Ken Livingstone v US Ambassador

[Satch]

I have always disliked Ken, but becoming clear he has now wholly lost the plot. He might try mentioning that huge unpaid congestion charge and parking fines are racked up by embassy staff from many other countries before ranting about "political decisions" by the US.

Livingstone labels US ambassador a 'crook'
Tuesday, 28 Mar 2006 06:07

Ken Livingstone has lashed out at the US ambassador to Britain, labelling him a "chiselling little crook" in a row over congestion charge payments.

The London mayor has been angered by the refusal of US embassy employees to pay the congestion charge.

Since Robert Tuttle took over as ambassador his staff have reportedly run up £160,000 in charges and fines.

"It would actually be quite nice if the American ambassador could pay the charge that everybody else is paying rather than trying to skive out of it like some chiselling little crook," Mr Livingstone has been quoted as saying.

The embassy claims that the congestion charge is a tax and that its officials are therefore exempt under special dispensation for foreign diplomats.

Mr Livingstone's office argues that the charge is in fact a payment for a service, which means embassy staff have to pay.

"This new ambassador is a car salesman and an ally of President Bush," Mr Livingstone said. "This is clearly a political decision"

Mr Livingstone is currently appealing against a suspension after he likened a Jewish newspaper reporter to a Nazi concentration camp guard

 

[996jimbo]

Ha ha ha.

Good old Ken! At least you can't accuse him of mincing his words. I'm afraid the idea of him calling the American Ambassador a "chisselling little crook" just makes me laugh. Sorry about that.

 

[DITTRICH]

Whilst it may be funny on one level, public servants are not paid to be rude or offensive. It is possible to put forward logical argument without injecting personality and personal feelings into the situation. This is not the first time Ken has let his tongue (loosely connected to his brain at times) run away with itself. He seriously needs to start controlling himself better when 'on the record'.
Les

 

[Rose Chap]

Better yet he needs to be voted out of office sharpish.

 

[grasmere]

I like him - he talks straight . . .

I dont like that 'chiselling little crook' Gordon Brown however, he does NOT talk straight . . .

 

[Rose Chap]

Whilst not normally a champion of American policy, I must admit I like their stance here - the Congestion Charge is obviously a tax, and I think its refreshing to see it being referred to as such.

 

[996jimbo]

Whilst it may be funny on one level, public servants are not paid to be rude or offensive.

He's not a public servant, he's a politician.

People moan about politicians being two faced, being devious etc. He's being plain and straightforward. He thinks the diplomats are not paying something that everyone else has to pay, and that they can afford to pay. He is trying to goad and embarrass them in to paying.

Whether or not you agree with the congestion charge has nothing to do with it.

I personally do not care that he is insulting the Ambassador. I think it is funny.

I had the same reaction when George Galloway went over to the US and started ranting at them. I think Galloway is a detestable man, but I still found that bloody amusing as well.

 

[Shude]

I had the same reaction when George Galloway went over to the US and started ranting at them. I think Galloway is a detestable man, but I still found that bloody amusing as well.

It was classic, even if Galloway was lying (very possible!) it was still great to see him sticking it to the Yanks

 

[glojo]

I like him - he talks straight . . .

I dont like that 'chiselling little crook' Gordon Brown however, he does NOT talk straight . . .

I think there is straight talking and straight talking. The Tuttle (Tuetul)family aka Orange County Choppers are quite capable of looking after themselves Has Ken Livingstone attacked all other governments that fail to pay these charges?

I bet Tony Blair is impressed and doesn't regret allowing Ken to rejoin the Labour Party

Ken Livingstone can be an entertaining talker who says things he knows will get him publicity, but I do not think he is in the same class as either Tony Benn or George Galloway. These two are excellent speakers with tremendous skills at getting their point across. George Galloway in my opinion made fools of the US committee and only got in deep do do's once. Likewise with Tony Benn, he was masterful on Question Time, but in my opinion was totally wrong on his opinion about head dress and school uniforms.

Ken Livingstone is using language that is oaf-ish and I feel people in public office should use perhaps more eloquent ways of getting a point across?

John

 

[DITTRICH]

He's not a public servant, he's a politician.

Fair enough, but the point I made still stands.
Calling people names in public does not do Ken or the office he holds any favours.
I also imagine the American Ambassador doesn't care what he's called, but I don't think it will have any effect on his refusal to pay the charge (or any of the other embassies involved).

Les

 

[jeremytaylor]

The amazing thing is how Livingstone got re-elected promising not to put up the CONgestion charge, and then promptly put it up 40%!

No sympathy for liars!

 

[Rose Chap]

Well said Jeremy! Livingstone deserves everything that's coming to him.

 

[nickg]

a leopard doesn't change its spots.
livingstone hasn't changed from the odious turd that he was 20 odd yrs ago. Its just that he can now afford to hire better spin doctors.
But his true colours shine through.

Luckily for him, the americans' refusal to pay his car tax will not endanger the payment of his guaranteed £140K/yr pension for life (which he gave himself)when he does get shown the door.

Good on the yanks - someone at least is standing up for the UK public.

 

[RichieRuss2000]

Can't stand the socialist anti freedom tosser!

 

[sparkyspost]

Better yet he needs to be voted out of office sharpish.

I too am sick of the sight of the man. He doesn't care what he says or does as long as he is still getting paid.

On top of the Nazi's comment, this against the US ambassador he is also having a go at the two brothers who own a 50% stake in the Stratford city consortium, whilst he tries to align his sleazy self with one of the others (possibly for a post mayor job?). He can't keep his (devious) opinions to himself.

He is (to quote tubbs of LOG fame) a little brown fish. (IMHO)

Get him out of office!!

(end of rant)

 

[BonzoDog]

From a distance you have to say that Ken appears to be a highly effective Mayor hindered by extremely poor control of his tongue. Managing possibly the most important city in Europe with many issues to handle cannot be easy. The last time I saw the Evening Standard convinced me that it was not worth the paper on which it was printed. However having worked most of my life in London and now having visited it several times in Ken's new regime it appears that he has worked wonders; the tube has improved, the buses do not look as though they are rejects from Siberia, the streets are relatively clean, there are few, if any beggars and it is possible to drive the streets.
The fact that the Americans refuse to pay puts them in the same box as many of the other notorious penny pinching countries. Their choice about how they want to be seen and judged.
Now wouldn't it also be a good idea if Ken put bans on private cars using the West End and City?

 

[glojo]

the tube has improved,
the buses do not look as though they are rejects from Siberia,
the streets are relatively clean,
there are few, if any beggars
and it is possible to drive the streets.

The fact that the Americans refuse to pay puts them in the same box as many of the other notorious penny pinching countries. Their choice about how they want to be seen and judged.

It is always refreshing to read the other side of the story, but I feel this debate might somehow take a dive and get political?

I still do not like a public figure using his type of language. Top marks for what he has acheived, noi point for his arrogant attitude.

Forget the Evening paper, the language he used to the reporter was unacceptable. It does not matter how much he was provoked, there is no excuse... None. Just look at all the posts we read about folks criticising the Police for inappropriate language. If they used the words Livingstone used and THEY WERE RECORDED, they would be sacked, no ands, buts or whys???

John

 

[PJH]

Do British Diplomatic staff run up similar bills abroad?

Is Diplomatic immunity just to mask small indiscressions or EVERYTHING? (Murder, Grand theft, etc)

 

[jeremytaylor]

From a distance you have to say that Ken appears to be a highly effective Mayor hindered by extremely poor control of his tongue. Managing possibly the most important city in Europe with many issues to handle cannot be easy. The last time I saw the Evening Standard convinced me that it was not worth the paper on which it was printed. However having worked most of my life in London and now having visited it several times in Ken's new regime it appears that he has worked wonders; the tube has improved, the buses do not look as though they are rejects from Siberia, the streets are relatively clean, there are few, if any beggars and it is possible to drive the streets.
The fact that the Americans refuse to pay puts them in the same box as many of the other notorious penny pinching countries. Their choice about how they want to be seen and judged.
Now wouldn't it also be a good idea if Ken put bans on private cars using the West End and City?

Things viewed from a distance can look very different up close!

The tube has improved. Debatable, but the price has certainly rocketed. Paying cash, the minimum single fare is now £1.50, so £3 for the shortest journey!

There are many more buses. Too many, such that they now completely block Oxford Street (public transport only) as well as other roads. Trying to send bendy buses down what were originally village lanes is just plain lunacy - I dread to think of how many millions Ken is spending re-aligning curbs etc. to accommodate them. The buses are already in deficit to the tune of £1billion, with no word as to who is going to pay the bill.

The congestion charge is a tax on using cars and vans in London, pure and simple. If diplomats are immune from paying taxes, surely they should be immune from this tax too. Note that other countries are not paying, it's just that anti-US Ken is trying to make political points here.

Ban private cars from the West End and City? Right, and tell the last person to leave London to turn the lights off.

 

[Satch]

Is Diplomatic immunity just to mask small indiscressions or EVERYTHING? (Murder, Grand theft, etc)

Draw your own conclusions in the case of scummier countries:

Diplomatic Immunity
The guidance has been agreed between Home Office, Foreign Office and CPS and must be followed in all cases where:
(a) a person has diplomatic immunity
(b) claims to have diplomatic immunity
(c) is believed to have diplomatic immunity

In (a), (b) or (c) above the police will submit a report to the Home Office.

In minor offences, e.g. motoring offences, it will not be normal to refer these to The CPS. It is normally sufficient for copy of the police report to be sent to the Foreign Office by the Home Office.

In other more serious cases, and if the Home Office feel that the case should be pursued, the Home Office will submit the full facts to the Foreign Office and the CCP of the appropriate Area.

The Foreign Office will advise if the offender posses diplomatic immunity.

The CCP will review the case in accordance with the Code for Crown Prosecutors. He will advise both the Home Office and Foreign Office if the criteria for prosecution is satisfied.

If the criteria is satisfied, the Foreign Office, Home Office and CCP will decide which of the following courses of action will be pursued:

warn the Head of Mission the offender must mend his ways;
request the withdrawal of the offender from the country;
ask that the Head of Mission waive immunity so that a prosecution can proceed.
If the case does not satisfy criteria for prosecution the Foreign Office and Home Office may still decide that it is undesirable for the offender to continue his duties in the UK.