Oil Prices

[NewMB]

Filled up today at local Shell (A12 northbound - Colchester).

Petrol: 94.9
Diesel: 107.9

Pretty good I think. Can't remember last time this happened.....

 

[Smiley]

I think it was only about 12 months ago....

 

[Birdman]

As a definition of monopoly one could scarcely do better than to begin with the OFT White Paper, 'The role of market definition in monopoly and dominance inquiries' (Economic Discussion Paper 2 July 2001).

This states in its preamble:

'Chapter II of the UK Competition Act 1998 ('the Act') prohibits dominant firms
from abusing their market position. It closely mirrors EC law under Article 82 of
the EC Treaty. Specifically, the Act states that:
'… any conduct on the part of one or more undertakings which amounts to
the abuse of a dominant position in a market is prohibited if it may affect
trade within the United Kingdom.'

So lets get one thing straight: the OPEC cartel is in a position to do just this and in fact (a killer fact) it was set up with the express and declared intention of creating a false market in oil.

That the OPEC cartel does not always succeed in its stated objectives should not blind us to the fact that the price of oil is far higher than would prevail under a genuinely free and competitive market on the supply side.

 

[carnut]

Does this help/

http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/petrol-oil.html

Im looking forward to petrol back below 80p/litre now that oil is under $50/barrel

 

[vijilants]

Does this help/

http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/petrol-oil.html

Im looking forward to petrol back below 80p/litre now that oil is under $50/barrel

Yep, the motorist is getting seriously ripped off at the moment.

 

[NewMB]

Yep, the motorist is getting seriously ripped off at the moment.

At the moment??? I would say always in the UK.

Never come across a country more in love with charging for absolutely everything!!

Right now, at 2221 hrs, the oil price is $48.85

 

[Smiley]

It just shows how completely illogical and irrational the monetary and investment world has become that in the space of 4 months the spot price of a barrel of oil - a commodity for which the demand goes up and down - but does not fall off the edge of a cliff - has gone from $147 to $48

 

[vijilants]

Gas prices are also linked to oil prices and there has been no drop there either.

I think one of the major problems in the UK is cultural. Brits are not really into mass protests. We moan a lot about this sort of thing but never really do much more.

So, as a result the companies / governments get away with as much as possible because they know that they can push us as far as they want.

 

[hawk20]

Does this help/

http://www.whatprice.co.uk/petrol-prices/petrol-oil.html

Im looking forward to petrol back below 80p/litre now that oil is under $50/barrel

You will see prices fall to a level that reflects the fall in world prices.

BUT remember that a barrel at $60 cost £30 when the exchange rate was 2 dollars to the pound. But since the collapse of the £ to around $1.50 that same barrel will cost £40.

As for Birdman and the power of OPEC it is worth remembering that OPEC had little or nothing to do with the price going to $147 per barrel and has been virtually powerless to stop the slide the slide to $50.

OPEC members only 'control' 40% of the market and that control is not very watertight. When the price is high members cheat and sell more than they agreed.

 

[nullogik]

I think one of the major problems in the UK is cultural. Brits are not really into mass protests. We moan a lot about this sort of thing but never really do much more.

I read in a paper that from its peak oil prices have dropped some 60% to what they are now today. Yet petrol prices at the pumps have fallen by about 15-20%. We are clearly being ripped off.

One thing we can do is to boycott the large oil company's forecourts such as those like BP, Shell, Esso etc. who are always the slowest to lower their prices and instead start buying fuel at the supermarket forecourts. Hopefully by seeing an increase in sales, the supermarkets will continually lower their prices to attract more custom away from the oil company forecourts which will in turn lower the prices across the range of retailers - or I would hope so anyway. I for one, now buy all my petrol from my local Asda or Sainsburys stations.

Were it not for the likes of Asda and Morrisons, I think we'd still be paying over £1 a litre for our fuel.

 

[hawk20]

I read in a paper that from its peak oil prices have dropped some 60% to what they are now today. Yet petrol prices at the pumps have fallen by about 15-20%. We are clearly being ripped off.

.

We must try and be realistic. Only in July the price rocketed to $147 per barrel. Very recently it has plummeted to around $50. Incredible change in very short period indeed. Unprecedented.

First remember that many will buy their oil weeks or months in advance to ensure supplies etc. It will be that sort of time before their costs reflect the drop in world prices.

Even for those who buy oil at spot price (today's price) remember there is a 6 week lag from world market, till the oil goes to refiners, through the refining process, and gets delivered to the pumps. So a bit of patience and you do see the drop.

Allow for the change in the exchange rate of the £ against the dollar.

Allow for fact that most of the price is tax. So the world price only affects part of the price.

 

[3 phase]

hawk20 you d't happen to work at Fawley do you???

 

[BTB 500]

One thing we can do is to boycott the large oil company's forecourts such as those like BP, Shell, Esso etc. who are always the slowest to lower their prices and instead start buying fuel at the supermarket forecourts.

I guess that varies by area. Where I am the Tesco, Sainsburys, Shell and two BP forecourts are all at 94.9 for unleaded.

www.petrolprices.com

We shop at Sainsburys but the fuel there is normally the same price as the Shell down the road, or even slightly more expensive.

 

[NewMB]

I think one of the major problems in the UK is cultural. Brits are not really into mass protests. We moan a lot about this sort of thing but never really do much more.

Well, you did do alot of protests during Thatcher time..... strike here, strike there. It was like the UK were on a constant strike (a bit like the French and/or the Italians).

 

[vijilants]

Well, you did do alot of protests during Thatcher time..... strike here, strike there. It was like the UK were on a constant strike (a bit like the French and/or the Italians).

True.....the last huge protest by the folks of this country was against the Poll tax, but that tax had a direct impact on every single person...After all of that was changed, funny how nobody in my household protested about the amount of council tax I have to pay for the entire household

Everyone is impacted in some form by the fuel robbery thats currently taking place but in the case of the fuel, it's just the motorists and the lorry drivers that are directly impacted in their pockets.

 

[Mr E]

We must try and be realistic. Only in July the price rocketed to $147 per barrel. Very recently it has plummeted to around $50. Incredible change in very short period indeed. Unprecedented.

First remember that many will buy their oil weeks or months in advance to ensure supplies etc. It will be that sort of time before their costs reflect the drop in world prices.

Even for those who buy oil at spot price (today's price) remember there is a 6 week lag from world market, till the oil goes to refiners, through the refining process, and gets delivered to the pumps. So a bit of patience and you do see the drop.

Allow for the change in the exchange rate of the £ against the dollar.

Allow for fact that most of the price is tax. So the world price only affects part of the price.

The one thing that none of the posts in this tread have explained to me is why, when oil goes up (by any reasonable degree) the forecourt price rices the next day, but when the price drops all we hear is the bleating about the lag in price reduction from the fuel companies and the prices trickle down.

Do what they did in France this summer - park a truck in the petrol station, lock it and walk away. Didn't take too long for the prices to come down where I saw this happening...

Even in real terms ($140/barrel @ $1.90/£ = £73.68/barrel; $50/barrel @ $1.49/£ = £33.56/barrel) is a 54% reduction (as opposed to a drop of 64% in $ terms). So although you wouldn't expect a fall of 50% (cos duty, etc comes into play. not just fuel cost) you would expect prices to be well below £1/l for both petrol and diesel.

 

[MikeL]

USA wins again

So can someone explain why the price of forecourt petrol has come down by half in the USA - how much has ours come down by, 20% ?

Mike

 

[Smiley]

So can someone explain why the price of forecourt petrol has come down by half in the USA - how much has ours come down by, 20% ?

Mike

Less duty and tax as a proportion and no exchange rate difference to take in to account.

 

[hawk20]

The one thing that none of the posts in this tread have explained to me is why, when oil goes up (by any reasonable degree) the forecourt price rices the next day .......

Even in real terms ($140/barrel @ $1.90/£ = £73.68/barrel; $50/barrel @ $1.49/£ = £33.56/barrel) is a 54% reduction (as opposed to a drop of 64% in $ terms). So although you wouldn't expect a fall of 50% (cos duty, etc comes into play. not just fuel cost) you would expect prices to be well below £1/l for both petrol and diesel.

First prices do not go up straight away in my experience.

Prices do come down rapidly allowing for the time lag of about 6 weeks from world price , through refineries to the pumps.

What has stopped us having a much bigger drop so far has been the collapse of the pound. In July it was $2. Recently it has been under $1.50. That is a huge effect. Adds 33% to the part of the price that is not tax.

 

[Subyland]

All these pages and pages of explanations have me confused. It is probably far too complicated for me to understand but I do notice one constant pattern:

fuel prices always go up faster than they come down...