Parking Ticket - Should I appeal?

[High-Lo]

After my test drive with the Dodge yesterday afternoon I came back to an undeserved parking ticket I had parked in a metered parking bay and paid my 50p (20p per 30 mins) and was gone for just under an hour. Because I was late for the appointment I did not check the meter (stupidly) after I put my 50p in. Unfortunately the meter was out of order and I got the ticket.

Where do I stand with regards to appealing? I put the right amount of money in to cover the time I was parked. The machine took my money (I thought they block the insertion of coins when out of order). I have done everything right as a 'consumer'. There is small print on the meter which says that a fixed penalty may be given if the meter is showing out of order. I cannot blame the parking attendant as he was just doing his job.

So to summarise my movements:

Parked at 15:10 (paid 50p to cover just over an hour)
Got ticket at 16:03
Returned at 16:05 (to find attendant walking away)

The only time I checked the meter display was before I put my money in. It was showing a 'P' (Penalty) with a few zeros. I then inserted my 50p and walked away. After I got my ticket I checked the meter display again and it does indeed say 'out of order' but its displayed in tiny characters in the corner of the LCD display.

If there was CCTV around it would have shown what time I arrived and got back and that I put money in the meter. They could probably even find my fingerprints on the 50 pence piece (if they wanted to take it that far!).

As far as the rules go I suppose I was in the wrong for not noticing that the meter was out of order when I parked. What should I do? Pay the early £40 penalty for a quiet life or attempt an appeal and risk doubling the fine to £80 (or court action etc) which would pee me off even more?

Any suggestions?

Cheers,
Steve

 

[kwakdonut]

I notice that the offence is "parked in an out or order meter bay during controlled hours" - I would have thought that the mis-spelling would invalidate the ticket as it makes no sense!!! Might be worth a quick chat with a solicitor to confirm perhaps or anyone on here have any experience of this?

 

[kwakdonut]

Have also just noticed that the PCN Number is semi-illegible too - might make a good case for an appeal!!!

 

[glojo]

After my test drive with the Dodge yesterday afternoon I came back to an undeserved parking ticket

Hi Steve,

Sorry to hear about your misfortune, but my brain keeps asking why on earth you never parked on the premises of the dealership?? Sorry to be nosey, but my curiousity has got the better of me.

Good luck resolving this issue. Hopefully the meter will show the difference in money to activations???

Regards,
John

 

[High-Lo]

Hi Steve,

Sorry to hear about your misfortune, but my brain keeps asking why on earth you never parked on the premises of the dealership?? Sorry to be nosey, but my curiousity has got the better of me.

Good luck resolving this issue. Hopefully the meter will show the difference in money to activations???

Regards,
John

Hi John,

This is why I'm kicking myself even more. My wife suggested I park in the dealership but because it looked so tight in there I took it upon myself to park across the road in the meter bay to avoid the risk of dreaded car park dents in my doors. Wished I'd taken her advice now

Cheers,
Steve

 

[glojo]

Hi John,

This is why I'm kicking myself even more. My wife suggested I park in the dealership

Hi Steve,
Thanks for taking my post in the way it was meant. I hate smart alec's who use hind sight, but I bet your wife might be having a secret chuckle!!

Regards
John

 

[neilrr]

http://www.pepipoo.com/ > http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=30

 

[SimonsMerc]

I like pepipoo in general, but the letter in this post makes great reading

-simon

 

[lil.smartie]

If you appeal whilst the £40 option is still in place then the fine won't double whilst you await the results.

Good Luck

Kate

 

[Swiss Toni]

I suggest you pm robert.saunders - better to speak to an expert than ask for too much from t'internet

 

[Dryce]

This is why I'm kicking myself even more. My wife suggested I park in the dealership but because it looked so tight in there I took it upon myself to park across the road in the meter bay to avoid the risk of dreaded car park dents in my doors. Wished I'd taken her advice now

Who's to say that you wouldn't have ended up posting about a door ding
had you gone the other way on that decision.

I would be inclined to follow the advice given earlier about the
immediate appeal.

It would also be worth pushing for your money back. (Your wife
is a witness?). That might sound trivial but if they acquiesce
that then they're admitting that the meter accepted your money.
You can then use that as leverage two ways. Firstly that the meter
was possibly not faulty when you inserted the money because it
accepted it, or that they have taken the money illegally (or
they incited the parking offence).

The mess of the parking offence and the reference number on
the ticket give you some ammunition to point out that their systems
are inherently faulty.

 

[scumbag]

as suggested above contact Robert Saunders.

but do it fast. An appeal at this stage may well result in the fine being dropped. It may not as well, but at least you will only pay the original amount if you get in now.

its a pity they havent badly written your ticket. its too legible for an argument there.

Perhaps you could suggest they take steps to prevent people from being able to use an out of order machine duing your appeal.

Whatever you do do, dont threaten to withhold payment. it only gets their backs up. You are just questioning whether you think its fair and reasonable! Bear in mind, they may think it is as you did park where your shouldnt have!

 

[219]

Do they have a sign on display stating that it is an offence to park in 'an out of order bay' ?

I have done this in Edinburgh in the past and , checking with a passing warden upon parking , he tried a coin in the meter then told me just to put a note in my windscreen and I would not be ticketed . He also radioed in notifying the faulty meter .

My point being - this 'rule' is not universal and unless there is a prominent sign specifically saying you may not park when the meter is not working then you could argue that if you parked within a legal bay causing no obstruction , were willing and able to pay , then it is not unreasonable to just park under these circumstances . I would also opine that small print , which some people might require glasses to read , would not qualify as a prominent notice which any person might be reasonably expected to see .

In this case you actually did pay , and having put your money in , were perfectly entitled to park , having paid for the time .

 

[robert.saunders]

Hi everyone, sorry for delay in responding.

Anyway, looking at the PCN scan (thanks for that, makes my job easier) it is a "good" PCN - you have no grounds to expect that PCN to be quashed on a technicality - it has date of contravention, date of notice, it is signed, has clear details (the obscured PCN number on the payment slip is irrelevant to appeal, as is the spelling error/grammar on the description). Assuming your car details are correct I have no issue over the ticket itself.

With regards to the meter - different area this.

You MUST appeal this ticket, and get the ball rolling with the council to hold the "charge" at £40 pending appeal. Don't hold back payment ever, and don't ignore it (not that you would obviously). Don't pay then appeal - payment may be accepted as closure.

Just visit the council web pages to log an appeal - keep copy etc and explain the following:

1 - what is the standard expected of parking services when the meter is out of order - should it be covered up?
2 - if the parking services team expect that the LCD to show "out of order" is sufficient, shouldn't the meter stop accepting coins? [it may or may not - depends on make of meter. Contravention 08 applies to electronic meters only]

Other than that, you have little course of action - but you must appeal and do so within 14 days.

I would also check the street signage to ensure it's correct - that could be another area to explore. If you have pictures of that I will look over.

You are dealing with Vincipark here (like NCP, a bit faceless) so make sure you keep everything and everything must be in writing. Ultimately you can go to NPAS but they will only decide on technicalities, not moral judgements of the council decisions. And if you lose appeal, it will be the £80 at NPAS stage.

Btw, this doesn't go to court in the normal sense - ultimately payment is pursued via Traffic Enforcement Centre in Northampton (TEC) (a fast-track "court" set up purely for these Traffic Act contraventions) who can then issue the warrant for charge recovery by bailiffs, for those that are interested (this only applies to Road Traffic Act 1991 charges - and never call the money 'due' a debt or fine - legally, it's a charge. Weird I know).

Anyway, good luck with the appeal - on the face of it not much grounds to challenge but we shall see. These things are sent to try us, and I hope my information is impartial and helpful.

Rob

 

[glojo]

Anyway, good luck with the appeal - on the face of it not much grounds to challenge but we shall see. These things are sent to try us, and I hope my information is impartial and helpful.

Impartial, and extremely helpful to a number of us.

Regards,
John

 

[Benzowner]

Extremely interesting advice. Thanks Rob

 

[SportsCoupeRich]

totally useless comment warning. Do you live in bexleyheath High Lo...i only just moved away from there 7 months ago. I would of kept my eyes peeled for the car if i had known!!

 

[High-Lo]

totally useless comment warning. Do you live in bexleyheath High Lo...i only just moved away from there 7 months ago. I would of kept my eyes peeled for the car if i had known!!

Hi Rich Sorry mate I missed this post. I live in Orpington. Was only in Bexley for the test drive

 

[High-Lo]

Success at last :bannana:

Thanks again to everyone for their kind advice (especially Robert). What a great forum this is. You all

 

[scotth_uk]

Good outcome. Well done.

I am amazed though - aren't you responsible for checking that the meter is working and has registered your coins? I've always assumed that if a meter is out of order, I have to notice that and park elsewhere.....?