but will have a higher chance of the virus being fatal.

 

[Darrell]

Not a higher chance of catching Covid19 but will have a higher chance of the virus being fatal.

Tell him that, not me.

 

[Deleted member 113659]

Tell him that, not me.

It’s not going in is it? If a person is exposed to it, they’ll catch it. Age/health etc is irrelevant.

 

[Darrell]

It’s not going in is it? If a person is exposed to it, they’ll catch it. Age/health etc is irrelevant.

I understand that part, it was the latter part of the sentence I was referring to.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

I understand that part, it was the latter part of the sentence I was referring to.

Are we really still going with this? If either my wife or I was unfortunate enough to contract Covid-19 it is extremely likely, almost guaranteed, that we’d pass it on to the other one before getting sufficient symptoms to completely self-isolate. Obviously, because of my age I’m at a great risk of my health suffering more and even death. In a nutshell, if either of us contracts Covid-19 I’m the one who is more likely to die. Therefore it’s in my best interests to do all that I reasonably can to prevent both myself AND my wife getting it. I believe that’s what I’m doing. So does my wife.

I wish everyone well in whatever measures the deem best to protect themselves and their loved ones. We all have unique circumstances that require a unique but reasoned approach. We all have opinions on what is best; whether it’s going out for regular bike rides in order to maintain physical and mental health, driving a little bit out of our way to wave at an estranged son, never leaving the house for any reason, or warily venturing out once a week to buy food for the family. None of us can know what is best for anyone else. We can offer advice/opinion, but unless ignoring that advice may put others at risk we have to limit ourselves to concentrating on looking after our own household.

Can we please leave it at that.

 

[Darrell]

Are we really still going with this? If either my wife or I was unfortunate enough to contract Covid-19 it is extremely likely, almost guaranteed, that we’d pass it on to the other one before getting sufficient symptoms to completely self-isolate. Obviously, because of my age I’m at a great risk of my health suffering more and even death. In a nutshell, if either of us contracts Covid-19 I’m the one who is more likely to die. Therefore it’s in my best interests to do all that I reasonably can to prevent both myself AND my wife getting it. I believe that’s what I’m doing. So does my wife.

I wish everyone well in whatever measures the deem best to protect themselves and their loved ones. We all have unique circumstances that require a unique but reasoned approach. We all have opinions on what is best; whether it’s going out for regular bike rides in order to maintain physical and mental health, driving a little bit out of our way to wave at an estranged son, never leaving the house for any reason, or warily venturing out once a week to buy food for the family. None of us can know what is best for anyone else. We can offer advice/opinion, but unless ignoring that advice may put others at risk we have to limit ourselves to concentrating on looking after our own household.

Can we please leave it at that.

Tell it to Flowrider not me. He brought it up.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Tell it to Flowrider not me. He brought it up.

And you were the last to comment. If you want to play the game of having the last word I believe there’s another thread for that. Thank you for your opinion, now please let it go.

 

[Dryce]

Unless I'm missing the point you’re making, I don’t think it does ignore that:

I think that "selective isolation" pretty much ignores it.

Unlocking the lockdown is rather more complicated as it means getting the economy moving - restoring public confidence - reliable testing - dealing with contact tracing - setting out risk reduction and backign that with enforcement.

The lockdown - by comparison - is much simpler.

 

[st13phil]

Unlocking the lockdown is rather more complicated as it means getting the economy moving - restoring public confidence - reliable testing - dealing with contact tracing - setting out risk reduction and backign that with enforcement.

I completely understand that (as does, I suspect, the author of that piece). I don’t think they attempted to describe a blueprint for managing Covid-19 in a handful of words, either. Rather they were indicating an overall framework within which a multitude of other actions - including those you list - would be taken, while pointing out that neither a never-ending lockdown, nor a “business as usual” free for all are a route out of this mire.

 

[m80]

I think that "selective isolation" pretty much ignores it.

Unlocking the lockdown is rather more complicated as it means getting the economy moving - restoring public confidence - reliable testing - dealing with contact tracing - setting out risk reduction and backign that with enforcement.

The lockdown - by comparison - is much simpler.

To my mind unlocking the lockdown is a progressively turning on the tap strategy.
'They' want enough social interaction so as to increase toward herd immunity. The balance is to not overload the NHS.
If 'they' allow for a calculated 5% increase in interaction they will recognise that in practice this would be 15% due to those seeing opportunity for an increased opportunity for free movement.

So 'say' there is an allowance for school kids of up to 11 years to return, they might even add opportunity for the summer exams.
If the NHS heads toward overload then lockdown again, if not after a few weeks consider the next relaxation.
Meanwhile 'we' get closer to herd immunity.

I've read that builders merchants have been allowed to reopen, that being aside from Wickes and the like operating a click and collect service I suppose.

 

[markjay]

...I've read that builders merchants have been allowed to reopen, that being aside from Wickes and the like operating a click and collect service I suppose.

I am assuming this applies to DIY shops - I don't think that trade-only builders merchants were ever ordered to close? (though some may have done so on their own accord).

As far as I know the shutdown applied only to leisure, hospitality, and retail. Other businesses can still operate (as long as they can do so safely).

Indeed I have seen many places around London where construction and refurbishment work carried-on as normal, I doubt they all had the materials in stock from before the lockdown?

 

[whitenemesis]

Builders merchant are allowed to operate but supplying 'essential' items only, just as B&Q, Wickes etc..
B&Q are running short on some products now and are only receiving 2 deliveries a week, normally 14-21 a week...

 

[markjay]

The purchase of a pint of milk in Tesco when adhering to social distancing rules is as low-risk as buying a new drill at B&Q.

My understanding is that the ban on leisure and retail is there to prevent shoppers from leaving their homes and from traveling necessarily.

Our business is still operating and we continue and provide services to those customers of ours who are not in the leisure and retail business, and are still operating.

The key is to minimise physical travel where possible, and ensure a safe working environment for employees.

But within these constraints, businesses that do not attract consumers and do not cause movement of shoppers are allowed to operate, i.e. they do not necessarily need to be classified as 'essential industry' or employ 'key workers'.

 

[Darrell]

Builders merchant are allowed to operate but supplying 'essential' items only, just as B&Q, Wickes etc..
B&Q are running short on some products now and are only receiving 2 deliveries a week, normally 14-21 a week...

I’m back in tomorrow and expecting deliveries from Wolesley.

 

[whitenemesis]

I’m back in tomorrow and expecting deliveries from Wolesley.

I expect delivery schedules to be revised now we have seen the demand created but it does depend to a large extent on the suppliers

 

[Deleted member 113659]

Builders merchant are allowed to operate but supplying 'essential' items only..

I wish they were around here Peter. ALL builders yards/suppliers (Jewson/TP/Keyline etc) are closed until further notice. I have lots of work booked in but nowhere to get supplies.

I’m hoping that they’ll be reopening as soon as the Lockdown is relaxed a little.

 

[Dryce]

So 'say' there is an allowance for school kids of up to 11 years to return, they might even add opportunity for the summer exams.
If the NHS heads toward overload then lockdown again, if not after a few weeks consider the next relaxation.
Meanwhile 'we' get closer to herd immunity.

In March they were worried about the number of known infections doubling every 3 to 4 days.

That's no longer happening. We're seeing a roughly linear increase in the known infections - if that can be maintained for several weeks and controlled and the hospitals are managing then that's way below the worst case.

So the question is - if you release the lockdown what are the risks? Add in the complication that any ation you take will not show any worst case effects for m,aybe three or four weeks.

And then there is public fear. How many 40 and 50 and 60 year olds in the workforce so keen to get back to normal given what so publicly happened to the PM?