Low wide tyres and snow

[mjbarnard]

I have an E class automatic (07). It is the Sport version so has particularly low fat tyres (265/35 on the rears). Today I had real trouble on the roads in West London, and slipped and slid several times before giving up and returning home. (I am a doctor and my journey was pretty genuine).

Nothing new there - but the thing that puzzled me was the difficulty I had seemed out of proportion to other road users. After reading a similar thread from Fabes, I am curious. Several people have alluded to the risks and difficulties of using low wide tyres in snow. Why is this? Apologies for ignorance but why does a wider tyre not have more grip rather than less?

I understand I am in a big auto with rear wheel drive - and that this will be hazardous in extreme conditions. Just curious why the tyre specs might make this more so?

 

[whitenemesis]

Big wide tyre spreads the load and so doesn't dig into the snow like a narrow tyre

 

[ecossebev]

If you look at WRC cars when they drive on snow, they run skinny tyres (like spacesaver tyres), so the tyre can dig through the snow to find grip. Wide tyres sit on top of he snow like snow shoes. Its all to do with weight distribution

 

[rf065]

Low fat tyres are generally high performance tyres & were never designed to go anywhere near snow.

For example, a winter tyre has a tread pattern that widens towards the rear of the tread block, this throws any snow or slush out of the tread to ensure it is clear at all times. Your tyres will simply fill the tread with snow & become as usefull as a slick tyre.

Modern winter tyres will also be made of a rubber compound that stays pliable in cold weather and able to grip or key into the road surface, your tyres will become hard due to the cold & ride on top of the road surface offering less grip.

Why are other cars better than yours, front wheel drive versus rear wheel drive, auto versus manual gearbox, weight, etc etc. There are many variables.

Russ

 

[crockers]

One of the best cars in the snow (excluding 4 x 4 ) is Fiat Panda....and the 4x4 version is brilliant in snow.

 

[ckember]

should I get some skinnier wheels and tyres for my e320 cdi sport, for use in the snow, or will that cause other problems?

 

[stumpy1]

My car is on 195s and is still rubbish

 

[Sp!ke]

Why not get some cheap 15" steel wheels and some winter tyres and use them between November and March.

You'll apreciate the extra grip it gives you and youl keep your nice aloys in good condition for when your car is clean in summer.

 

[crockers]

should I get some skinnier wheels and tyres for my e320 cdi sport, for use in the snow, or will that cause other problems?

put winter tyres on the new wheels....amazing difference....

 

[rf065]

should I get some skinnier wheels and tyres for my e320 cdi sport, for use in the snow, or will that cause other problems?

Why not get a spare set of wheels & use winter tyres.
I'm using 225/45X17 winter tyres all round & the snow is no problem.
It also means I don't have skinny tyres on when it is not snowing.

Russ

 

[Rory]

The tyres most people use in the UK are quite specifically summer tyres. It's always a little dodgy using them in cold weather as grip deteriorates rapidly as the temperature drops.

They're not supposed to be used below 8C. In snow they're just completely wrong.

Be careful getting smaller diameter steel wheels - you need to be sure that they'll clear the brake calipers.

 

[rf065]

My car is on 195s and is still rubbish

I was out in a works van for a while today, Renault Kangoo, front wheel drive & 165 tyres, absolutely rubbish in snow.

There is no getting away from the fact that ordinary tyres are summer tyres and not designed for snow. Winter tyres are a revelation.

Russ

 

[crockers]

Or.................carry a pair of autosocks in your boot and use for the few days of snow we have once in a blue moon...

http://www.autosock.co.uk/product.html

 

[popuptoaster]

Mines fine on 195 tyres, its heavy enough to push the tyres down through the snow and its rwd so i can steer and accerlerate at the same time, fwd is cack in the snow, if you dont know the techniques for snow driving it may get you a little further due to the engines weight over the wheels making you feel safer driving as your not trying to steer both ends, but rwd is far better when the going gets slippy as it splits the available grip for traction and steering between 4 wheels rather than two. I did over 100 miles in it this morning and didnt even come close to getting stuck, and i was passing all sorts of things unable to get up hills, i even got up my mates driveway he couldn't get his A4 up although i couldn't leave it there cos when i stuck it in park and took me foot off the brake it started sliding down again with the rear wheels locked. lol

I keep hearing people saying fwd is best in snow but it just isnt, no pro offroad equipment built for purpose comes in fwd form, snow ploughs, tractors, snowmobiles etc etc are all either 4wd or rwd, dont bother with bags of sand in the boot either, extra weight dont help, it just makes it harder to control your vehicle, im sure it would all be compulsory in places like Scandanavia if there was any benefit.

 

[mjbarnard]

According to the etyres website my 265/35 18 inch are 643 mm (25.3 inch) overall diameter.

So just to take a random example, 205/45 18 inch are 642mm overall diameter. Would it be safe or acceptable to substitute different tyre size if wheel and overall diameter are unchanged? This is for a E320cdi.

 

[Dryce]

I keep hearing people saying fwd is best in snow but it just isnt, no pro offroad equipment built for purpose comes in fwd form, snow ploughs, tractors, snowmobiles etc etc are all either 4wd or rwd, dont bother with bags of sand in the boot either, extra weight dont help, it just makes it harder to control your vehicle, im sure it would all be compulsory in places like Scandanavia if there was any benefit.

I've been driven about in outrageously bad conditions in old FWD cars when I was younger. They were a lot better than the RWD cars of the day.

I consider my W211 on it's 16" 225/55s is very good in bad conditions. Lots better than I ever expected. OTOH the wife's R170 is a quite touchy by comparison.

 

[pauldmaynard]

Mines fine on 195 tyres, its heavy enough to push the tyres down through the snow and its rwd so i can steer and accerlerate at the same time, fwd is cack in the snow, if you dont know the techniques for snow driving it may get you a little further due to the engines weight over the wheels making you feel safer driving as your not trying to steer both ends, but rwd is far better when the going gets slippy as it splits the available grip for traction and steering between 4 wheels rather than two. I did over 100 miles in it this morning and didnt even come close to getting stuck, and i was passing all sorts of things unable to get up hills, i even got up my mates driveway he couldn't get his A4 up although i couldn't leave it there cos when i stuck it in park and took me foot off the brake it started sliding down again with the rear wheels locked. lol

I keep hearing people saying fwd is best in snow but it just isnt, no pro offroad equipment built for purpose comes in fwd form, snow ploughs, tractors, snowmobiles etc etc are all either 4wd or rwd, dont bother with bags of sand in the boot either, extra weight dont help, it just makes it harder to control your vehicle, im sure it would all be compulsory in places like Scandanavia if there was any benefit.

I disagree I have had FWD, RWD & 4WD cars & trucks

4WD you get the best traction & engine brakeing

FWD cars are far easier to drive beter traction & engine brakeing

RWD cars yes they can be a hoot but come down an ice covered hill no engine braking rear wheels turning at 4MPH engine at tickover car going faster & faster

I have lived in Sweden on and off for the last 30 years & driven many 100s of 1000 miles in the snow & ice & when it gets slipery you dont want to bein a RWD

ps ALL Swedish cars are FWD or 4wd

 

[merc180k]

Don't know about fwd or rwd, fat or skinny tyre, auto or manual boxes!! All I know is it took me 1.5 hours to get out the car park at Harthill tonight as the car may as well have had slicks on - packed the snow then sat on top!! Car mats came in handy, but did get a fiddly and tiresome having to get out and re position all the time!!

Morale to the story - when you own a merc - always carry 3 burly men in the boot to push the car when snowed in or.... walk!!!

 

[raymont]

According to the etyres website my 265/35 18 inch are 643 mm (25.3 inch) overall diameter.

So just to take a random example, 205/45 18 inch are 642mm overall diameter. Would it be safe or acceptable to substitute different tyre size if wheel and overall diameter are unchanged? This is for a E320cdi.

If you're going to the trouble of fitting different tyres for the winter months you should fit cold weather / winter tyres (terminology varies).

If you look in your vehicle handbook it will probably recommend a winter tyre size, which might be different from the summer size.

Summer tyres on my GL are 275 55 19 whereas the winter recommendation is 265 55 19.

I have winter tyres fitted at the moment ( I buy them because of winter trips to cold / snowy parts of Europe) and the difference in grip is remarkable.

It might seem expensive, but you can only wear out one set of tyres at a time so it doesn't cost more in the long run.

 

[Colin_b]

Why not get some cheap 15" steel wheels and some winter tyres and use them between November and March.

You'll apreciate the extra grip it gives you and youl keep your nice aloys in good condition for when your car is clean in summer.

I do exactly that (for a Vauxhall Meriva). Gives a little advantage when its icy/snowy. They do wear quite quickly (seem to last about 1/2 the life of normal tyres), and you need somewhere to keep them in summer.

Cheaper than bending a bumper...