Consumer Law.

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Godot

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Seeing Very Tall Dave's thread of What a swiz has reminded me to post this link from the Daily Wail 25.5.09 , as posted to another Forum, which i am a Member of :

Retailers keep secret EU law that gives consumers a TWO-year guarantee on goods | Mail Online

Shoppers with faulty goods are being routinely denied repairs or replacements because they are not told about their rights under a guarantee scheme.

EU law creates a minimum period of two years in which a faulty product can be returned, and in England and Wales the figure is six years.


But many High Street stores are denying customers these rights, either because the staff don't know the law or because they think they can get away with it.


Generally, retailers hide behind the offer of a standard one-year guarantee and refuse to do anything when this lapses. Consumer experts say this means they are failing to abide by the law.


Most shoppers are in the dark about their rights and often simply throw out a faulty product.


At one time, household products were manufactured to last, but the industry can now make more money by churning out 'junk products' with a short lifespan.


Chris Warner, consumer lawyer at Which?, said: 'While it is true that the EU consumer rules mean stores should repair or replace an item that breaks inside two years, the Sale of Goods Act affords consumers protection up to six years from the date of purchase.'




He said the existence of one-year manufacturers' guarantees can confuse the situation. This is because stores wrongly deny any liability when these lapse.



'I don't think it's too cynical to say that retailers have been happy to let consumers think they have only a year's guarantee,' he added.
Another aspect of this confusion is that stores are able to profit from selling extended guarantees covering household products.



In the past, some electrical chains have made more money on selling these insurance policies than on the goods they offer.



Typically, a retailer would charge £150 for a three-year warranty on a £350 washing machine, while the same cover direct from the manufacturer might come in at £100.


In 2005, it was estimated that consumers were paying as much as £200million a year over the odds for these expensive warranties.

article-0-02F42373000005DC-771_468x468.jpg
Tesco replaced retired teacher, Peter Ward's £400 Technika television after it went wrong 18 months after he bought it from the chain's Batley branch because he quoted the EU law



The Government's Business department, BERR, said it is planning measures to clarify the law.


'We will also be launching a campaign to raise awareness of consumer rights,' a spokesman said.


The problems have been highlighted by Peter Ward, a customer of Britain's biggest retailer, Tesco.

The retired teacher, who lives with his wife Gill in Liversedge, near Leeds, bought a £400 Technika television set from the chain's Batley-branch.

When it failed after 18 months, Tesco told him it did not stock the parts to fix the set.


Mr Ward, 59, said: 'I was bounced around between different departments. The whole thing appeared to be dedicated to confusion.'


However, he was aware of his rights under EU law and so he and his wife took the set back to the branch.


But the store's duty manager refused to accept any liability and he said that because the set was more than 12 months old, Tesco would not repair or replace it.


This scenario is played out on a daily basis in many retailers' stores up and down the country.


In this case the Wards refused to back down. 'Eventually, the manager went off to telephone someone at head office,' said Mr Ward.


'He returned admitting that the European law was correct, and as the Technika set was not repairable we were entitled to a new set.' :bannana::bannana::bannana:
Maybe Print it out & keep to keep in your receipt's file ?
 
Nice to know, but making it happen is another thing....

Depending on "the good", demonstrating non-conformity with the contract will become harder and harder as time passes by.

Only Meldrews and the tenacious need apply for this job methinks as it could involve a long negotiation...
 
Did someone call?






.
 
Does "EU Law" apply in member countries, or is it only enforceable in the European Court?

If it's as clear-cut as the article implies, then why doesn't the Office of Fair Trading (or some such body) start laying down the law and stop retailers selling things with 12mths guarantee?

Of course this cuts both ways, in much of Europe new car warranty is only 2 yrs.
 
Nice to know, but making it happen is another thing....

Depending on "the good", demonstrating non-conformity with the contract will become harder and harder as time passes by.

Only Meldrews and the tenacious need apply for this job methinks as it could involve a long negotiation...

Not really, I've successfully used the 6 year rule with John Lewis after their 5 year warranty ran out on a TV.

I had to stand my ground and be rather stern with them but 15 minutes waving my arms around and raising my voice in and amongs all the Saturday shoppers is all it took.
 
Nice example Sp!ke, but John Lewis are mindful of their reputation and having an irate customer on their premises at a busy time made a bit of a difference.

My guess is that the product was one with perceived quality that retains a significant amount of its life even after five of the six years....

But, working out how to apply the rule to something less "well performing" in Currys on a Monday night might be more entertaining :D
 
Why oh why after all these years of "Consumer" legislation if you want to have something repaired/replaced and if you are told "xxxxxxx" and you know that is wrong and you are within your "rights", why one has to persevere to try to have the matter addressed.

If eventually your "rights" are acknowledge does the retailer say "well you cannot win them all" and carry on regardless, in the knowledge that no sanctions are likely?
 
Why oh why after all these years of "Consumer" legislation if you want to have something repaired/replaced and if you are told "xxxxxxx" and you know that is wrong and you are within your "rights", why one has to persevere to try to have the matter addressed.

If eventually your "rights" are acknowledge does the retailer say "well you cannot win them all" and carry on regardless, in the knowledge that no sanctions are likely?

There is a saying amongst lawyers, and I wish I could remember the exact wording, but it basically states that you can have as many laws & rights as you like, but they only mean something after they have been upheld in court.

As the majority of people are unwilling to sue companies at the drop of a hat, they know how much they can get away with & act accordingly.

Russ
 
If it's out of warranty you can still claim under the SOGA provided the equipment is within its expected lifetime, the fault is not down to accidental/misuse/wear and tear and it's not over six years old (five in Scotland).

Found out about this expected lifetime many years ago from Which - only used it once back in 2003 to get a digital Camera repaired after about 2 years, no problem - email to the retailier (with appropriate links to Which article) and repair was arranged.

Did try it again with an HP printer at PC World - they fobbed me off and told me to phone the HP support line (SOGA says the retailer should sort it for you). Didn't feel like arguing at the time, so phoned up prepared to be disapointed and walk back into the shop for a stand up arguement. But I was plesently suprised when HP arranged for a new printer to be shipped out that day and the old one picked up the day after (using the packaging from the new one).
 
It's really not that straightforward. I've generally won these things when I've dug my heels in (new screen in a nearly 3yr old Dell laptop was a recent success) but it's never easy and if the retailer digs their heels in then, sure, you could go to small claims court but you might not win.

If push comes to shove then the onus is on you to prove that there is some inherent defect in the item and that it hasn't just worn out. That's how car manufacturers get away with not paying for, or only making partial contributions to, out of warranty repairs.
 
I'm probably just being picky but if it just "wears" out before it's expected lifetime you still have a case (but then again premature failure isn't really wearing out anyway even if the symptoms are the same).

But yes if the retailer digs their heals in it can be very difficult as they can hide behind the fact that the onus is on the customer.

For something like a fridge or freezer that should just sit there 24 hours a day it's fairly easy to say a compressor failure after 3 years is well before the expected life and so must be a design/manufacturing defect.

At the other end of the scale - a laptop being a good example, there are all sorts of questions about duty cycle, treatment etc they can put in your way.
 
There is a saying amongst lawyers, and I wish I could remember the exact wording, but it basically states that you can have as many laws & rights as you like, but they only mean something after they have been upheld in court.

As the majority of people are unwilling to sue companies at the drop of a hat, they know how much they can get away with & act accordingly.

Russ

How very true, its not right, but it happens.

I have found during my research that a letter from MB informing the owner that a charge of £25 per day for storage if the car is not collected is used.

This, of course, is a load of B*****ks, but, must work as they keep using it. I have had two of these letters. I was concerned at first so I asked a Barrister, Professor of Law and world expert on the Tort Act and was informed it is a load of B*****ks. The last time the letter arrived I invited MB to take me to Court and prove that a Contract existed between ourselves on this matter, silence.

Customer service at its very best!

:wallbash:
 
Not really, I've successfully used the 6 year rule with John Lewis after their 5 year warranty ran out on a TV.

I had to stand my ground and be rather stern with them but 15 minutes waving my arms around and raising my voice in and amongs all the Saturday shoppers is all it took.


You have to be very, very careful if you choose to do this.

Waving arms can easily be seen as intimidation, and in today's zero tolerance climate (backed by store CCTV) you are less likely to get a repair, and far more likely to be marched off the premises by store security.

You could easily end up with a Criminal Record. Is it worth that for a repair to a 5 year old telly? I think not.

.
 
Waving arms can easily be seen as intimidation, and in today's zero tolerance climate (backed by store CCTV) you are less likely to get a repair, and far more likely to be marched off the premises by store security.
While I don't doubt the veracity of your comment it serves to illustrate the ridiculous state of affairs that we find ourselves in today whereby a) a very small minority of people are far too willing to resort to violence when they can't get their own way, and b) non-threatening behaviour can be so quickly misinterpreted with such disproportionate consequences.
 
You have to be very, very careful if you choose to do this.

Waving arms can easily be seen as intimidation, and in today's zero tolerance climate (backed by store CCTV) you are less likely to get a repair, and far more likely to be marched off the premises by store security.

You could easily end up with a Criminal Record. Is it worth that for a repair to a 5 year old telly? I think not.

.

Section 5 Criminal Justice Act, its a catch all clause, very popular with dealing with "anti-social" behavior which would include irate customers, beware of it! Use the Small Claims Court, its safer.
 
While I don't doubt the veracity of your comment it serves to illustrate the ridiculous state of affairs that we find ourselves in today whereby a) a very small minority of people are far too willing to resort to violence when they can't get their own way, and b) non-threatening behaviour can be so quickly misinterpreted with such disproportionate consequences.

So very true!

I have allowed MB to treat me like an idiot to the point that MB have contradicted themselves even in the Witness box, under Oath.

See; companycardriver.co.uk/news/artical/?_id412564719
 
^^^^ linky no worky ^^^^
 
At one time, household products were manufactured to last, but the industry can now make more money by churning out 'junk products' with a short lifespan.

Because that's what the market demands.

Then people moan when their cheepo junk croaks after 13 months....
 

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