OM651 (W204 2009 - now) - 220 vs 250

[GazNicki]

Hi all

I was wondering if anyone knew the difference between the 220 and the 250 in terms of tuning them.

From my understanding, they both use the OM651 2.1 Diesel Engine with a bi-turbo setup. The 250 puts out 201bhp from the factory, and the 220 puts out 167bhp from the factory. The same engine is in the Infiniti Q50 with the 220 tune.

When it comes to giving these a remap, there seems to be a big difference in power. The 220 (2009 on) goes from 167 to 215, yet the 250 goes from 201 to 255.

If these are the same engine, and it looks like both are using the same ECU (CRD2 or CRD3), then what is holding the 220 back 40bhp? Is this down to injectors, fuelling or cooling - or is this something else that a genuine custom map would be able to ignore?

I've had a look for a few days and I can't find anything definitive.

 

[ChrisHGTV]

I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will be along but i'm sure i saw a thread about the differences before (when i bought my 250). I may be wrong but from memory the later 220 has a single turbo and the injectors are different. So there are more differences than just the map.

 

[Gazwould]

Don't forget the OM651 being in the Q30 and QX30 too !

Can be confusing this one..

Both are sequencial bi-turbo , high pressure smaller turbo for low rpm spool and mid / high rpm is taken over by the larger low pressure turbo in the 250's case the second turbo is larger than the 220's along with extra capacity to flow more fuel with the 250's injectors .

But due to faulty Piezo injectors fiasco it was back to older tech more reliable magnetic solenoid .

This affected the 250 CDI more as the fuel injection wasn't optimised for it so in reality on a realistic dyno they average around 182 bhp and 460 Nm and not 204 / 500 .

The 220 is much closer to it's stock figures so both as stock there would be little between them .

So because of this in reality the 250 doesn't get to 255 because it's on the back foot already .

Realistically up to 235 and 530 Nm is available with alot barely making over 500 Nm , Stage 2 , 580 Nm .

 

[GazNicki]

Thanks for that. So more than just a map then.

I have the Q50 right now, and whilst it is a lovely car, it needs more grunt IMO. There seems to be a lot of confusion - some places don't even list the car as a vehicle they will map, but then list the 220 and 250 lol.

 

[Gazwould]

Any throttle pedal lag ?

Mine had but fixed it to great satisfaction with a pedal box device .

 

[GazNicki]

Horrendous lag.

It's also a manual, and they opted to keep the same pedal for the manual as they have the auto - so I have "kickdown" on the pedal.

 

[Gazwould]

Lol , I didn't known that , I disabled mine as it would do a screaming double gear drop on a engine that makes peak torque 1600-1800 rpm and peak power 4250 rpm and even more pointless as peak power is now at 3500 .

Now only drops one gear .


Throttle pedal lag cure .

 

[GazNicki]

Well worth the money you think?

 

[Gazwould]

Best thing I did to it .

 

[GazNicki]

Awesome. Where did you this this from?

 

[Gazwould]

Sprint Booster for: Mercedes C-Class w204 (all engines) | RTECSHOP.co.uk

www.rtecshop.co.uk

 

[Tonygw]

Wow I can see a purchase coming on soon. Does it have any affect on the gearbox modes, Eco, sport manual etc as mines a 7 speed auto.

I must admit the lag is slightly annoying, this seems to be the answer..

 

[Gazwould]

Tony you will love it to bits , the first quarter of pedal is transformed .

Only one setting for me that achieves that old cable 1:1 relationship between pedal and throttle plate .

Race 9 .

 

[clk320x]

I must be the only one who likes the OE setup then

 

[GazNicki]

Sprint Booster for: Mercedes C-Class w204 (all engines) | RTECSHOP.co.uk

www.rtecshop.co.uk

Is that applicable to the Q50 too?

 

[Gazwould]

Can't see an application for it .

Email the inventor ,

[email protected]

 

[BlackC55]

I am not a fan of sprint boosters. If you want to pull away faster push the pedal further

 

[GazNicki]

I am not a fan of sprint boosters. If you want to pull away faster push the pedal further

Its more about hesitation and delay.
Putting the pedal down opens up the throttle-body, but with the old cable systems, the speed of the opening was the speed in which you put the foot down. If you put the pedal down smoothly, and softly, the TB opened up in the same way.

With the Electronic Systems, even if you mash the pedal down as fast as you can, the TB opens up as fast as the system allows. If the software maximises the opening at 1second for example, even if you floor it in 0.25seconds, you are gaining nothing.

The sprint booster is supposed to remove this delay by boosting the signal being sent, thus allowing the TB to open faster.

There are videos where people have done various tests. One owner of a BMW not only reduced his 0-62 time by 7%, but also got a more consistent time too.

Granted, everything is only as good as the driver - and if you change gears like a ham-fisted buffoon, a Sprint Booster won't make any difference. But so far, reviews look good.

 

[Gazwould]

That old Chestnut... it's actually true though , but for cars with no drive by wire delay , unfortunately an American Mercedes forum member did a white paper on it from the outset he analysed his delay was a less than 0.1 s and the Sprint Booster surprisingly didn't make a difference !

So came the entrenched views of the small minded , if his car had a significant delay an improvement would of happend .

It's like K&N filters , there has to be a restriction in the stock set up for a positive result .

If I fancy a laugh I go over to outbackjoe , Sprint Booster , Is It Worth It ?


There's now videos of people with cameras trained on their throttle bodies and footwells showing an improvement .

As above doing timed runs and a video of a like product doing dyno pulls and it showed the device made the torque come in earlier .

Equally there is one video showing no change ( no delay to overcome there ! ) It was a more a throttle controller Vs proper ecu tuning vid .

In my particular result the device had more of a dyno butt improvement than the remap and I did gain alot of torque with that file .

With some remaps usually the more expensive ones they go into the accelerator pedal developer coding and address the delay* , but this will be just one setting .

Some throttle controllers offer a lot more by way of useful extra features .

 

[Martyn_n]

What throttle body are we talking about here? I thought the discussion was around diesel engines.