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My fan works but its all wrong...isnt it????

94mattda

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Mar 1, 2007
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Location
Hove
Car
E220 Coupe, Porsche Boxster
Lifted the bonnet....started the car......and the fan is running.......rev the engine and the fan gets faster.......GREAT.......but then once the car gets warmed up the fan stops and wont come on again....even at temperatures of 100+...........................

What could be wrong???:doh:
 
Get engine hot lift bonnet use rolled up newspaper and slowly push into fan if fan stops its knackered.

Or when engine hot switch engine off and try to turn fan should be a little stiff, if spins easy it knackered.

Viscous fluid settles down overnight then when engine run centrifugal force forces fluid out and it then goes into freewheel mode, until engine temp kicks it back in again.

Read handbook for correct eng temps most people say they happily run at 100c but mine ran at 100 and new viscous unit bought it down to 85c same on wifes old m104 320.



Lynall



Lynall
 
As Lynall says it's knackered. It should get stiffer as the temperature rises...if you know what I mean..:rolleyes:

By 100c it should really whoosh when revved.

Thats what i thought, its a bit stiff when cold...do i need to replace the coupling then?
 
As Lynall says it's knackered. It should get stiffer as the temperature rises...if you know what I mean..:rolleyes:

By 100c it should really whoosh when revved.

There is much on the go in this forum re MB's overheating and/or being overcooled. Dieselman is trying his car without the fan, and even with the radiator blanked off, and not having any problems.

I have also been having trouble of the overheating kind on 3 cars this year, and underheating on the Merc (which is now overheating!). It is said elsewhere that the E300td is overcooled. So it probably is -in the UK! But these cars have to be able to drive comfortably in the Arctic circle and in Central Spain in the Summer. In the USA even more marked temperature differences have to be coped with. Even here where I am at present in South Africa, you can have 40 degree (C) and a few hours drive away be in snow. (Not snow as we Europeans understand it: just a smattering.)

The cars have to cope with this and worse. Then factor in normal things like radiators getting sludged up with the passage of time. On two occasions I have had cars driving normally in the UK, without any overheating problems, only to find that near Tours, halfway down France, in July, the car overheated. A new radiator was the cure in each case, amply tested in Central and Southern Spain and through the Pyrenees, with wife and 7 children aboard. A similar load on the M6 over the Pennines had given no such problems.

The underheating was caused by a jammed thermostat, and was a pain until fixed because it was winter in the UK. The heater never got warm even on the motorway, and the temp gauge was stubbornly low. So yes, the car without thermostat in January is overcooled!

The Land Rover Discovery tdi here in SA in the local summer was under cooled with a vengeance! I was advised to look at the head gasket by the local dealer: it is a problem area with Discos, perhaps because when off road they can be called on to perform in arduous conditions. It started with overheating due to a hose problem, during which the header tank developed a leak under high pressure. BUT it did not happen under idling, only under load when the system was fully pressurised. When this happened the coolant disappeared quietly, until it was too low and then overheated vigorously (it was in the 30's here). The pressure cap blew off some of the presssure and dirty coolant went all over the header tank, nicely concealing that there was a small crack in the bottom of the header tank, well out of sight.

I was not wont to do the cylinder head as there was no combustion gas contamination in the coolant, no steam in the exhaust gases, and no oil emlsification. On this occasion I was correct. On others I might not have been.

In my SA based 500SE I had similar problems a few years ago. It was the top hose that had a pinhole leak, which under extreme heating of the coolant sent a small jet of coolant straight onto the floor, so visible signs of a leak were absent when mobile. As the car lost coolant it was no longer present in the top hose, so when you saw the temp rise and stopped there was no jet of coolant from the top hose to be seen!

You can see how small problems lead to coolant leaks after owners have replaced all sorts of things without success in the various LR fori.

The trick is to avoid paying £110 or more per hour to a dealer while you sort this out, which is my current predicament. The MB dealer was unaware of the testing kits for coolant contamination (one is marketed by the repected Sealey, and ebay has others), and it would appear that this is not part of the MB diagnostic regime. Incredible? Yup. Yet he insists that the cylinder head gasket or the head itself or the engine need s replacement. There is no coolant contamination visible, no emulsified oil, and no steam coming from the tailpipe.
I strongly suggest that the use of fori such as this is your cheapest bet, by a long shot. The viscous fan has been replaced, but I never did think that would be the problem anyway.

However I don't think it fair to criticise Mercedes designers for the cooling capacity. The cars need an ample reserve of cooling capacity to cope with harsher conditions than found in the UK. It may lead to higher fuel consumption, as Dieselman suspects. He is being sensible and testing his theories, and would no doubt undo his modifications if faced with a trip to Greece in the summer.

Some difficulties with modern cars arise with current design practices. In days long gone cars did not have header tanks for coolant, and you could see by taking off the radiator cap when the thermostat opened and the coolant circulated. So if the top hose were hot, and there were no coolant motion, the water pump would be suspect. It is not too easy to check with header tanks.

On the Eclass estate certain rear lamps cannot easily be accessed: the handbook says that you should go to the dealer. Fine, but expensive, and try telling that to a French traffic policeman trying to up his municipality's income over Easter weekend. If the light is necessary it should be accessible: if it is not necessary it should not be there!

Some French cars are designed such that you have to take the front bumper off to change the headlight bulbs. Unforgiveable in my view.

My Xantia TD has the thermostat in the top house, and needs a screwdriver and 10 minutes to replace, as it is in the top hose. No gasket needed for the traditional thermostat housing, and much better than the E300td location and access. And they say Citroens are poorly designed from the servicing viewpoint. (Some are!!!)

Good luck with your problem!!!
 
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Hello again...........Today the car has had a new viscous coupling, belt, thermostat and tensioner. The fan still does not kick in when hot....???

We did however find out that the sensor that i assume controls the air con switches on the two smaller fans on the front of the radiator when it is unplugged from its 2 pin plug.

What else could i replace other than the coolant sensor which MB are getting back to me about as they were not sure which part i needed. Figures lol !!!
 
Which fan do you mean doesn't cut in.?
I thought you meant the viscous one, which should control the temperature on it's own without the need for the electric ones at all.

Is it definitely a viscous fan on yours or one with an electromagnetic clutch.?
 
Which fan do you mean doesn't cut in.?
I thought you meant the viscous one, which should control the temperature on it's own without the need for the electric ones at all.

The viscous one does not cut in.... still not heard it WHOOSH at high temps..... but whilst messing around when the mechanic dropped it back to me we took off a sensors connectors and the two fans on the front kicked in and the temp on the dash dropped....but obviously there not for the cooling of the engine. So the cooling fan still is not kicking in...is there anything else that can be replaced or cause it not too WHOOOOOOOOOOSH:doh:
 
How hot is it getting now though, it may not be hot enough to completely lock the viscous coupling up.
 
It still gets to 100 i guess....its the line between 80 and 120 on the temp gauge. Sits at about 90 now on the motorway when before the change of coupling it went to 80 on the motorway
 
It should sit at 90c. It was presumably running a bit cool due to the thermostat.
As long as it runs at 90-100 maximum, with no overheating, then it's ok.

Is the fan coupling now stiffer than it was when it's fully hot.?

Theonly other thing that would allow it to run hot would be radiator efficiency. Try a flushing agent or backflushing with a hose until clean water emerges.

I've just checked the thermostat rating. It should be fully open at 87c, so 90c is about right.
 
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I will check that tomorrow......It has never gone above 100 since i have had it on long drives or in traffic but it just seems hot too me.....Before i had these bits done today the day before it was running at about 100, parked up and heard it gurglling and hissing a little from the water tank....Mechanic was there, said it was pressurising but did not think it was the head.....no emulsification or loss of oil or water....adn runs lovely otherwise..

But like earlier i said when the two smaller fans came on after we disconnected the plug thingy it cooled they brought the temp down to about 80 - 90
 
Gurgling can be a result of localised overheating due to lack of water flow. A few things that could affect that would be the thermostat, blocked radiator, bad water pump, head gasket.

If it's the gasket it will pressurise right from cold, if the other things then it's only going to do it when hot.
 
Well its only done it when hot....and only once....maybe i will flush the system on Monday as am away for the weekend.

Is there a way to test the water pump or is it a just replace job>

Thanks DM.....will update again on Monday..... thanks again.
 
Flush the system before bothering about the pump. There is a simple test but it involves messing with the hoses and a clear lemonade bottle...:D

As a final check for the head gasket you could have the water tested for combustion gasses.
 
Flush the system before bothering about the pump. There is a simple test but it involves messing with the hoses and a clear lemonade bottle...:D

As a final check for the head gasket you could have the water tested for combustion gasses.


Cool... thankyou. Will do all this on Monday, Have a good weekend and will update soon. Thanks again DM:thumb:
 
Dont rule out a furred up radiator. Get the engine hot and then run your hand over the radiator matrix - if there are cool spots then that could be your problem.
 

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