E63 V G63 and a boys car

[Alfie]

I hate to say it as they're really great bikes to actually ride but the 999 very much split opinions on looks too,personally I didn't like the front but always thought the back looked great, the exhaust was such a modern looking departure from the twin Termis everyone was used to on the 916/996/998.

Very true, it is a bit ugly at the front I agree. However, I bought it not for its looks so much. The sound is awesome, the investment good. Its actually dreadful to ride. It is unbelievably uncomfortable!

 

[Oli]

View attachment 91513 View attachment 91514
...

That’s just being unfair, the Cybertruck is admittedly hideous, but then:

 

[Oli]

Very true, it is a bit ugly at the front I agree. However, I bought it not for its looks so much. The sound is awesome, the investment good. Its actually dreadful to ride. It is unbelievably uncomfortable!

I’ve only ridden a 749 and didn’t think it was too bad for a sports bike, I’ve currently got a Panigale V4 and if you thought the 999 is bad then it surely has to be a torture instrument, never ridden a bike that pretty much does it best to burn you in town traffic it kicks out an unbelievable amount of heat!, and the clutch isn’t nice pulling away or in traffic but get it on a country road or on a track and it’s a different story,what an incredible bike!, as much as it’s flawed I’d not want to have anything else.

 

[MrRight]

That’s just being unfair, the Cybertruck is admittedly hideous, but then:

Sadly that Tesla doesn't actually exist, does it ? ... Silly thing doesn't even have doors. It is someone's wet dream I assume but the real thing will have the usual Tesla build quality I am sure

This does exist though

 

[Oli]

Sadly that Tesla doesn't actually exist, does it ? ... Silly thing doesn't even have doors. It is someone's wet dream I assume but the real thing will have the usual Tesla build quality I am sure

This does exist though
View attachment 91532

It is due this year IIRC, to be fair though you can't really knock Teslas build quality while defending JLRs, they're one of the worst out there! they're consistent though, consistently bad, and I say this as a former owner of 3 LR products, or in JLR speak-"Air suspension inactive", "Transmission fault visit workshop".
The modern Jags do look nice to be fair to them but I'd not touch one, and if I had the money to buy a new 4x4 I'd not get anything from Land Rover, which is such a shame because if they didn't suffer so much from poor quality control they'd be absolute world beaters.

 

[MrRight]

That’s just being unfair, the Cybertruck is admittedly hideous, but then:

Sadly that Tesla doesn't actually exist, does it ? ... Silly thing doesn't even have doors. It is someone's wet dream I assume but the real thing will have the usual Tesla build quality I am sure

This does though
View attachment 91532

It is due this year IIRC, to be fair though you can't really knock Teslas build quality while defending JLRs, they're one of the worst out there! they're consistent though, consistently bad, and I say this as a former owner of 3 LR products, or in JLR speak-"Air suspension inactive", "Transmission fault visit workshop".
The modern Jags do look nice to be fair to them but I'd not touch one, and if I had the money to buy a new 4x4 I'd not get anything from Land Rover, which is such a shame because if they didn't suffer so much from poor quality control they'd be absolute world beaters.

If we go full circle on your original post, it related to the looks of the tesla vs the XF. The XF has far superior styling vs the vacuum cleaner. Sure it is fast and modern etc, but it is nothing special to look at and is in fact quite disappointing on that front. The smaller Teslas look even worse. On a serious note, there is ofcourse more to it than looks, though I would never ever take a Tesla over an E63s or a countless other car models.

 

[Oli]

Sadly that Tesla doesn't actually exist, does it ? ... Silly thing doesn't even have doors. It is someone's wet dream I assume but the real thing will have the usual Tesla build quality I am sure

This does though
View attachment 91532

If we go full circle on your original post, it related to the looks of the tesla vs the XF. The XF has far superior styling vs the vacuum cleaner. Sure it is fast and modern etc, but it is nothing special to look at and is in fact quite disappointing on that front. The smaller Teslas look even worse. On a serious note, there is ofcourse more to it than looks, though I would never ever take a Tesla over an E63s or a countless other car models.

I think the Model S is a good looking car, not keen on the X though, the 3 is ok but not amazing.
To actually drive though they’re brilliant plus the tech in them is cool, that’s what appeals about them to me, enough that I could even overlook the lack of noise that a nice V8 makes, not that I don’t appreciate that too, loved the spitfire like sound and supercharger whine that my old E55 and SL55 made.

 

[MrRight]

I think the Model S is a good looking car, not keen on the X though, the 3 is ok but not amazing.
To actually drive though they’re brilliant plus the tech in them is cool, that’s what appeals about them to me, enough that I could even overlook the lack of noise that a nice V8 makes, not that I don’t appreciate that too, loved the spitfire like sound and supercharger whine that my old E55 and SL55 made.

The semi autonomous tech is the only thing that is of interest to me with the teslas. That said merc isnt far behind and given we have to be in control of cars in the UK, distronic etc is good enough. The stock sound of the old 55s is very good but is nowhere near in the same class as the w204 c63 or w212 or w213 e classes which are a riot in comparison. While I'm not a fan of the crappy infotainment screens on the new mercs , the Tesla iPad pro , portrait computer monitor set up is downright atrocious .

The model s is quite decent looking for sure compared to the other Tesla models but compared to other car designs , is not anything special . Some features are cool but more of a gimmick like that silly light show which is cringe inducing, but not more so than the botox job on Elon Musk' forehead which is more aerodynamic than his Tesla models

 

[Oli]

The semi autonomous tech is the only thing that is of interest to me with the teslas. That said merc isnt far behind and given we have to be in control of cars in the UK, distronic etc is good enough. The stock sound of the old 55s is very good but is nowhere near in the same class as the w204 c63 or w212 or w213 e classes which are a riot in comparison. While I'm not a fan of the crappy infotainment screens on the new mercs , the Tesla iPad pro , portrait computer monitor set up is downright atrocious .

The model s is quite decent looking for sure compared to the other Tesla models but compared to other car designs , is not anything special . Some features are cool but more of a gimmick like that silly light show which is cringe inducing, but not more so than the botox job on Elon Musk' forehead which is more aerodynamic than his Tesla models

The almost self driving thing feels quite weird from my fairly short drive of a Model S, but I have to say it is really good, the main thing I obviously loved is the performance though, it was just stupid grin inducing fun pulling away from the lights, the lack of noise was weird too at first but after half an hour I started to quite like it.
I'd actually given some thought to getting the earlier 5.5 Bi Turbo E63 or CLS63 as they're great value now but decided against it. Unfortunately the roads are always so busy here there would be little chance to enjoy the car, or even the noise as most of the time is spent in stop start traffic .

 

[MrRight]

The almost self driving thing feels quite weird from my fairly short drive of a Model S, but I have to say it is really good, the main thing I obviously loved is the performance though, it was just stupid grin inducing fun pulling away from the lights, the lack of noise was weird too at first but after half an hour I started to quite like it.
I'd actually given some thought to getting the earlier 5.5 Bi Turbo E63 or CLS63 as they're great value now but decided against it. Unfortunately the roads are always so busy here there would be little chance to enjoy the car, or even the noise as most of the time is spent in stop start traffic .

the model 3 performance certainly beats the c63s easily in a straight line

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

and being cheaper, I'm sure will attract many buyers for its jaw dropping performance but there is more to enjoying a car than speed. the model 3 does look comical to be honest. a model s looks much better. needing a phone app to open a car... hmmm not sure I'm a fan of that , or the interior or that tasteless TV monitor or the seats but love the roof. smartphone only option to open the car? not sure about that idea at all. maybe it is more secure than keyless go

youre right about the roads, I think being in Surrey, we are cursed with quite mediocre roads. I have to drive hundreds of miles to Wales or Yorkshire dales or lake district etc to enjoy proper roads . I did 5 read trips last year and they cost me around 6k in mileage just to get decent driving roads.

A 5.5 TT would be quite a nice addition, they're crazy engines ... but a Nissan leaf might be the more sensible choice

 

[Oli]

the model 3 performance certainly beats the c63s easily in a straight line

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

and being cheaper, I'm sure will attract many buyers for its jaw dropping performance but there is more to enjoying a car than speed. the model 3 does look comical to be honest. a model s looks much better. needing a phone app to open a car... hmmm not sure I'm a fan of that , or the interior or that tasteless TV monitor or the seats but love the roof. smartphone only option to open the car? not sure about that idea at all. maybe it is more secure than keyless go

youre right about the roads, I think being in Surrey, we are cursed with quite mediocre roads. I have to drive hundreds of miles to Wales or Yorkshire dales or lake district etc to enjoy proper roads . I did 5 read trips last year and they cost me around 6k in mileage just to get decent driving roads.

A 5.5 TT would be quite a nice addition, they're crazy engines ... but a Nissan leaf might be the more sensible choice

I don't hate the Model 3 but don't think it's nearly as nice looking as the S either, if I had to rate them in terms of looks I'd say Roadster(when it arrives)>Model S>>>>Model 3>>>>>>>>Model X>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cybertruck(when it comes)

I'm not sure what the newer 4.0 V8TTs are like in terms of tuning potential?, I know the 5.5s and stuff like the V10 RS6 have huge potential and can be take to 700 ish BHP quite easily!.

I don't blame you for travelling miles in search of better roads, having a performance car in Surrey is a waste of time 95% of the time now!, it's sort of why I'm happy with a 3 litre diesel as it gives fairly brisk performance when asked and decent fuel economy for most of the time I'm stuck in stop start traffic.
I don't go quite as far as you but if I want to enjoy not being in traffic it usually involves an early morning start on the bike on a summer weekend morning or taking it on a trackday these days.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

I don't hate the Model 3 but don't think it's nearly as nice looking as the S either, if I had to rate them in terms of looks I'd say Roadster(when it arrives)>Model S>>>>Model 3>>>>>>>>Model X>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cybertruck(when it comes)

I'm not sure what the newer 4.0 V8TTs are like in terms of tuning potential?, I know the 5.5s and stuff like the V10 RS6 have huge potential and can be take to 700 ish BHP quite easily!.

I don't blame you for travelling miles in search of better roads, having a performance car in Surrey is a waste of time 95% of the time now!, it's sort of why I'm happy with a 3 litre diesel as it gives fairly brisk performance when asked and decent fuel economy for most of the time I'm stuck in stop start traffic.
I don't go quite as far as you but if I want to enjoy not being in traffic it usually involves an early morning start on the bike on a summer weekend morning or taking it on a trackday these days.

The 4.0 V8 engines have plenty of tuning potential, and probably just much as the 5.5 V8 engines. In fact the 4.0 comes with a higher state of tune from the factory in some models. Great engine, and much more raucous than the 5.5 and 6.2 engines when they come out of the factory.

 

[MrRight]

I don't hate the Model 3 but don't think it's nearly as nice looking as the S either, if I had to rate them in terms of looks I'd say Roadster(when it arrives)>Model S>>>>Model 3>>>>>>>>Model X>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cybertruck(when it comes)

I'm not sure what the newer 4.0 V8TTs are like in terms of tuning potential?, I know the 5.5s and stuff like the V10 RS6 have huge potential and can be take to 700 ish BHP quite easily!.

I don't blame you for travelling miles in search of better roads, having a performance car in Surrey is a waste of time 95% of the time now!, it's sort of why I'm happy with a 3 litre diesel as it gives fairly brisk performance when asked and decent fuel economy for most of the time I'm stuck in stop start traffic.
I don't go quite as far as you but if I want to enjoy not being in traffic it usually involves an early morning start on the bike on a summer weekend morning or taking it on a trackday these days.

I feel you regarding the roads and traffic , luckily I get a lot of empty roads where i am for when I get to drive around ie at 6.30am and after 7.30 PM but the little b roads have too many potholes in them etc and generally are not all that interesting either. South downs national park has some supposed half decent roads so if I come across any, I'll let you know. 3 litre diesel is plenty and unlike myself who is on first name terms with folks at the local shell filling stations, you hopefully dont have to visit them nearly enough to be recognised by the staff there !!

Re tuning the 4.0 , it depends on which car it is in, in the c63s, my personal opinion is that the power is more than enough and mostly unusable until you're going at higher speeds and even then the tail is always wagging except on a very warm , dry day. I can almost never put my foot down more than 50 percent. I'm very accustomed to going out for a drive, parking the car and smelling burning rubber already without a tune and without trying to push the car to the limit.
It should be quite easy to get more gains from that engine but a lot of 5.5tt engines can be tuned further I suspect

 

[Oli]

I feel you regarding the roads and traffic , luckily I get a lot of empty roads where i am for when I get to drive around ie at 6.30am and after 7.30 PM but the little b roads have too many potholes in them etc and generally are not all that interesting either. South downs national park has some supposed half decent roads so if I come across any, I'll let you know. 3 litre diesel is plenty and unlike myself who is on first name terms with folks at the local shell filling stations, you hopefully dont have to visit them nearly enough to be recognised by the staff there !!

Re tuning the 4.0 , it depends on which car it is in, in the c63s, my personal opinion is that the power is more than enough and mostly unusable until you're going at higher speeds and even then the tail is always wagging except on a very warm , dry day. I can almost never put my foot down more than 50 percent. I'm very accustomed to going out for a drive, parking the car and smelling burning rubber already without a tune and without trying to push the car to the limit.
It should be quite easy to get more gains from that engine but a lot of 5.5tt engines can be tuned further I suspect

There are some great roads out in Hampshire and towards Salisbury too, great on a bike and think they would be on a car too but unfortunately probably only early in the morning on 4 wheels as it's much harder to overtake!.

 

[MrGreedy]

When somebody cracks the battery capacity, charging time, and charging time versus battery life, problems, and I've no doubt somebody will, electric cars will become, at least theoretically, a viable proposition for Mr. Average. I say theoretically, because there will then be the cost of the technology, and hence the purchase cost, and the charging network, to be addressed.

I'd love electric cars to be the answer, but they are, at best, pollution movers. Moving pollution from congested urban environments, to wherever you generate the electricity. Which is usually less developed economies that rely on coal at present, because you can get the power from solar or wind, built from materials required for those technologies by buying them in at 'financially viable' rates, manufactured not in our backyard so we can ignore the carbon and environmental cost. Which means they are green, so people can pay themselves on the back and live in ignorance.

One of the major roadblocks to electric and battery cars is that, for example, the UK to become all electric car, it would require the world's supply of copper (or other metal that slips my memory), leaving nothing for anything or anyone else. This just cannot happen.

Something like solar generated hydrogen would be much more sustainable and environmentally friendly, but which government wants to promote a solution that is reliant on a commodity from another country or continent (sunshine 365)? That's not a vote winner is it! And that's what most things are driven by I'm afraid; personal gain.

 

[SW18]

it would require the world's supply of copper (or other metal that slips my memory)

Cobalt, IIRC, though % content of it in batteries is falling steadily through innovation.