Car values gone mad?

MOR8A

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Sorry if this has already been covered....what the hell is going on with these prices? There are going to be a fair few people who could potentially catch a very big cold on these at some point.

RM Sotheby's London results | PistonHeads
 

grober

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This falls squarely in the " if you have to ask the price you can't afford it territory" I imagine these sums are petty cash to many of the buyers
 

Rosso1

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But some people will think they are buying a investment
 

rifiki

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Yes, I suppose it's loose change to some people.
 

John Jones Jr

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I imagine these sums are petty cash to many of the buyers
No doubt about that. Also the classic car market is not the market of the 80's when people were gobsmacked at Ferrari Dino's going for £150k which bottomed out in the 90's at 30k! Asia inparticular by all accounts has had a major impact and of course deposit returns generally are on the floor.

Anyway, if the market does go all **** up I dare say the vast majority of buyers won't be affected in the slightest and if they are happy to play a long term strategy they may come out ahead while having owned their dream car/s.


Good luck to all those lucky buyers I say slightly begrudgingly. :( :D
 

def90cars

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They mention a collection of AMGs and put a photo of a McLaren! Doh!
 

Red C220

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There are a couple of reasons classic car prices have shot up.

Main reason number one - Historically low interest rates, so once you've filled up your ISA'a Pep's and SIPS and any other acronyms you care to think of the alternatives are the stock market, property or, well classic cars.

Main reason number two - there is no capital gains tax on classic cars, or stamp duty, or lots of other duties that apply to various other investments. But you have to store them and service them and insure them.

Think of it like buying an expensive work of art, but you can drive and enjoy it.

Personally I think the market is overvalued, but I don't think it's any more absurd than the South East/London Property market at present.
 

Dryce

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Main reason number one - Historically low interest rates,

Main reason number two - there is no capital gains tax on classic cars,
And number three - a new generation of buyers and speculators who have no memory of the last bubble in this market.

ISTR that the capital gains or tax on profit didn't apply as long as you were not counted as being a trader - so as long as you didn't trade more than 5 cars a year?
 
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MOR8A

MOR8A

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Yes gents I understand all the ''make some money tax free'' and ''interest rates are low'' stuff, but (and I should have said initially) my point is that these machines imho just are not ''worth'' anywhere near these crazy figures. It just seems absurd that people will value and pay such huge figures for some things that were not that great to start with and arguably worthless by comparison to what is available today. I understand that older cars have more ''character'' etc, but really! I think the bubble will burst.
 

TheFoX

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I understand that older cars have more ''character'' etc....
I think that we have all been conditioned to think that older means more cherished. Now I'm a fan of the Motor Museum at Beaulieu and love looking around their relics, and I certainly wouldn't turn my nose up at taking a few of them for a test drive, but would I really want to live with some of those old fossils on a daily basis.

It's like Sharon Stone. Beautiful in her day, but she is beginning to show her age, and there are newer younger models available. That goes for us blokes as well. No longer am I a catch, what with losing my hair and gaining several stone around the midriff.

The fact is that while we have some nostalgia towards vehicles of yesteryear, modern vehicles are so much more advanced.

My early motoring days were the eighties, where the king of the road was the Sierra Sapphire Cosworth, and ordinary people aspired to cars such as the Escort RS Turbo, or the XR3i (orXR2i). These cars were considered fast by the virtue that they hit 60mph in under 9 seconds.

Move on thirty odd years, and what have we got. Merc diesels hitting 60 in around 6 to 7 seconds, an Astra VXR that pumps out more BHP than classic Ferraris and a range of BMW M's and Merc AMG's that have acceleration figures traditionally attributed to motorbikes. Add to this that cars are now twice the weight of their eighties counterparts, that is some achievement.

Now as to whether modern cars have souls, of course they do. It is what we make of those souls that count. I love my CLS, as do others on this forum. This also goes for C Classes, E Classes, A Classes, and every other class on this forum, regardless of whether the car is a recent build or donkeys years old.

Just think, in fifty years time, someone might desire my CLS, if it is still around.
 

ivan1983

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I was at a classic car show in Alexandra Palace last year (It was more like a dealer show though) And they were interviewing someone from one of the big auction houses and they said a lot of it has to do with investment from China and the like. They have a lot of disposable cash and are being guided by people in the industry....
 

neilrr

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"They have a lot of disposable cash and are being guided exploited by people in the industry...."
 
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roastbeef

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Yes 80's and 90's fords have gone completely mad and I'm sure the bubble will burst ,earlier fords like mk1 escorts and cortina's of the sporting models have been very strong for a while now
 

Fastard

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I sold a 993 C2 just before the values started going up and a Renault 5GT Turbo for buttons. Presumably when I sell my SL 55 that'll be the signal for them to start increasing in value too.
 

Red C220

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There are currently bubbles everywhere.

The Australian property market is now the biggest bubble in property history anywhere.

Classic cars are daft money.

Two bed houses in Surrey are £600K.

And last night I watched The Big Short again as it's so entertaining and pertinent.

The only question is not if it will burst but when? That's the $64 Billion question that all the shorters need to know.

So whats the next trigger? There's always a trigger...
 

Red C220

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I was at a classic car show in Alexandra Palace last year (It was more like a dealer show though) And they were interviewing someone from one of the big auction houses and they said a lot of it has to do with investment from China and the like. They have a lot of disposable cash and are being guided by people in the industry....
China isn't in good shape right now. It's currency is massively overvalued as it's historically controlled exchange rates from central Govt. (to the tune of 60% overvalued).

It was planning to float the Yuan on world FX markets in London, but then we voted to leave the EU so that was quickly put on hold.

China's banks are currently undercapitalised to the tune of about 10x.

Maybe that'll be the next trigger. You can't have year on year double digit growth in an economy without a dip, that's the basic law of economics/capitlism.

Quite ironic for a communist country.

One could suggest the Chinese elite are getting as much capital out of the country before it all goes mammaries up. So the cost of property is less relevant if you're trying get some Millions/Billions out of an economy that's about to go massively pear shaped. It's Chinese Money that's been fuelling the property market growth in Aus and Canada as well as London.

That could be the answer. The smart money is being moved out of the country before the next global financial event.
 
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markjay

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A friend bought a Lancia Delta Integrale 8V a couple of years ago, paid top money for it at the time, and says he didn't think he'll turn a profit so perplexed as to why inexplicably it doubled in value since.
 

Calcifer

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The Ferrari bubble has burst at the moment. Last year, my 550M was worth 30% more than now. Brexit hasn't helped much.
 

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