Insurance

[DITTRICH]

Following my wife's incident last November, there have been developments which illustrate the weasel way these companies work. I have spent almost the whole day trying to sort this out. Bear with me, as it was instructive for me.
Last November the wife had an accident in the E300d BUT because her English is bad and because I do all the insurance admin, they wanted to pin the accident on me for insurance premium purposes. Which meant the premium on my newer C class doubled from £400 - £800 even though she was the driver. However, rather than junking the C230K I have insured it in my name with my wife as a named driver which "allowed them" to put the accident weighting against her rather than me as the policy holder. So I now have a newer C class with 9 years NCD transferred from the C230k and NCD of 5 years transferred from the E300D. I explained everything in great detail to them over the phone and it took the best part of 3 hours to sort it all out. I therefore note that in future, Mrs D is going to have to do her own insurance to avoid contamination. Originally, I wanted to let the C230k insurance expire in 1 month and move the NCD of 9 years to my newer C class. Then they tried to pin the accident on me as the policyholder even though I was not in the vehicle. Upshot is Iam buying2 insurances,keeping Mrs D happy and mobile and getting 2 cars insured whilst preserving the higher NCD on the more valuable car. I did try to do a mirrored NCD for only me, but they said I could only avoid being stuck for the accident loading if I insured my wife on the older vehicle. I'm still not sure I understand it all. £800 one car one driver, now becomes £800 for two cars,one with 1 driver (newer car) and 1 with 2 drivers (older car).
Personally I think they make it up as they go along and I was put on hold a number of times whilst they worked out what to do. Luckily I found my wife's DL too.

Tomorrow I am going to collect a 3 year old 1 owner MB serviced lease estate car C200 AMG Line which is in great condition and cost <£10k. This is my first car change in 15 years (E300D) and 20 years (C230K).

 

[Dryce]

The problem is the way the insurance sector deals with the bizarre thing that is NCD.

If you're a policy holder and the claim is on your policy then even if you're not in the car it normally hits your NCD.

This is not clear or obvious to most policy holders.

Now where this all gets even more confusing is that the companies quote based on your claims history as well - and not just your policy claims history. Then there's the issue of NCD being portable but only to one other policy.It's confusing and NCD should really be dropped by the insurance sector as the because of this. But they seem unwilling to do this.

I do wonder if NCD continues to exist in order to upsell NCD protection and obsfuscate pricing.

 

[DITTRICH]

If you're a policy holder and the claim is on your policy then even if you're not in the car it normally hits your NCD.
This is not clear or obvious to most policy holders.

I'm struggling but I am reassured from your comments that I wasn't being totally shafted!
It's actually a bit better as I rounded the figures. Coffee has made my keyboard a bit a 'mare.
Can't wait to transfer one of my plates onto it.

 

[Deleted member 149005]

As a above, “fault” (pinning the claim on you) is irrelevant.

The claim was on your policy.

 

[markjay]

The NCD is applied to the car, and can be transferred to another car whenever you swap vehicles.

If you have no car, the NCD can be retained for a certain period (from memory up to 2 years), but after that it expires.

Also, whichever way you sorted out the insurance, keep in mind that your statements must be truthful.

I.e., if you declare your wife to be the main driver of a vehicle, then this has to be the case, otherwise it's 'fronting' which is illegal and considered fraud. Same applies to the other vehicle where you are the main driver.

I am not suggesting that this is what you did, just saying that when rearranging the policies to minimise the cost, you should be aware of this issue.

 

[DITTRICH]

As a above, “fault” (pinning the claim on you) is irrelevant.

The claim was on your policy.

Thanks for your input. I do get what you are saying but IMHO it is a bit unfair when I have to do all the admin because my wife's English is not very good! Technically, I am in their eyes the policy holder. But the "risk" they were inferring onto me, was on a different insurance policy with a different insurer on a different car with a named driver who was not on the initial quotation. I'm not disputing the "rules" just the way they apply them. If Mrs D had her own policy and paid for it herself, then I would not have been penalised!

 

[markjay]

The problem is the way the insurance sector deals with the bizarre thing that is NCD.

If you're a policy holder and the claim is on your policy then even if you're not in the car it normally hits your NCD.

This is not clear or obvious to most policy holders.

Now where this all gets even more confusing is that the companies quote based on your claims history as well - and not just your policy claims history. Then there's the issue of NCD being portable but only to one other policy.It's confusing and NCD should really be dropped by the insurance sector as the because of this. But they seem unwilling to do this.

I do wonder if NCD continues to exist in order to upsell NCD protection and obsfuscate pricing.

There's NCD.... and there's Protected NCD... this is yet another product from the finance industry, that gave us the infamous CDOs that few people understood... talk about obsfuscation

 

[DITTRICH]

There is no doubt in their mind that I have given them 100% of the information they needed. I have not been "fronting" for anyone! To be honest, I have done many more miles than she ever did in the E300D. She uses it once per week on saturdays!

 

[markjay]

We have two cars, and a multi-car policy from Aviva. My wife is the main driver for her car, and I am the main driver on mine. We are each named drivers on each other's policy. The NCD for each car is separate. When my wife had an at-fault accident a few years back, the NCD on her car was affected, but not on mine. I believe this is the 'cleanest' (and legal) way of dealing with insurance for a 2-car household.

 

[Deleted member 149005]

Thanks for your input. I do get what you are saying but IMHO it is a bit unfair when I have to do all the admin because my wife's English is not very good! Technically, I am in their eyes the policy holder. But the "risk" they were inferring onto me, was on a different insurance policy with a different insurer on a different car with a named driver who was not on the initial quotation. I'm not disputing the "rules" just the way they apply them. If Mrs D had her own policy and paid for it herself, then I would not have been penalised!

Im confused - are you the policy holder or your wife? There is no”technically” about it.

It is all about risk profiling - an accident, whether you claim or not, increases your risk profile and hence your premiums. It might not be fair but that is how it is. I faced an increase in premium after. 3rd part damaged my car in a car park. I wasn't even in the car at the time and the 3rd party”s insurers settled in full; but still I was “penalised”.

If your wife is a named driver on your policy, you will still pay more even where she claimed off a different policy.

 

[markjay]

There is no doubt in their mind that I have given them 100% of the information they needed. I have not been "fronting" for anyone! To be honest, I have done many more miles than she ever did in the E300D. She uses it once per week on saturdays!

Well, if you are the main driver on both cars, and your wife only drives the car(s) infrequently, then this is how it should be declared to the insurer.....

 

[Deleted member 149005]

And her limited driving could increase the risk profile and premium....

 

[DITTRICH]

We have two cars, and a multi-car policy from Aviva. My wife is the main driver for her car, and I am the main driver on mine. We are each named drivers on each other's policy. The NCD for each car is separate. When my wife had an at-fault accident a few years back, the NCD on her car was affected, but not on mine. I believe this is the 'cleanest' (and legal) way of dealing with insurance for a 2-car household.

Thank you. I am going to make sure that is made clear with the insurers when I call up tomorrow. Now that I actually understand how the system "works"... ! Thanks again to the members commenting.

 

[DITTRICH]

Photos of new car tomorrow fingers crossed.