Insurance rules to change

[CE230]

http://www.insurancetimes.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=13&storycode=373841&c=2

So those of you with a few cars stored and waiting for restoration will be getting a nice brown envelope asking you for an £80 contribution to the next Gummint **** up fund for not insuring the pile of bits in the corner.

At one time I had 3 bikes in the garage of which only one was roadworthy, the other 2 waiting for repair, restoration. I couldn't get insurance to protect them while they were in my garage.

It's a pointless exercise anyway as uninsured drivers won't give a hoot and will continue to buy cars at auction and not register them to their address.

 

[Uberwagon]

Utter *****.

Obviously we should all pay for enjoying ourselves.

At this rate I can't ever see me getting my Escort to be road legal.

Dave!

 

[Sp!ke]

I was just quoted £40 per annum, per vehicle for this insurance.

 

[grober]

There have been several changes to vehicle registration regulations over the year and this is just one of them. A couple of comments.
The legislation is intended to help keep the unisured drivers off the road by cross referencing insurance company records with vehicle licencing data held at the DVLA. Surely this is a good thing and should help keep premiums down for law abiding motorists.
As far as I can see if you SORN the vehicle then there is no obligation in law to insure it. The other fact some folks seem unaware of is that any vehicle that has not been taxed since 1998 is SORN exempt anyway so your old classic mouldering away in the garage since the mid 90's is safe.
Quote:-
Vehicles manufactured or registered before 1 January 1973 are classed as historic vehicles and attract a nil rate of duty. However, to ensure that the vehicles are roadworthy and documentation such as MoT and insurance are current, a nil rate tax disc must be displayed in the vehicle. If the vehicle is kept off-road and has not had a licence since 31 January 1998, there is no requirement to declare SORN. However, if the vehicle has held a licence since this date, it is essential that an annual SORN declaration be made.

I suppose the question is if your vehicle was previously Sorn EXEMPT i.e. not taxed post 1998 can you avoid paying insurance by "SORNing" it instead? The regulations are far from clear however so maybe all this is changed recently ---I don't know?

 

[maddog]

Yes providing its sorned its no problem

I see no issue with this new law just means people need to be organised , but with the increase in ANPR equipped police vehicles and fixed cameras i do wonder if its really needed as uninsured drivers on the road are easily spotted

No doubt cloning will increase as this type of legislation will never target the habitual car criminal

FWIW i never had problem getting "laid up" insurance on my car or bikes when they have wintered in the garage

 

[jaymanek]

they dont explain it very well do they.,. i was swearing at the radio yesterday at the thought of having to insure 6 scrap W126's and W123's i have!

But they are all sorned so no issue i hope...

 

[ADY1983]

they dont explain it very well do they.,. i was swearing at the radio yesterday at the thought of having to insure 6 scrap W126's and W123's i have!

But they are all sorned so no issue i hope...

I too was swearing at the radio, thinking I now have to insure all the projects I have...

 

[st13phil]

This is a Trojan Horse to allow the UK insurance industry to do what they've wanted to do for years: remove the entitlement to drive other vehicles from motor policies and tie the policy to the vehicle rather than the driver.

The SORN exemption sounds fine in theory, but just won't work in practice. It's not that unusual for people to have a taxed car that's kept off the road for a few days when the insurance runs out and they can't afford the renewal premium until pay day. What are they supposed to do? Declare SORN (surrendering the RFL and losing part of a month), then re-tax the vehicle (losing part of a month again) once the insurance is restarted?

Also, bearing in mind the woeful level of accuracy achieved by the DVLA with their database (an error rate >20% by their own admission), and similar levels of inaccuracy on the MID, it's hard to believe that legions of people won't be receiving unjustified penalty demands.

Another "good intentions" scheme that will become ever more complex in its administration and will embody an ever increasing burden on the individual to prove their innocence, all because it is fundamentally flawed.

 

[jaymanek]

its true.. can see me writing more appeal letters..

 

[maddog]

The SORN exemption sounds fine in theory, but just won't work in practice. It's not that unusual for people to have a taxed car that's kept off the road for a few days when the insurance runs out and they can't afford the renewal premium until pay day. What are they supposed to do? Declare SORN (surrendering the RFL and losing part of a month), then re-tax the vehicle (losing part of a month again) once the insurance is restarted?

What are people meant to do??? How about budget properly ???

Its not like its a surprise, when you take out insurance they tell you on the certificate when its due again , you have a whole year to save up !!!

People need to organise themselves and start taking responsibility for their actions , we cant complain about a nanny state and then act like children

 

[andy_k]

there was an article in the papers the other day before the scaremongers got hold of it and only reported the bits which were likely to get a reaction.

Firstly any car which has a SORN will be exempt as will cars kept on private property that you have no intention of driving (ie restoring) - I can't find the article now because the paper has gone

I don't see why this is needed, it's already illegal to leave a car on the road uninsured and if someone is parking one off the road but using it sooner or later they'll get caught but it would be nice to see them off the road a bit quicker

It just seems to be more legislation for the sake of it

 

[st13phil]

What are people meant to do??? How about budget properly ???

I suspect that most people who frequent this forum do not routinely encounter "money problems" but, surprising as it may seem to some of them, there is a large proportion of the population of the UK who run their personal transport on a shoestring budget.

Faced with a surprise need to buy a child a replacement pair of shoes because they've just trashed the only pair they've got or spending the saved money on the car insurance renewal is for some people, regrettably, the reality of life. Just one example of how things can and do go wrong. And in the name of "the greater good" we should heap more trouble and expense on them?

As has already been mentioned, this measure will have zero impact on those who set out to flout the law by driving while uninsured, yet will inconvenience many others.

 

[scumbag]

!!!

People need to organise themselves and start taking responsibility for their actions , we cant complain about a nanny state and then act like children

I like that statement. It should be used more often by more people more of the time. Maybe one day, people will actually act responsibly then.

 

[maddog]

I suspect that most people who frequent this forum do not routinely encounter "money problems" but, surprising as it may seem to some of them, there is a large proportion of the population of the UK who run their personal transport on a shoestring budget.

Faced with a surprise need to buy a child a replacement pair of shoes because they've just trashed the only pair they've got or spending the saved money on the car insurance renewal is for some people, regrettably, the reality of life. Just one example of how things can and do go wrong. And in the name of "the greater good" we should heap more trouble and expense on them?

As has already been mentioned, this measure will have zero impact on those who set out to flout the law by driving while uninsured, yet will inconvenience many others.

It really shoudlnt come down to having to take the car off the road for the sake of a few ££££'s , insurance can be paid for monthly the amount is often quite small but if someone cant afford to pay its a case of they cant afford to run the car and they will need to sorn and not drive the car but some people DO still keep driving and thats exactly what this law will target

More and more insurance companies are just renewing lapsed polices unless given instructions not to , again i think this is a good idea , i would rather someone drive around on two policies than none just becuase they couldnt get themselves organised

 

[Dieselman]

The SORN exemption sounds fine in theory, but just won't work in practice. It's not that unusual for people to have a taxed car that's kept off the road for a few days when the insurance runs out and they can't afford the renewal premium until pay day. What are they supposed to do? Declare SORN (surrendering the RFL and losing part of a month), then re-tax the vehicle (losing part of a month again) once the insurance is restarted?

Do they have to declare the vehicle SORN then and resign any RFL when the insurance runs out.? Cant thay just declare the vehicle off the road but still taxed.?

 

[andy_k]

link to the story in the Independent

click here

 

[st13phil]

Do they have to declare the vehicle SORN then and resign any RFL when the insurance runs out.? Cant thay just declare the vehicle off the road but still taxed.?

AFAIK the two are mutually exclusive, and the DVLA site notes that "A SORN will automatically end if the vehicle is taxed", so that would seem to confirm the situation. Logically they are mutually exclusive because there's absolutely no reason to declare SORN if the vehicle is taxed, or to tax it if it's SORN'ed, so I don't see how you'd avoid having to insure a vehicle that's not on the road if it has a valid tax disc other than by surrendering it and declaring SORN.

 

[st13phil]

It really shoudlnt come down to having to take the car off the road for the sake of a few ££££'s

As unpleasant and as unnecessary as it may seem to you (or I for that matter), for some people it is a painful reality of life.

...but some people DO still keep driving and thats exactly what this law will target

I know that's the stated aim of the change, but think hard about how it will actually achieve it. The only thing it changes is that people who are not doing anything illegal today by keeping an uninsured motor vehicle off the road will be guilty of a new offence if the vehicle is taxed but not insured (against what risk, BTW?). They cannot be punished for driving an uninsured vehicle unless they are actually caught doing so, so how does it reduce the instance of uninsured drivers on the road?