Ignition barrel confusion

[Classic_car]

Key started jamming in the ignition barrel. So, I searched the forum and found the advice was to turn key to pos 1 and remove barrel before it jams completely. So, i've done that and got the barrel out successfully. I ordered a new one and it does not fit, so ordered another from Mercedes, but that is going to take a couple of weeks to arrive.

Car is a 1988 W126

So my question is.

Now the barrel is completely removed, there seems to be a slot with a spring catch in it, behind where the barrel was. Is it safe to use a screwdriver to start the car by turning the slot? Can I safely drive the car like this, or could the steering lock come on whilst driving?

Will I be able to turn the car off with the screwdriver in the slot? Appologies, if these are foolish questions, but I cannot find the answers on the net and want to use the car before the new barrel arrives.

No worries about security as the car is safely garaged, when im not driving it and has a Cat 1 alarm, etc.

 

[kwakdonut]

I wouldn't!

There are many reasons why including being pulled over by our friends in blue.

Will probably have major insurance issues too

 

[tagnut]

Have seen this done with an old Land Rover with a faulty barrel in the past. It didn't cause any issues with electrics or anything and worked just as it would with the barrel in. You might want to try a short test drive to see if it works ok. I don't think plod would notice but if they did I wouldn't think it would be an issue providing you have your documents with you.

As stated above there may be insurance implications. If you're not going to leave the car anywhere then it may be worth asking them if it's a problem. I don't think they'd be paying out under any circumstances if the car was stolen though.

 

[Dec]

I wouldn't!

As above, I did a similar job on my W202, I can’t speak for a W126 but on a W202 the car can be started and driven BUT when the steering wheel is turned to the STRAIGHT AHEAD position then the steering wheel might lock PERMENANTLY, I could be wrong about this but I would not dare try it.

Dec

 

[Classic_car]

Thanks for the replies. I certainly will not risk the steering lock coming on whilst driving. I had assumed, obviously wrongly, that removing the barrel, would just mean you don't need a key and would not affect the steering lock operation. It's a real pain, as I wanted to move the car from it's current location to my other garage a few miles away.

Is there a way to disable the steering lock altogether, until my new barrel arrives?

 

[Dec]

It is the presence of the barrel inside the ignition lock that stops the steering lock engaging so if the barrel is present and turned by the key to position 1 or 2 then the steering lock can’t engage, however you can’t do that because the levers inside the barrel are worn or damaged presumably that’s why you are changing the barrel.

If the barrel were to be disassembled and its levers removed, then if the barrel were reassembled and put back into the ignition lock then it could be turned to any position with your key or indeed any key that will fit into the lock or even a metal nail file or a thin screwdriver…once the barrel is turned to position 1 or 2 then the steering lock can’t engage.

So, if you can take it apart, remove all its levers, put it back together then you will be able to start and drive, obviously you will have zero security.

All the above depends on the assumption that the problem with your barrel is that the levers inside the barrel are worn or damaged and that NO OTHER PART OF THE BARELL IS BROKEN.

Dec

 

[Classic_car]

Thanks Dec, that is useful information. I think, I understand how it works now, it must be the sprung tab in the slot (behind the barrel) that 'tells' the steering lock not to engage. My barrel is worn, the key had started to stick, so that is the reason for the change - before it stuck completely, probably at the worst possible time!

Looking at the old barrel, there appears to be a very small roll pin that holds it intact, I don't think I can drill it out without damaging the barrel, as it is about 0.5mm, so i'm probably stuffed until the new barrel from MB arrives. :-(

I wish I could convert the ignition system to Race-Car style switches and a push button for the starter. As the car is alarmed, has a secret cut-off switch, always garaged when not in use and not worth much anyway, security is not really an issue. I know it could be done, but don't know how.

 

[Dec]

Put up a picture with the key in the lock and one with the key out of the lock and showing the pin that you refer to.
A roll pin can be punched out not drilled out.

Dec

 

[Druk]

I wish I could convert the ignition system to Race-Car style switches and a push button for the starter. As the car is alarmed, has a secret cut-off switch, always garaged when not in use and not worth much anyway, security is not really an issue. I know it could be done, but don't know how.

This is what I've done to my 107 after the ignition barrel jambed and had to be ground out of it's housing. I had to dig deep to get the steering lock pin out of the slot.

Classic car...where are you located? I have a spare 124 barrel and key you could try as a temporary measure. I'm heading East Midlands direction tomorrow and Brum on Friday.

 

[Classic_car]

Hi Druk, i'm in North Birmingham, that is very kind of you to offer a spare barrel. If I cannot get the gubbins out of the existing one today,to make it turn. Then I would be very grateful, if I could borrow a spare off you, until my new one arrives.

 

[Classic_car]

Put up a picture with the key in the lock and one with the key out of the lock and showing the pin that you refer to.
A roll pin can be punched out not drilled out.

Dec

Will do that after work tonight, thanks for the help.
The pin is very small, about 0.5mm, I do not have a pin small enough to punch it out, or a drill bit that small. So, drilling it our will make a bigger hole. I will put up a pic later so you can see what i'm talking about.

I bought one of those 'Push button Starter' things off Ebay about a year ago, for another one of our cars, but never bothered to fit it. It requires, the key to be turned to pos 2, then you can use the button to activate the starter. I would happily fit this to the Merc, if I knew how to wire up switches for ignition pos 1 and 2. As, I said before, security is not really a worry, because of Thatch 1 alarm, cut-off switch and off-site garage.

 

[Druk]

OK. This is the spare 124 barrel. What are the chances of it being the same fitting as a 126? Maybe worth a try. I'll pm you my schedule. Starter button doesn't have to be wired through the ign switch per se. A feed from any 'live with ignition' fuse is sufficient. Current required is relatively small cos you're only operating a solenoid.

Derek.

 

[neilrr]

I wouldn't!

There are many reasons why including being pulled over by our friends in blue.

Will probably have major insurance issues too

Why would the police care?

 

[Classic_car]

OK. This is the spare 124 barrel. What are the chances of it being the same fitting as a 126? Maybe worth a try. I'll pm you my schedule. Starter button doesn't have to be wired through the ign switch per se. A feed from any 'live with ignition' fuse is sufficient. Current required is relatively small cos you're only operating a solenoid.

Derek.

Hi Derek,
Aha! From the pic, that is the same type of barrel, that I have just incorrectly bought, (before removing my old one) that does not fit.

So now I have the correct one on order from MB, part no. 126 460 0604. Mine is entirely different, it does not have the long bit that sticks out and instead, has 2 much shorter 'pins' at the back, that slot into the bit behind the barrel.

I have the instructions to wire the 'starter button kit' I bought. But, it's design depends on the key to be in pos 2, before it will function. I presume this is to bypass the steering lock mech. If I knew how to bypass the steering lock and wire up 2 switches for ignition key pos 1 and 2, then I could fit this starter button kit I have.

Thanks for your help

 

[Dec]

So now I have the correct one on order from MB, part no. 126 460 0604. Mine is entirely different, it does not have the long bit that sticks out and instead, has 2 much shorter 'pins' at the back, that slot into the bit behind the barrel

I wonder is it possible that your original barrel had the “spike” that sticks out at the end of the barrel and that spike has broken off and is still inside the lock and that is what is stopping you inserting the new barrel. The part number of the lock pictured below is 126 460 06 04, same as yours.

Dec

Picture… http://www.carpartsdiscount.com/auto/parts/84/mercedes_benz/190e/ignition_system/ignition_lock_cylinder.html?3593=63648

 

[Classic_car]

Hi Dec,

Sorry, i've put the wrong part number, that number and the lock in your link is the lock I bought in error, before I got the old one out. It will fit some w126's, but not mine.

The part number of the lock for my car is actually: 126 462 0179

The pics show my old barrel and the part behind it, that it fits in to.

Do you know how I could disable the steering lock?

 

[Dec]

Do you have a picture of the front of the barbell showing the roll pin you mentioned earlier?

Dec

 

[Sp!ke]

When I had the same problem on my W124 I deduced that the steering lock couldn't come on with the barrel removed and happily drove it about for 5 days until the replacement lock arrived. All the lock does is require you to use a key so as long as the position is in the normal place (turned with your screwdriver) to run the car then the steering lock cant engage.

Cant be sure that the W126 is the same though without seeing it.

 

[Dec]

In relation to a W202, the Haynes Manual states
“Note, The switch must not be turned from position 1 while the lock cylinder is removed or the steering lock will be permanently engaged” …how accurate this is I don’t know, but the words “permanently engaged” could mean a lot of additional problems if the statement is correct and if it also applies to a W 126, we don’t know for sure what will happen when the steering wheel is turned to the straight ahead on a W126, it could be the same as a W124 but risky to try it.

Dec

 

[Sp!ke]

On my W124 the steering lock was initially on when I removed the barrel (with the use of an angle grinder) so I had to dismantle everything hence figuring out how the steering lock worked.

It really isn't that hard to disable the steering lock but I'm a bit sketchy on detail now as it was a fair while ago.

Reports of having to change the steering column that I'd seen on the web were vastly exaggerated though.