Have I missed my perfect car....

[Rich764089]

I have a few cars and all have different strengths weaknesses and uses. But none are perfect and I'm always on the lookout for additions. My S212 E63 is the pick of my bunch; I love it and hope to keep it for many years. The downsides for me are the box (actually quite good in auto, but I love manuals/ changing manually), and drive by wire throttle.

So... have I missed any cars that fit the bill for me? The prerequisites would be:

Large estate (I.e. larger boot space than R/S4, Focus, 3 series etc.) but still handles reasonably well
Manual box
>400bhp or EASILY tunable to this level
Forced induction preferable

Always used to love JDM cars, but the 3.0R spec B is not easily moddable (NA), and the Forester STi engine stories put me off. No estate M5s since the V10, and the SMG makes those a non starter. Considered a last gen S6 as great potential from the engine, but seems the S tronic can't take it. RS6, Golf R, Cupra 300, M5, S6, etc all have potential, but none have a manual box..... there is a certain Vauxhall that did! I've never driven the insignia vxr, but fail to get excited about it, and all reviews are pretty apathetic about performance and handling.

 

[Doodle]

You've missed the boat on Golf R/Cupra, you'd have to look at the previous gen to get a manual box as the newly released models are DSG only.

 

[350cls]

Did you not try the gearbox in all its available settings on your test drive.

I personally think the MCT box is rather unique to say the least. In M mode it is just as good as a manual. Better for me as you don't have to ingage a gear with your left hand, you simply pull a paddle.


I don't get the negative feedback the MCT gets. It has four options available. It caters for all driving types.

 

[Rich764089]

You've missed the boat on Golf R/Cupra, you'd have to look at the previous gen to get a manual box as the newly released models are DSG only.

True. I'm not sure the estate golf R was ever available as a manual? Nor the cupra 300 st... only the 280/290 st?

 

[Rich764089]

Did you not try the gearbox in all its available settings on your test drive.

I personally think the MCT box is rather unique to say the least. In M mode it is just as good as a manual. Better for me as you don't have to ingage a gear with your left hand, you simply pull a paddle.


I don't get the negative feedback the MCT gets. It has four options available. It caters for all driving types.

Yes and I was aware of its limitations. Don't get me wrong, I do think the box is very good. The issue many have, including me, is the lag between paddle click and gear change. Not strictly the box itself I guess?

 

[350cls]

Yes and I was aware of its limitations. Don't get me wrong, I do think the box is very good. The issue many have, including me, is the lag between paddle click and gear change. Not strictly the box itself I guess?

How quick is quick, I suppose it's what owners feel is right for them. I personally find no delay and is on point when I pull the paddle on either up or down shifting.

Another thing I don't get changing a gear manually can't be as quick as pulling a paddle. I wouldn't want a big monster engine car with a manual stick nowadays. I had the E39 which was a 6 speed manual but would I go back to it after something like an MCT transmission, not a chance.

 

[SarahAnn200]

I wouldn't bother with a Cupra. I bought a Cupra 300 ST 69 pre reg in January 2021 and got rid a month later. The interior and build quality was so cheap. I couldn't live with it. The satnav was crp and then I found out the crp satnav is a well known issue with owners but it was the cheap interior that i hated after having Jags, BMW, Mercs and Audis. It felt like it was a £20k new car not a nearly £40k car. It's the most I've ever lost on a car too. £4k in one month but I hated it.

 

[Rich764089]

How quick is quick, I suppose it's what owners feel is right for them. I personally find no delay and is on point when I pull the paddle on either up or down shifting.

Another thing I don't get changing a gear manually can't be as quick as pulling a paddle. I wouldn't want a big monster engine car with a manual stick nowadays. I had the E39 which was a 6 speed manual but would I go back to it after something like an MCT transmission, not a chance.

Yes exactly, each to their own. Less delay on downshift, but under hard acceleration the delay in upshift definitely equates to several hundred rpm from paddle press to gear change. I do love the car still, and agree the MCT suits the E63... but if in a quest for a perfect car I'll be fussy

Totally agree that fully manual gear changes are slower, but many like the more mechanical nature and feel greater "connection" to the driving experience. Horses for courses.

 

[Rich764089]

I wouldn't bother with a Cupra. I bought a Cupra 300 ST 69 pre reg in January 2021 and got rid a month later. The interior and build quality was so cheap. I couldn't live with it. The satnav was crp and then I found out the crp satnav is a well known issue with owners but it was the cheap interior that i hated after having Jags, BMW, Mercs and Audis. It felt like it was a £20k new car not a nearly £40k car. It's the most I've ever lost on a car too. £4k in one month but I hated it.

Wow, that's quite a damning indictment! I was just about to buy one when we entered the first lockdown! Seems many prefer the 2wd cupras.

I have an Octavia vrs, so maybe cheap interior wouldn't bother me that's not a £40k car though...

 

[350cls]

Yes exactly, each to their own. Less delay on downshift, but under hard acceleration the delay in upshift definitely equates to several hundred rpm from paddle press to gear change. I do love the car still, and agree the MCT suits the E63... but if in a quest for a perfect car I'll be fussy

Totally agree that fully manual gear changes are slower, but many like the more mechanical nature and feel greater "connection" to the driving experience. Horses for courses.

I don't get or feel any delay with upshifting at all.


Could always have a manual gearbox installed, if that is your ultimate desired gearbox type. I prefer the much easier use of a paddle to change gear . Non of that dropping the clutch carry on....

 

[Rich764089]

Hmm.... sure I'd read other threads where people notice a delay with the MCT paddles. Perhaps just me!

Changing to manual in the E63 is waaayyyy too big a job for me!

 

[Skd884]

Hmm.... sure I'd read other threads where people notice a delay with the MCT paddles. Perhaps just me!

Changing to manual in the E63 is waaayyyy too big a job for me!

Correct there is 100% a very slight delay.

 

[350cls]

I don't get no delay with up or down shifts.

I drive hard when the road suits, not always but I do stick it. And I never feel delay within a gear change up or down.

Could it be that you've that you have had mods to the Cars power out put and torque that you have left the technology of the gearbox capabilities behind in some degree.

Who exactly has the correct call on this. It makes me actually chuckle that some one comes up with an observation and people seem to just run along with what has been said.

Maybe "the people's gearbox" that is showing signs of delaymeant when engaged aren't performing correctly.

I don't feel or "get" any delay when I pull a paddle on my gearbox in M mode. It feels on point

I press the switch the light comes on it would freak me out it the light come on before I pressed the switch

 

[Rich764089]

I thought it was perceived as "fact" the MCT has a slight delay on paddles. Its not about following others' opinion, just what you feel! I'm sure most journo reviews e.g. Chris Harris, also reported this but it's been a while since I've read/ watched them.

I do have mods but don't believe that's the issue.

I also have a delay on a couple of light switches in my house believe it or not.....

 

[350cls]

It does come across that your not happy with the gearbox capabilities, I don't get the so called delay that you are experiencing or maybe you are over expecting the box to behave. I see as i find and for me the changes feel instant.

I'm not sure what you are expecting. Maybe you should of investigated more with the gearbox before you purchased a car with the MCT!!

 

[Rich764089]

It does come across that your not happy with the gearbox capabilities, I don't get the so called delay that you are experiencing or maybe you are over expecting the box to behave. I see as i find and for me the changes feel instant.

I'm not sure what you are expecting. Maybe you should of investigated more with the gearbox before you purchased a car with the MCT!!

I investigated fully and knew exactly what I was buying. The box is as I expected it to be, but for my taste it's a weak point of the car. I still love the car, but this thread was about finding the perfect car... which probably doesn't exist.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

I don’t think you missed the boat, I’m not sure that the boat was ever in the harbour, so unless you heavily modify a car then I believe that it’s unlikely that you’ll find the car you’re looking for.

I assume that the manual gearbox is the key requirement for you because if you’ll accept a torque converter or twin clutch automatic transmission then there’s a lot to choose from with the other criteria.

If the manual gearbox is important then maybe an Alpine B10 3.3, would give you what you’re looking for but would need turning to get close to 400 BHP, and there’s one for sale on Autotrader right now.

Again if the manual gearbox is important then compromising on boot size allows options like the Audi S4 or RS4. The V8 modes seem easier to find for sale but a tuned 2.7 biturbo could be an option.

 

[Rich764089]

And that's what I was wondering..... have I missed something or am I chasing a unicorn.

Yes, I think the manual box makes it impossible!

I had a manual B8 S4 estate (supercharged V6) which was a great car to drive with the sports diff, and stage 2 was 480bhp. But I sold as the boot wasn't big enough.

B10 is an interesting option I'd not thought of thanks! I couldn't see an estate, did they make an estate?

That also makes me think that there were a few manual 535i with the N55 I think. but I think 400bhp is fairly ambitious for those without fairly extensive mods.

Sorry, sacrilege on a MB forum! I'll definitely be keeping the E63, but always on the lookout for cars I've not experienced!

 

[350cls]

Alpina, also made a B8 6 speed manual with a 4.6 V8 engine. In the E36 chassis. Saloon, coupe, and estate, but hen's teeth are more common.

Give that MCT some stick man, Stop faffing about

BMW/Alpina for the purests out there!


or be one of a kind a put a floor change gearbox into that 63. Then you will have your perfect combo

 

[Rich764089]

Thanks for the suggestions will keep my eyes peeled for the Alpina hen's teeth!

I'd love to do a manual conversion but I shudder to think what the cost would be!