Clutch not disengaging

[Tony Russell]

Hello,
Over the past couple of days, I have noticed the odd sticky gear change, until today when I have to stop the car and switch if off, then start it in gear to change gear.
Last thing this evening, if I started it in gear, it was actually partially engaged and moving on the starter.

It's an A Calss Vaneo 1.7 CDi BTW.

So the clutch pedal is a bit floppy. There's a fair bit of travel before the only effective bit of the pedal movement is in the last 2cm or so.

There is no problem with slippage, whining, smells or any other clutch type symptoms.

I called a couple of clutch specialists today who either refused the job because it's a dog to drop the engine and change the clutch, or quoted a lot of money.
Changing a fuse just about requires an engine removal on this beast.

Personally, I don't think it's the clutch, I think it's the hydraulics.
Either air in the system (the low pressure feed from the reservoir to the master cylinder was split months ago and I replaced it - no problems since), or else the seals in the master cylinder might have an issue.

There's no leakage on the carpet or anything, and no loss of fluid from the reservoir.

I understand that the slave cylinder is in the clutch housing, so it's back to the full job if that's the case.

I'm clinging to the possible diagnosis I saw in the Peter Russek manual that suggests a bleed or a master cylinder replacement is a cure.

So, I guess I am asking if anyone has any experience of this particular car / symptom ?

Thanks in advance.

Tony

 

[Dieselman]

This will be the CSC (slave cylinder) gone. A drive-train out job.

 

[Tony Russell]

Thanks Dieselman. I really appreciate the reply.
Obviously it's not what I wanted to read :-(

I can see from your post history that you obviously know your stuff.
Can I ask what drives you to bypass the master and go for the slave ?
I'm not at all questioning your prognosis, I just want to understand the system.

If I am getting the engine dropped to replace the slave cylinder, should I go the full 9 yards and get all the other clutch material replaced ?

One franchise I called today (Mr Clutch) quoted £700 for the full job. Is that reasonable ?
And what brands of kit should I avoid ?
He mentioned Valeo and LUK.

Sorry for all the questions, but I got stiffed before and just want to either get it sorted, or accept I need to bin it and buy another car.

Thanks,
Tony

 

[Dieselman]

Valeo and LUK are both good brands.
Definitely fit a complete 3 part clutch kit while the box is out, it's only about 10 minutes more labour.

That box in my pic was a failed CSC, it's always the CSC.

 

[Tony Russell]

Thanks. Really appreciate that.
Is ~£700 reasonable ?
I see the bits are £300 ish from Eurocarparts retail, so ~£400 for an engine drop and rebuild might not be that bad ?
Might as well get everything else tightened up whilst it's out.

Thanks,
Tony

 

[Dieselman]

You could ask around, but doubt you will beat £700 for this job including the CSC.

 

[Tony Russell]

Thanks Dieselman.
Unfortunately, I think I need to bite this mans hand off for a fixed price repair.

Appreciate the time you took to reply.

Tony

 

[Dieselman]

Get them to fit a new auxiliary belt as well if they need the engine out, it's awkward to do in the car.

 

[Tony Russell]

Had a poke around the master cylinder under the pedal this morning and I can hear it "fart" when I press it down.
Surely that's not right ?

I'm thinking I might get that changed first, seeing it's comparatively cheap and simple. The part is ~£50 and looks like an hour or so's work.
Clutching at straws here to avoid the big engine drop

 

[Tony Russell]

My mate (he's a good general mechanic who insisted I was wasting our time) and I bled out the hydraulic fluid from the gearbox earlier on.
If came out black.
He said he'd never seen that before.

Kept pumping and topping up, and it's got the firmness back.
Went a run and there's no problem at all.

I don't for one second think it's cured, I think we just removed the black stuff and the clean material seems to be working for a bit.
definitely no fluid loss anywhere though.

So I am a bit confused. Does brake fluid in the clutch go black when it's old and never changed and therefore lose it's properties, or does it mean there's something burst ?

I'm not under any illusion that I am probably going to have to drop the engine and get a 3 part kit fitted sooner or later, I just want to understand what's going on.

 

[spike60]

I used to look after a Bmw diesel with a very heavy clutch and the fluid in that was always black, it also chewed through master cylinders and I assumed the black was from the seals.

 

[Tony Russell]

Just catching up.
The original post was January 2013 - a year and 5 months ago.
Since doing that clutch fluid change, there have been no more issues from that department.
I'm not trying to throw out a karma boomerang and say it's all good, just that the fluid change avoided the engine drop and clutch replacement so anyone reading this and looking at the same issue might want to try the same.