Kwik Fit couldnt undo the wheel bolts...

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frog1520

Active Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
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506
Put my W140 into kiwk fit today for an MOT - passed no problem :bannana:

Thought I'd get the four wheels balanced while it was in there for 20 quid. When I went to collect it, they said they couldnt get the wheels off - the bolts were too tight and they were frightened of snapping them and leaving the car inoperable for tonight....

They said you have to be careful and tighten the bolts only with a torque wrench, to make sure you dont overtighten them. Funny that, kiwk fit put the wheels on last time and I seem to remember them using only the airgun - maybe my memory is faulty. I asked what torque they put the bolts to and they claimed 110Nm. My manual says the bolts should be 150Nm - I dont know much about physics, but that sounds a lot tighter to me. Which is right?

Whats the best way to get the bolts off? I suppose one option is to buy a stack of new bolts in case they do snap, then have them remove the old bolts whatever way they can. What happens if the buggers do snap?

Any advice?

Thanks!
 
As far as wheel bolts are concerned I don't think there is much difference between 110 or 150 Nm, note: that's my humble opinion. Your guess is right though 150 Nm is a higher force than 110 Nm. I would certainly trust the handbook over some trained grease monkeys though, I've had a few bad experiences in the past with Kwik Fit.

To get the bolts off you need alot of leverage, i.e. a way to extend the handle of your wheel spanner, I carry a stainless tube in the boot just for this reason. I use the spanner provided in the tool kit, if I need to get more leverage for stubborn bolts I slide the tube over the handle to give it approx 3x times more length.

Never had one snap on me but I guess you'd have to drill them out if you sheared head off one.

S.
 
Bearing in mind the monkeys use compressed air, they won't have much control over the torque applied to undo sticky bolts. The extended lever is the best bet. Given the size of the average wheel bolt, I would have thought you'd need a pretty large twisting force to shear one. Many years ago, I used a six-foot length of scaffold on a wheelbrace to undo the bolts on a Vauxhall Viva and after forty-five minutes, realised I was going the wrong way. (!) Nevertheless, the bolts didn't shear. OK, they were steel, and yours may be Al, or somesuch, but they have to be strong by nature.

Usual problem with wheel bolts is 'sticking' and a good jerk can often be enough to loosen them off. By 'jerk', I don't mean t**t, I mean swift hammer blow (onto a short lever, not an extended one).

Of course, if this all goes pear-shaped, then I was never here....
 
The wheel bolts are pretty meaty on a W140, I had mine off the other day to balance the wheels.

I've got an extending brace in with the tool kit in the boot, the handle folds out giving you double the turning force, I dunno if these came as standard with the S Class?

What I did notice when the wheels were off was signs of a reaction between the wheel mating face ond the hub face, the two rear wheels needed a knock to free them off the hub. I had the hub face cleaned up with a wire brush.

I used copperslip on the bolt threads to prevent them seizing on in the future.

I've put a set of locking bolts on as well, so I have 4 spare bolts you can have if you get any probs.
 
frog1520 said:
they said they couldnt get the wheels off - the bolts were too tight and they were frightened of snapping them and leaving the car inoperable
:eek: I'm going to local tyre indy tomorrow for 3 new 215x55x16 tyres, Goodyear F1 (plug plug) which are on a special at the mo @ £105 all in reduced from £120 and apparently tick all the boxes - quiet, hard wearing, good in wet & dry - and are underrated by Pirelli/Conti/Dunlop fanciers et al. No point in getting into another 'which tyres are best' spiel here but I like the idea of copper grease on the bolt threads & will see if they can do that ;)
 
Francis - Goodyear F1s are excellent (I've bought ££££s of them myself), but I wouldn't say they were quiet by any means? Or hard wearing come to think about it?

Excellent wet/dry performance, for grip and braking, but average in other areas.

Doesn't really matter to me particularly, but might concern you? :)

Will
 
Will said:
Francis - Goodyear F1s are excellent (I've bought ££££s of them myself), but I wouldn't say they were quiet by any means? Or hard wearing come to think about it?

Excellent wet/dry performance, for grip and braking, but average in other areas.

Doesn't really matter to me particularly, but might concern you? :)

Will
Oh blimey - I knew this would happen - but I spend my working life on motorways to & from airports day & night, wet & dry conditions, heavy loads/people, roadworks/potholes/truck tramlines and all - so I need to get about 25K from the fronts and maybe 35-40K from the rears - what do you reckon?

I only bought Contis once, thinking they were best but they were only average and apparently there really is no 'best' - it just depends on your car and what you use it for. Dunlops wore out in 15K, couldn't believe it, Pirellis were OK but get loads of stick on forums & elsewhere, Michelins are just too expensive given I get through one and a half sets a year, and £70 'budget' tyres - fuhgeddabout it, car loathes them.

So - try Goodyears? Will LYK
 
I would be more than surprised if you managed anything like 40K miles out of Goodyear F1s! I would expect them to last maybe 15-20K tops? Possibly slightly more, but not 40K?

Just in case this is a real problem for you. I thought Contis were hard wearing myself?

Good luck with whatever you decide,

Will
 
I've got F1 GSD3's because I loved the way they handle, they are fairly quiet for me (my local supermarket car park has a very smooth tarmac surface and previous tyres would squeal around corners at even walking speed not a peep out of the F1's and they produce little noise at speed on the motorways too). However, I agree with Will, if you're looking for hard wearing tyres then the Eagle F1's are not for you, they are made from a fairly soft compound I believe.

S.
 
Steve_Perry said:
if you're looking for hard wearing tyres then the Eagle F1's are not for you, they are made from a fairly soft compound I believe.
oh Lor' :confused: ... my pal in the airport car service who runs 3 W210s swears by them and I've gone & ordered them now, what will my trusty local indy say if I cancel ... they've always done such good deals and always been totally straight with me ... & they said re Contis: 'people come back to us and say, the Contis were all right but have you got anything better?' at which they recommend F1s. Just have to try them now and see, but take all your comments on board & will LYK ...
 
The F1s are a good tyre, but contisports last for ages (sometimes longer than you wish they would!
 
As for the wheel bolts, I think it is very unlikely that they will shear through overtightening, maybe if they have rusted into the threads for the last 10 years but not through normal tightening.

As for the Goodyear F1's? I swapped out a nearly new set of F1's because they were noisy and not too good in the wet in my opinion. I went for Vredestein Ultrac's, so far they have been smooth, quiet and no problems with grip apart from a couple of times at Bruntingthorpe!! They seem to be wearing very well too.
 
well frog1520, your gonna have to get them off sometime so best do it soon under controlled conditions ie in a garage or on your drive rather than in the rain on a motorway :eek:

Be prepared ( ie expectant) that one may snap I suppose but they probably wont. ;)

I would use a long tube for easy leverage and 'jerk' it to crack the tight fit open - just make sure you are going anticlockwise ( with apologie to imadoofus ) .

I swapped rear to front on my daughers polo a few days ago and the front bolts were SOLID aaarrggg it was bloody hard but with an extension they came off. I put back on at 120Nm.
 
fwb44 said:
That looks like an F1 on your C250 in your signature ... ??

Yes, they are on Graham's C230K now. :D They have also been on Sym's old C200. :eek:
 
jimmy said:
Yes, they are on Graham's C230K now. :D They have also been on Sym's old C200. :eek:
Wow, I doubt mine'll last long enough to find a new home even if they do need one. Put 2 on the back this a.m., feels good so far, we'll see ...
 
Thanks to everyone for all the advice!

I'll let you know what happens when I try to get them off.... :eek:
 
Bit of an update on this...!

Got a set of new bolts today so decided to have a go at removing the old ones.

No problem getting enough torque to shift the normal bolts. They didnt seem like
they were rusted on to me - but then I only did four.

However, the locking wheel nut proved to be the problem. Put a bit of pressure on that one, and the bloody wheel nut key snaps, leaving half the key in the nut. :eek: I think whats happened is kwikfit used the airgun on it last time and overtightened it and the key just aint strong enough - make sense?

So now im left with a broken key in the sodden nut!! So a couple of questions:

1. Can i just order another wheel nut key from the dealer?

2. Any ideas for removing the bolt where the keys snapped? I guess i could get a
fine drill bit and drill the broken bit out...?

3. How can I remove the other locking bolts without snapping more keys?!

Moral of the story: dont let kiwk fit lose with the airgun...

Thanks for the help!!
 
I had a 735iL with wheel nuts on so tight It was like they were welded. I broke 3 wheel nut keys before finally getting the locking nuts off. A tyre bloke tried and stopped because he was afraid of snapping the nuts. He did suggest WD40 on the nuts 2-3 per day for 4-5 days and by doing this I was able to get them off eventually.
 

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