Hello and Introduction

[Nikey30]

Hi All,

I joined the forum earlier this week and thought a hello to all fellow MB members and a brief intro was a polite way to join the forum. I hope I have posted in the right place, if not then if the mods can move that would be great!

I am a big petrol head, living on the Isle of Man, I am sure you may know it for the TT bike races and the fact we have a de-restricted mountain road, it’s a great place to enjoy cars and motorbikes!

I own an E46 M3 Csl (past 11 years) and a Caterham R500, living just a few miles away from the Mountain Road I enjoy a blast out when weather and time permits.
The BMW and Caterham don't see much action as I have a young family and need convenience, hence I also have a RR Sport which is I deem the hack wagon!

I have recently developed a bad itch for a C63 saloon, we have a few over here and I always take time to admire. In addition I think the 4 drs and boot make it "family friendly" whilst being a great car for me to enjoy! I do minimal daily miles as I work from home so Mpg is not a big concern.

I am trying to gain knowledge so I can source a relevant car. These C63’s are a bit confusing! I am really looking for a white car and from the little I
have learnt over the past few days I would be thinking a facelift car is what I am looking for due to updated interior and tweaks to the gearbox.

I am still lost on PPP specs. I am gathering these were some minor tweaks to the exterior (carbon boot lip) and stiffer suspension/bigger wheels/more power and composite brakes. Overall the PPP spec sounds like something I would want, only thing I don’t want is too hard a ride as our roads on the Isle of Man are not very good quality and with this being deemed a family car I don’t want any complaints from the other half!
Maybe someone who uses their C63 for family duties could provide some insight. If the suspension is a lot harder on PPP cars then I would likely opt for a non ppp spec and have the softer ride whilst making suitable mods from there to catch up to PPP spec whilst keeping ride quality in place.

I have set a budget of approx. £30-35K for the new addition, From looking at Autotrader, this seems to be a budget that can work for a post facelift car, would appreciate any thoughts from existing owners and any guidance to assist in my search.

I hope to secure a suitable car in the near future and will look forward to showing it off with pics :0
In the meantime great to join the forum and long live big cc petrol power !!

 

[StuartK]

Welcome and personally I would buy a non PP pack car (I did)

Then get a eurocharged map and Quaife LSD (also same as mine)

Overall you will be financially better off and not pay the PPP premium which IMO isn't worth it.

I went pre facelift as I think externally they look more aggressive.

 

[Nikey30]

Hi Stuart, thanks for your comments, certainly I am not looking to spend excess money on a car that has added spec which isn't deemed value for money, with all my cars I have enjoyed adding mods to bring them to where I want them to be. My thoughts being I purchase a non PP car and do what you have done and add at least the LSD which I deem necessary, the map etc I can assume gives more power so that's something I can look at when I get used to the power.

Have u tweaked your suspension or are u running on the stock C63 parts? Are u running 18's? I am mindful that our roads on the IOM are below par and ride quality is something I really need to consider. Part of the reason I don't use my Csl is due to me fitting aftermarket suspension that is great on decent roads but over here makes for a very hard ride which takes the fun out of driving! I guess I really need to get over to the UK and take a test drive to understand how a non PP C63 feels.
I also assume your car has stock brakes, I guess you can upgrade pads and fluid to get better performance, again my car will not be used for track days etc so will be fully upto the fast road driving I will want. After that its the exterior mods which seems to be minor in relation to a non PP car and all can be sorted with minimal outlay so the non PP car seems to be the way I am looking to go.
I have seen a few non PP cars for sale so certainly any guidance is appreciated so I can decide exactly what I am looking for and tighten my search criteria accordingly!
Cheers
Nick

 

[StuartK]

Hi yes I'm running stock suspension and eventually I'll get coilovers but only because I had an M3 before with coilovers and I think it will turn the car into a driver focused machine more.

The brakes I promise you will not need to up rate pads I've driven it very, very hard. Braked hard from high speed (my limiter is removed) and had no fade whatsoever the brakes are excellent!

I'm on 18"s and the ride is fine. The 19"s allegedly crack but I'm very careful with potholes and I'll likely get 19"s soon just so I can fit pilot super sports.

It will never handle like your csl as I've consigned myself to the fact the e46 m3 is the greatest car I've owned, ever!

 

[ecain63]

It depends what spec you want vs need. Most PPP cars have most other options, such as HK, DAB, etc. Low spec cars are plentiful and are very basic compared to the above. Cosmetically you'll be pushed to see the difference but it's there. I'm on my 2nd PPP having had a pre facelift and now a facelift and I'd not settle for less given the difference in real life options. I needed DAB and comand more than PPP, but fact is the two generally go hand in hand on the C63.

 

[developer]

Overall the PPP spec sounds like something I would want

I'd be the same - hunting one down is part of the fun - you certainly don't want to buy something that may leave you wanting.

Nice garage and welcome BTW .

 

[RJ C63]

Comand is standard and even a standard car is generously specced. Sunroof is always a nice as standard unlike bmw.

 

[SiSi]

Tell us more about the CSL! My dream car..... But sadly out of reach and prices are mental. Clarkson drove one round the Isle of Man didn't he?!

 

[BigChap]

Comand is standard and even a standard car is generously specced. Sunroof is always a nice as standard unlike bmw.

You do get pre-facelifts without command mate, seen a few when I was looking, don't know about the facelift though.

 

[ecain63]

^^^ this.

At the end of the day it's 2016. Digital radio is king as is a functioning and useful satnav. Comand online and HK with DAB should be a minimum requirement in my opinion.

 

[StuartK]

^^^ this.

At the end of the day it's 2016. Digital radio is king as is a functioning and useful satnav. Comand online and HK with DAB should be a minimum requirement in my opinion.

Yep.

Some pre facelifts don't have command. (Can't think why you would buy one without!)

For the record I have dab, HK and luxury climate, glass roof, etc etc. Without pp pack so well specced cars are out there.

 

[Nikey30]

Hi All, many thanks for the comments, all useful in increasing my knowledge and starting to source a suitable car. There seems to be a few about so I will spend some time to understand specs, out of interest what premium will a PPP car take over a standard version? I am sure the right car will appear, I will also need to get a trip to the UK mainland sorted and get a few lined up to view and drive.

SiSi, you ask about my CSL. Yes Clarkson did his review on the IOM many years ago, he really liked it! I bought my car back in 2004 when prices had slumped, one drive was all I needed to know it ticked my boxes!

I used it as my daily for 3 years, when my daughter arrived I had to get a sensible family car but I had grown very fond of the BM so its' become a bit of a garage queen! I have put all the normal mods on, AP big brake kit, KW coilovers, full Supersprint exhaust with race lightweight back box so it sounds even better than standard and standard sounds amazing on a CSL! I run it on the proper Cup tyres so have to be careful on cold/damp roads as its lively! I have been to LeMans a couple of times in it
and a few years ago went to Munich (via Nurburgring) for the 10yr Csl anniversary which was a great few days.

The car is part of the family now so, unless I had to I wont be selling it plus as you say the prices have shot up over the past 12 months. Sort of takes the fun out of it as you become paranoid! If someone shunted it, then it would be half the car it presently is, although it does come out for TT fortnight, the mountain road becomes one way for 2 weeks, the Csl will show a clean pair of heels to all but the most committed biker!

Ok I will stop waffling now! Thanks to you all for the warm welcome to the forum, I will get looking for a car and let you know how I get on. I hope to have some pics to post of the new addition soon

Cheers
Nick

 

[Growy16]

Interested in your comments ecain63. What exactly comprises a a 'low spec' car when we are talking about the C63? I have owned a number of 'high specced' cars with all kinds of fancy radios, fridges, blinds and electric this and that. I bought a C63 to go very quickly and listen to a soundtrack that beats any HK, BOSE, B&O and any other wonderful sound system you can think of. I don't have PPP, or HK or any of that other tosh. What I do have is Package 440 cooling system upgrade which means I can put my boring standard car round racetracks really quickly without the embarrassment of limp mode. Oddly enough, during this excruciating experience I don't listen to the radio, in fact I even switch the A/C off. It is the digital age, that's why I have an iPad. I don't take that with me either.

 

[supaer]

woooooahhhhh.... Welcome to the forum!!! You have a CSL!!! nice one!! i was going to get one last year, however decided the one i was looking at was tooooooo problematic as it had a few issues!! Are you on CSL Register also??

Cracking car!!!
Oh yeah c63 is to.... lol.........
Sorry, I'm 50/50 AMG and ///M

Feel free to post some pics of the CSL!!!
I hope its a nice SB one!!! The faster colour!

 

[ecain63]

Interested in your comments ecain63. What exactly comprises a a 'low spec' car when we are talking about the C63? I have owned a number of 'high specced' cars with all kinds of fancy radios, fridges, blinds and electric this and that. I bought a C63 to go very quickly and listen to a soundtrack that beats any HK, BOSE, B&O and any other wonderful sound system you can think of. I don't have PPP, or HK or any of that other tosh. What I do have is Package 440 cooling system upgrade which means I can put my boring standard car round racetracks really quickly without the embarrassment of limp mode. Oddly enough, during this excruciating experience I don't listen to the radio, in fact I even switch the A/C off. It is the digital age, that's why I have an iPad. I don't take that with me either.

Steady on mate, nobody is berating your car.

You obviously bought your car for the track and for hooning around. Great!

Most of the population aren't track goers and in turn won't drive everywhere else at over 4krpm. Most people drive to and from work in the C63 and a very few keep theirs for the weekend fun and family duties. Everyone goes through that initial honeymoon period where they rave about the engine. Been there myself. Windows down, manual mode or S+ and lots of overrun. That's great until you're in traffic or monging along at 70 for miles and miles. What do you do then?

You personally might still be in 2nd gear on the motorway, making most of your option 440 but everybody else is sitting in a comfy chair, looking out of their windscreen whilst either listening to the rattling of the wife or the **** on the radio. The exhaust at <1500rpm is silent and that's where these cars will be most of the time. Radio or no, the C63 is a quiet place to be at 70mph in the right gear.

I've had 2 C63's and looked at / driven many, many examples. The interior of the PPP is effectively the same as the standard car but subtle differences lift the cabin above the entry spec. It's minor but you notice it. The steering wheel changes the whole cabin in my opinion. But that's just me. Other bits of trim that most PPP buyers spec also helps to lift it over the regular poplar plastics. The centre console is slightly different too.

Externally the differences are minimal, but the red calipers and carbon boot lip are a true and enhancing compliment to the standard car. A PPP car is very obvious to those who know the C63. To others it makes no odds. Somebody who is buying a C63 may or may not be an enthuisiast. I'd suggest if the OP has a CSL already he's unlikely to be a dullard who simply buys for A to B commuting.

We all know the mechanical differences between the cars so no need to to preach that.

As a package the PPP is a sought after beast. Sure, it isn't night and day to the standard car but it's enough to make the entry spec C63 appear dated to the knowledgeable. The feel of the car on the road is a big thing too. Yes, the standard car is more than fast enough, but the engine does feel much more alive in the PPP so at all speeds it feels more agile under throttle. I've driven a lot of C63s so i'm talking from experience. And i've owned a few other quick cars to compare them too.

I'm more than happy with my 'tosh' uber-spec C63. As yet, on either car I've owned I have not suffered any embarrassing temperature warnings. Maybe I'm not an awesome enough driver to put as much demand on the car as you do. But, I don't take my car on the track. It's not what I bought it for.

I hope you continue to enjoy the sound of your V8 as I will enjoy being able to listen to my music.

 

[Nikey30]

woooooahhhhh.... Welcome to the forum!!! You have a CSL!!! nice one!! i was going to get one last year, however decided the one i was looking at was tooooooo problematic as it had a few issues!! Are you on CSL Register also??

Cracking car!!!
Oh yeah c63 is to.... lol.........
Sorry, I'm 50/50 AMG and ///M

Feel free to post some pics of the CSL!!!
I hope its a nice SB one!!! The faster colour!

Yeah I am a member on the CSL register, good bunch of fellow owners. Pic of my Csl, I have a set of standard silver coloured wheels and a set in Satin Black, like to mix it up
SB being faster !! nah the Silver ones rock :bannana:

 

[Growy16]

Ecain63. Totally acknowledge everything you say, I am not a C63 aficionado. But. Standard car or pimped, the C63 simply isn't about the trim. Mine has got more interior rattles and squeaks than any other car I have owned, typical MB build. And the track days are just an extension of its normal life. I am fortunate in that I have access to a number of vehicles for different uses, my C Class is under a cover for the winter. But I don't drive it for the radio. For motorway work I use my Navara Outlaw or ML63, for backroad tear-ups I use the C63. I do get your wider point about comfort etc but I think there are other models for that. We are on the same page though. No offence intended.

 

[ecain63]

Likewise, no offence etc.

As you say, you are in a fortunate position to have a fleet of cars to suit your needs. Most of us however have to suffer the embuggerance of having a C63 for all seasons and occasions. Ha!

My wife has a Q7 for family duties so i do get to drive rattle free at times. You are lucky to have so many options. Enjoy!

The OP will be better placed than any to pick for his needs.

 

[Nikey30]

Do these things suffer with rattling problems? I assume this relates to issue with interior fitments and can be remedied?

 

[ecain63]

It's a Merc. Yes the interior rattles a lot. Ha! Luckily i lost aspects of my hearing in Afghanistan and other places so i can only hear certain tones. I can hear enough to enjoy music but don't hear the rattles. Win!