Mercedes Sprinter White Diesel smoke dpf?

Discussion in 'Engine' started by NickC1234, Sep 3, 2017.

  1. NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Hello guys/girls, I am hoping you can help I have a 515 Mercedes sprinter minicoach and it is occasionally kicking out putrid white smoke on idle, the oil level was also rising.. the garage says the dpf is not blocked but I've only had the problems since they replaced the catalytic convertor.. the maf has been changed the vehicle has been terracleaned I'm getting desperate now as it's my living and the smoke it kicks out is horrendous it only does it occasionally ! It vary between 20 - 100 miles they say all the dpf pressures are fine and want to replace the o2 sensor as the next option. Anyone help? Many thanks Nick

    Apologies this is my first post I feel a tad rude just barging in and asking for help on my first post but I am desperate now !
     
  2. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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  3. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    What engine is in this 6 or 4 banger??
    Tuercas viejas
     
  4. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Om646 2.1? 2008 mercedes sprinter euro 4?
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2017
  5. wu56Shoozz

    wu56Shoozz Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    Check the Lamdda probe -if they've tampered with the CAT the it may be damaged...
     
  6. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    OK
    Getting the picture?
    Why is the high oil light rising?
    Since when has that oiling rise been going on?
    When as the last time the oil was changed and do you have count on the mileage since that change took place?

    Do you have any check engine light on?--If so what are the codes? And of course for accurate diagnosis a live data output would be helpful. But i suppose doubtful in this case!
    Let me know maybe I can help.
    Tuercas viejas
     
  7. Trickythemerc

    Trickythemerc Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    Is the CAT a genuine Mercedes part ? I had a non Merc CAT fitted to one of my Sprinters and it did pretty much what yours is doing. The DPF is trying to regen but failing and dumping fuel into the sump. The cure was a genuine Merc CAT and DPF with proper installation using Star Diagnostics. Never smoked again and oil level never moved between services.
     
  8. 400ixl

    400ixl Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    If the cat is not letting the DPF get up to temperature during a regen you could get these symptoms.
     
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Was going along the motorway and you could see blue smoke getting chucked out the exhaust after a long run it done this a few times and then the oil high light cameon then at idle you get white smoke I have dumped the oil and had it changed and levels corrected as I realised this would be diesel contamination. No engine light... I believe there was few codes air flow to hot etc the reason garage has replaced maf? trickythemerc did you have no engine light as well? The lambda sensor is the next step it's sitting at the garage but I believe they made sure the pipe work was sealed between the cat and dpf and no it's not a genuine Mercedes Cat the dpf is genuine but the pipe has been cut and the new cat installed? I'm led to believe these dpf systems are complicated and need alll the parameters setting correcting? Burn temp
    Etc can this generally only be done on star? Mercedes want 3k for the exhaust I've been trying to avoid them it was only replaced because on the gearbox mounting had rusted through!
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2017
  10. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    From your post so far!
    Its a bit unclear from where I sit whether you replaced the Cat with a genuine MB unit.
    In any case a replacement of these components requires a tech in & re-set using a suitable factory style scanner. I as a professional mechanic & shop owner use Autologic (made in the UK) but i do have a MB scanner commonly called a Star on your side but in any case star gazing style repairs don't work too well on this stuff.

    Yes if you have a non specified CAT on it the system may be confused and its permanently in re-gen mode which means its over fueling on the exhaust stroke by changing the injection pattern and as mentioned above in a separate post.
    The other similar symptoms bad injection even dare I say it, diluted fuel with high petrol content. Even a bad injector(s) although most of this should show up in fault codes, and live data outputs when running. Basically I do a base line analysis on the engine and exhaust treatment system.
    Believe it or not, I have found one unit with powered fan clutch going pattern injection scatty due to a corrupted signal to the fan clutch. The cam sensor shares the same circuit as the fan clutch on NAS models .

    Frankly from your posts I don't think the shop you have been using using to fix the issue(s) is fully conversant with the system and pattern/common--un-common fixes.

    Seriously unless you have the right diagnostic kit you may be forced to consult an MB Sprinter dealer or a specialist Independent shop in your area conversant with MB/Bosch systems to fix it. That will mean a wallet flush for sure so be prepared .
    All the best
    Tuercas Viejas
     
  11. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    It's a non genuine part supplied and fitted by the garage . They did check the dpf pressures and they said the atmospheric pressure was reading wrong and reset the dpf But from what I guessing there is a lot more to it when it comes to setting parameters. I'm guessing star will have a lot more. Tueacas viejas not in the south east are you? I'm bloody desperate to get this sorted.!!
     
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Just realised they've replaced the DPF and not the cat. I'm guessing the cat is closest to the turbo and the dpf is in the middle? If so it was a £200 dpf which I'm guessing will be ****e.
     
  13. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    Nick
    OK installing a new DPF without doing a teach in and soot load re-set will throw the rig into complete "wobbler".
    It's now confused and will need to be "got at" with a suitable scan tool like an MB factory tool and by someone who knows what he is doing.
    The DPF is not necessarily toast but it might need a re-gen to get it back to less than a 1 of gram loading if its is a legitimate component!!!.

    As a tech on these i would be checking all the sensors for signal drift in KoEo conditions, (KEY ON ENGINE OFF) which the engine bases it fueling map off of!
    It begs the question why did they change out the MAF sensor? Diagnosis figures or a wild shot gun guess?

    Sorry! If I could, I would be happy to help you some more today in my premises but my shop is in Denver, Colorado, where we work on lots of MB Sprinters 's and domestic diesel engines too; like Cummins. Ford and GMC /Isuzu units.
    If its any help my younger brother has a shop in Quedgeley Gloucestershire , a bit far for you perhaps. We have a nick name the Transatlantic time served mechanics. He decided to stay in zee ol' country ! . I can ask him to look at it for you perhaps!!!
    All the best and if you have more questions simply fire away.
    Tuercas viejas
     
  14. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    I've assumed they replaced the cat and it was in fact the dpf. The maf was done by a different garage as I just thought it was a coincidence and all the error codes pointed at the maf. In hindsight they should of checked the new exhaust part first. But I've gone back to the original garage now they've reset the dpf and so full but it's still smoking. They want to try and change lambda sensor but that will be a waste if the dpf is not setup properly ?
     
  15. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Just an update would a bad intercooler cause these problems as that's what they've changed ?
     
  16. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    If it was leaking or plugged up affecting blow pressure then yes!
    You will start losing a sensing effect at boost pressure sensor, causing possible limp modeing.
    The engine will then start black smoking internally, & continue contaminating the whole exhaust system; which in turn throws all the other sensors out of whack causing driveability problems .

    The engine then needs in any case to be checked after remedial repairs for a total health check to ensure you get no come backs or the shop has misdiagnosed the problem.

    Might it be perhaps that the Cat/DEF unit was already in advanced stages of plugged up blockage from soot and ash? The excess blow pressure pulses upstream caused the end seals to rupture causing a loss of boost?
    This will also affect the MAF sensor throwing codes which don't correlate with the fueling/mass air flow map!
    Back to my often comment treat the cause not the obvious symptom.
    All the best
    T/V
     
  17. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    They smile tested it and it was leaking so reckon that is whatvwas stopping it regenerating properly ? They said as soon as they bypassed the intercooler it started to do an active regen ? And it's never had engine light lit just funny air sensor readings saying the engine was not getting enough air? Would this cause grey smoke like my video posted due to failed regens?
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2017
  18. OP
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    NickC1234

    NickC1234 Active Member

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    Apparently the intercooler has a hole due to a stone etc. And if I was getting a full soot filter surely I would get a light first? I've never had any dash lights other than the engine high oil light. Which I'm guessing is the unborn that diesel travelling back up the wrong way due to Missfuelling caused by a broken intercooler? Hopefully they are corrrct and it ain't the dpf still lol
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2017
  19. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    If you had a leak that wasn't about 15 to 25% lower than specified boost for that power level commanded then no fault condition would exist.
    Then the system would not have faulted out & simply handled the leakage rate with some reduction in performance possibly going un-noticed if you are putzing about in your area., Most likely because your driving habits/traffic conditions are not pedal to the metal like me like me.

    No putzing about, just big open roads and go for it!:devil:

    Going back to the health tests though, I have a mountain grade & wide open to climb which is my tests route right out of the shop.
    With a scanner connected I/We look for turbo blow pressure performance and plot pressure waves from zero to flat out going through each gear in live data .
    Obviously if we see a non specified pressure loss -(like hole in the core) then its investigated by smoke test / pressure machine up to 2.2 br & remedied.

    In most having the engine running with correct boost I can usually chirp the tyres turning the corner of the street where the shop is.
    Owner/driver usually comments something like --Well it never ran like this before!. Its got some real cajones now!
    I think someone needs to do a KOEO test before going any further if you have continued issues.
    T/V
     
  20. Tuercas viejas

    Tuercas viejas Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    If you had a leak that wasn't about 15 to 25% lower than specified boost for that power level commanded then no fault condition would exist.
    Then the system would not have faulted out & simply handled the leakage rate with some reduction in performance possibly going un-noticed if you are putzing about in your area., Most likely because your driving habits/traffic conditions are not pedal to the metal like me like me.

    No putzing about, just big open roads and go for it!:devil:

    Going back to the health tests though, I have a mountain grade & wide open to climb which is my tests route right out of the shop.
    With a scanner connected I/We look for turbo blow pressure performance and plot pressure waves from zero to flat out going through each gear in live data .
    Obviously if we see a non specified pressure loss -(like hole in the core) then its investigated by smoke test / pressure machine up to 2.2 br & remedied.

    In most having the engine running with correct boost I can usually chirp the tyres turning the corner of the street where the shop is.
    Owner/driver usually comments something like --Well it never ran like this before!. Its got some real cajones now!
    I think someone needs to do a KOEO test before going any further if you have continued issues.
    T/V
     

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