Gazwould
MB Enthusiast
Yes quietens them down for a reason.
Which 2T did you use ?
Which 2T did you use ?
Oil
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No but I use TCW3 2 stroke oil in petrol for the bike. TCW3 is the ashless marine grade so it burns cleanly without polluting the marine environment or carboning up your combustion chambers.
What's the reason it quietens diesels ? It must affect the combustion process somehow.
grober
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Opinions seem to differ:
The Truth About Adding Two-Stroke Oil To Diesel In Modern Common Rail Engines
2-Stroke Oil In Diesel – A Technical Study
But in essence it has to do with lubricating the injector nozzles, apparently.
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classiccarzone
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A remarkable if not controversial post on oil change from the tdiclub forum
TDIClub Forums - View Single Post - Final Horrifyingly Stupid Question - OCI?
TDIClub Forums - View Single Post - Final Horrifyingly Stupid Question - OCI?
Yugguy
MB Enthusiast
Ah yes, jaso fg, fc or fd? Marine oil is ashless but is also designed to burn in cooler marine engines.
A veritable minefield.
If that post from the tdiclub wasn't so bloody patronising I might have considered it. The whole of the text though relies on accepting the initial supposition.
A veritable minefield.
If that post from the tdiclub wasn't so bloody patronising I might have considered it. The whole of the text though relies on accepting the initial supposition.
Gazwould
MB Enthusiast
That's my VW tdi knackered then , 12 oil changes in 22K , some are just 1300 miles apart , lol .
Reminds me of an astonshing BS LongLife oil account of an Audi main dealer as apparently the oil intelligently knew when it was going to be changed and cleaned the inside of the engine up , lol .
The first is correct in quoting low ash mineral which is JASO FB .
The technical study is incorrectly studying semi / fully synthetic JASO FC which neither dissolves fully or burn completely leaving deposits .
It's all about the cetane number for diesel like octane is for petrol , unlike petrol igniting too fast ( pre ignition ) diesel's ignition is with a delay causing 'diesel knock' , particularly noticeable on a cold morning start .
Because 2 Stroke originally is a petrol additive it ignites like petrol so you are improving diesel's ignition point as the 2T acts as a catalyst , the 2 Stroke molecules ignite first and the diesel's follow . Other like products like Stop Smoke contain kerosene , Acetone works too apparently .
The result is less ignition delay diesel knock thus less vibration and noise .
Better timing , less exhaust smoke .
Someone said it halved their mot smoke opacity test .
Sure enough I looked through mine and it did with consistent multiple years results .
The 2T oil contains detergents and dispersants that keep the fuel system clean but probably no cleaner than what's already there , dilution rates are so small and economical just 300ml goes in 60L .
In Sweden they've been doing it for over 30 years and no injector alerts !
Because 2 Stroke improves the combustion delay this is a Cetane number improver , I did find a comparison test once against marketed and real improvers like 2-EHN like what Diesel Rhino and Millers Ecomax will contain and 2T worked .
Cetane number isn't disclosed on the UK diesel pumps so we are conned when it comes to 'super diesel' .
Supermarket derv and 2 Stroke..
Reminds me of an astonshing BS LongLife oil account of an Audi main dealer as apparently the oil intelligently knew when it was going to be changed and cleaned the inside of the engine up , lol .
The first is correct in quoting low ash mineral which is JASO FB .
The technical study is incorrectly studying semi / fully synthetic JASO FC which neither dissolves fully or burn completely leaving deposits .
It's all about the cetane number for diesel like octane is for petrol , unlike petrol igniting too fast ( pre ignition ) diesel's ignition is with a delay causing 'diesel knock' , particularly noticeable on a cold morning start .
Because 2 Stroke originally is a petrol additive it ignites like petrol so you are improving diesel's ignition point as the 2T acts as a catalyst , the 2 Stroke molecules ignite first and the diesel's follow . Other like products like Stop Smoke contain kerosene , Acetone works too apparently .
The result is less ignition delay diesel knock thus less vibration and noise .
Better timing , less exhaust smoke .
Someone said it halved their mot smoke opacity test .
Sure enough I looked through mine and it did with consistent multiple years results .
The 2T oil contains detergents and dispersants that keep the fuel system clean but probably no cleaner than what's already there , dilution rates are so small and economical just 300ml goes in 60L .
In Sweden they've been doing it for over 30 years and no injector alerts !
Because 2 Stroke improves the combustion delay this is a Cetane number improver , I did find a comparison test once against marketed and real improvers like 2-EHN like what Diesel Rhino and Millers Ecomax will contain and 2T worked .
Cetane number isn't disclosed on the UK diesel pumps so we are conned when it comes to 'super diesel' .
Supermarket derv and 2 Stroke..
Why don’t the fuel companies/refineries add 2-stroke to diesel on an industrial scale?
Genuine question - there must be a reason that they don’t, or are not allowed to?
Genuine question - there must be a reason that they don’t, or are not allowed to?
Gazwould
MB Enthusiast
They want to milk the premium super diesel carries .
Basically all the pump stations in an area get the same base fuel from the same refinery then add their own additives .
Basically all the pump stations in an area get the same base fuel from the same refinery then add their own additives .
Gazwould
MB Enthusiast
No just their additives whatever they be .
classiccarzone
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Apparently this guy is regarded as one of the foremost experts in the field of oils and engine wear and injection.
I had some other articles on him but cannot find them at the moment.
This will do for the time being.
Injector Removal and Installation
Could be two stroke then?
But in all seriousness, if two stroke was a good idea why don’t they add it to the fuel - whether that be the premium diesel or otherwise?
Would be interesting to know.
Gazwould
MB Enthusiast
They just put in the bare minimum and sell on volume to make profit .
Super diesel , possibly more detergents , cetane number improvement ??
Super diesel , possibly more detergents , cetane number improvement ??
I’m not convinced. So you’re saying the *only* reason it isn’t put in by default is due to cost, nothing else?
There is not even a single downside of using it?
1 part two stroke per 200 parts diesel and no fuel retailer will sell it due to cost? Not even on premium fuels?
Sounds very strange to me considering this has been known about for decades
There is not even a single downside of using it?
1 part two stroke per 200 parts diesel and no fuel retailer will sell it due to cost? Not even on premium fuels?
Sounds very strange to me considering this has been known about for decades
OP
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I’m not convinced. So you’re saying the *only* reason it isn’t put in by default is due to cost, nothing else?
There is not even a single downside of using it?
1 part two stroke per 200 parts diesel and no fuel retailer will sell it due to cost? Not even on premium fuels?
Sounds very strange to me considering this has been known about for decades
I’d be interested to hear about the possible downsides too.
Yugguy
MB Enthusiast
Can't comment on his knowledge but nobody ever persauded someone else by patronising them:
"Did you comprehend that?"
"Because people like you either:
1) Can't read the owners manual
3) Can't follow directions"
"Don't argue with me about it"
"Now pay attention,"
Reading that Bailey site it would seem to suggest 2T is not needed so much in my 646EVO engine which has Delphi injection.
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Personally I find the subject of car lubricants - including Esters and SAPS and what-have-you - to be very interesting. I have learnt a thing or two from members' posts on here, and tried to contribute myself where possible.
But I also think that we need to distinguish between the academic interest and the practical implications.
In the past few decades I have owned two Vuaxhalls (over a combined period of 12 years), two Mercs (10 years), a Renault (5 years), a Toyota (20 years), a Honda (5 years), and a Kia (5 years).
All were/are petrol-engined cars, apart from the Kia which is a Diesel with DPF.
All were serviced by their respective main dealers, or in the case of the Mercs by trusted indies.
In all cases I trusted the garage to use whatever oil they recommended (and it was always to manufacturer's spec).
On my Mercs, main dealers used Castrol, Shell Helix Ultra, and MB-branded oil. Indies used Mobil (not Mobil1), and MB-branded oil.
I have never had engine-related issues in any car I owned/own.
Yes they have all been serviced regularly, and yes I use premium fuels, but that's about it.
So I really don't think there's any practical reason to be overly concerned with the make or type of oil used by dealers or trusted indies, again as long as it meets the respective manufacturer's specs.
But I also think that we need to distinguish between the academic interest and the practical implications.
In the past few decades I have owned two Vuaxhalls (over a combined period of 12 years), two Mercs (10 years), a Renault (5 years), a Toyota (20 years), a Honda (5 years), and a Kia (5 years).
All were/are petrol-engined cars, apart from the Kia which is a Diesel with DPF.
All were serviced by their respective main dealers, or in the case of the Mercs by trusted indies.
In all cases I trusted the garage to use whatever oil they recommended (and it was always to manufacturer's spec).
On my Mercs, main dealers used Castrol, Shell Helix Ultra, and MB-branded oil. Indies used Mobil (not Mobil1), and MB-branded oil.
I have never had engine-related issues in any car I owned/own.
Yes they have all been serviced regularly, and yes I use premium fuels, but that's about it.
So I really don't think there's any practical reason to be overly concerned with the make or type of oil used by dealers or trusted indies, again as long as it meets the respective manufacturer's specs.
