Plasma vs LED - the debate!!

[DuFFmAn]

Hello People,

My CRT TV has decided to move on to another life in scrapyard heaven and now I have the long and difficult task of purchasing a new one.

I am after a 50” plus screen… I found a really nice LG LED 55” on Amazon for £1300.

I also found a similar spec 50” plasma screens going for £700ish…

The 5” difference between the plasma and LED screen doesn’t really bother me…

I have seen both LED and Plasma screens in action and both satisfy my needs however the LED screen has the edge for me.

I however, cannot justify paying the extra £600 for an LED screen when a Plasma essentially does the same job.

So can anyone here help me make a decision???? The one thing that would help is the amount of energy a plasma tv would use over an LED. The TV is generally switched on for 10-12 hours a day and I wonder if purchasing an LED TV at an extra £600 now would bring down the energy consumption over say a 5 year period. Even if it saves £300 would justify it for me…. Any scientists here care to do some expert calculations for me???

Duffman… (Looking for expert guidance)

 

[grober]

There are advocates for both technologies. The clincher for me is not the ultimate picture quality but where and when the screen is to be viewed. If a large portion of your viewing will be done in a room in bright daylight then go LED/ LCD would be my advice but beware of backlight "edge effects" on the the larger LED screen sizes.

 

[Tan]

From memory, Plasma's are a good deal heavier than LCD's and a lot more than LED's, so if it will be mounted on a wall then this is worth taking into account also.

 

[saorbust]

Plasma's use more juice generally.

LED will be better quality picture on a sub 40 inch screen.

Plasma's tend to look better on larger screens but aren't so sharp.

I'd visit a large department store, see both the specific models you are after, and then choose. Take a DVD you know well. Don't rely on their signal in store.

J.

 

[renault12ts]

Hello People,

My CRT TV has decided to move on to another life in scrapyard heaven and now I have the long and difficult task of purchasing a new one.

I am after a 50” plus screen… I found a really nice LG LED 55” on Amazon for £1300.

I also found a similar spec 50” plasma screens going for £700ish…

The 5” difference between the plasma and LED screen doesn’t really bother me…

I have seen both LED and Plasma screens in action and both satisfy my needs however the LED screen has the edge for me.

I however, cannot justify paying the extra £600 for an LED screen when a Plasma essentially does the same job.

So can anyone here help me make a decision???? The one thing that would help is the amount of energy a plasma tv would use over an LED. The TV is generally switched on for 10-12 hours a day and I wonder if purchasing an LED TV at an extra £600 now would bring down the energy consumption over say a 5 year period. Even if it saves £300 would justify it for me…. Any scientists here care to do some expert calculations for me???

Duffman… (Looking for expert guidance)

Can you tell us the respective power consumption figures for each TV?

 

[kamalpatel12448]

Depends on size. Smaller screens are fine in LCD but beyond 32"lasma is the technology, but LED is upcoming so should look at that.

 

[The _Don]

Buy a plasma.

 

[gIzzE]

This is the only area where I spend more money on that cars.

First really important bit, are you sitting directly in front of the screen? If the answer is 'No' then forget LCD.

LCD colour shift when not viewed straight on, and they loose contrast and start to look washed out and milky.


I have had all of them, including the top Fuji plasmas, the Panasonic commercial panels and the Pioneer Kuros, and LCDs from Sony and Samsung.

I have just swapped the Samsung 7000 LED for a Samsung C580 LCD as the backlight bleed with the LED annoyed me (brighter on the edges than the middle).

I still use plasma as my main screen and only use LCD for smaller screens, won't go above 40" on an LCD and it still looks no where near as nice as even the cheap plasmas.
You could buy a Panasonic 50" G20 plasma for around £750 and the £4000 Sony LCD wouldn't give a better picture.

Plasma is a phosphor based display, hence why it looks like a big CRT, LCD is pixels that have to be lit from behind, hence why they look a bit washed out in darker scenes when you get the bright scenes to match the same output light level wise.

I wouldn't worry about them being thin or light, once on the wall they all stick out around the same because of cables anyway, and are you going to carry it round with you anywhere??

 

[gIzzE]

The one thing that would help is the amount of energy a plasma tv would use over an LED. The TV is generally switched on for 10-12 hours a day and I wonder if purchasing an LED TV at an extra £600 now would bring down the energy consumption over say a 5 year period. Even if it saves £300 would justify it for me…. Any scientists here care to do some expert calculations for me???

Be carful on consumption figures, plasma only have one, LCD and LED figures are taken in eco mode, so backlight on 1, contrast down, dark scene dimming on, etc. etc.

When both are set up for every day vieweing there is very little between it.

It is like buying an E220cdi because of the claimed 50mpg over the E320cdi's 38mpg and then only getting 39mpg from the E220cdi, no where near the performance and you are not saving anything running cost wise either.

 

[renault12ts]

This is the only area where I spend more money on that cars.

First really important bit, are you sitting directly in front of the screen? If the answer is 'No' then forget LCD.

LCD colour shift when not viewed straight on, and they loose contrast and start to look washed out and milky.


I have had all of them, including the top Fuji plasmas, the Panasonic commercial panels and the Pioneer Kuros, and LCDs from Sony and Samsung.

I have just swapped the Samsung 7000 LED for a Samsung C580 LCD as the backlight bleed with the LED annoyed me (brighter on the edges than the middle).

I still use plasma as my main screen and only use LCD for smaller screens, won't go above 40" on an LCD and it still looks no where near as nice as even the cheap plasmas.
You could buy a Panasonic 50" G20 plasma for around £750 and the £4000 Sony LCD wouldn't give a better picture.

Plasma is a phosphor based display, hence why it looks like a big CRT, LCD is pixels that have to be lit from behind, hence why they look a bit washed out in darker scenes when you get the bright scenes to match the same output light level wise.

I wouldn't worry about them being thin or light, once on the wall they all stick out around the same because of cables anyway, and are you going to carry it round with you anywhere??

I've read your posts before about screens etc and I know where you are coming from in respect of the technology and your preferences. I am like this with audio.

I do however also appreciate that for most mere mortals all that you mentioned above is not at all obvious. I have a 42" Sharp LCD which is 3.5 years old. In my opinion its the best TV we've ever had. I can view it from all angles and am not aware of the degradation you talk about. The OP's main concern seemed to be power consumption since the TV is on a lot.

You must admit that you do have to have a "tuned" eye to see all the stuff above...but most do not. I could not critique one TV from another, I still think LCD is better than CRT (but apparently I'm wrong).

So, if the difference in power consumption between LED and Plasma is big enough, then it is this that will determine the OP's decision.

 

[orientdude]

Like gIzzE, I have also spent a fair amount on screens and audiophile gear. As gIzzE says, it is critically important to know whether you or your family is located directly in front of said TV and if the room is also well lit during the day. If so, then LCD would be preferable, will consume less energy, and its mass will be lighter for wall mounting. Picture quality is good, but does look somewhat artificial, i.e. bolder colours and not as natural.

Otherwise, a plasma (my personal choice) would be more convenient and for your pocket too. Currently, plasmas are considered 'old tech', but they still give the best picture quality and nature life-like picture, if viewing DVDs/BRs.

 

[orientdude]

I've read your posts before about screens etc and I know where you are coming from in respect of the technology and your preferences. I am like this with audio.

I do however also appreciate that for most mere mortals all that you mentioned above is not at all obvious. I have a 42" Sharp LCD which is 3.5 years old. In my opinion its the best TV we've ever had. I can view it from all angles and am not aware of the degradation you talk about. The OP's main concern seemed to be power consumption since the TV is on a lot.

You must admit that you do have to have a "tuned" eye to see all the stuff above...but most do not. I could not critique one TV from another, I still think LCD is better than CRT (but apparently I'm wrong).

So, if the difference in power consumption between LED and Plasma is big enough, then it is this that will determine the OP's decision.

Obviously, if the sole criterion is power consumption, then LCDs have it.

On the audio note, this also requires a tuned ear to hear the different nuances when comparing audio gear.

Again, this is all subjective to one's own preferences.

 

[gIzzE]

You must admit that you do have to have a "tuned" eye to see all the stuff above...but most do not.

No, not at all, I know why something looks different, where as most people do not, but most people will know which they prefer when you plonk them down in front of different displays.

Everyone I have recommended a plasma to have been throughly thrilled with the display, they get it home, I tell them what setting to pop in and then I never hear anything about it again. However, those that go LCD tend to always moan that while it looks good in the day it then looks a bit off at night, but OK as they change picture modes to compensate, however, most just want to put it on and forget about it.

LCDs do have flaws and they are pretty big flaws for many people and for the layout of a typical UK living room.

If you can view your Sharp LCD from any angle and there is no drop off in colour or contrast you have a very early, very low contrast panel. I think you would be absolutely blown away by a basically set up plasma in the same spot. It is easy to get used to what you know, sometimes you have to live with something for 48 hours to really appreciate how much things have moved on.

I agree on flat panels beating CRTs, I think they are better in just about every area too, black levels is the only area where CRT won imho, and even that has no been bettered by most displays.

I really don't think with LCD vs Plasma it is a case of one person preferring one look over the other, I have had too many people round mine who are LCD fans and would never even consider a plasma change their minds when seeing one set up properly. Where as I have never known anyone to go from plasma to LCD and say it is better, some say the downfalls are worth it for the extra features the newer TV has and just get used to it, but many come back to plasma again.

 

[gIzzE]

There was a chart on one of the forums, it showed the LED sets used around $25 a year in eco mode, and around $37 a year when set up, a plasma of the same size was using around $50 a year, so around $1 a month difference.

I just don't think it is worth worrying about.

 

[gIzzE]

Have a look at this thread, I posted up more in that why you should consider one over the other.

http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/ot-off-topic-forums/100497-new-55-led-tv-2.html

 

[crockers]

Bought a Panasonic G20 50" Plasma just before Xmas. In built HD freesat and HD freeserve - 600 hz (what ever that mans) and I am amazed with the picture.

Some salesman said if you want to watch sport then Plasma is the way to go as the motion is better. (not sure if he is right - but it's not the first time I have heard that either).

 

[Piff]

gIzzE talks about getting the TV "settings" correct.
Does this apply to LCD/LED tv's as well as plasma?

I have a 42" Panasonic plasma and haven't touched the settings - it is just as it came out of the box! Picture looks ok to me - better on sky & freesat, next best on freeview, worst on terrestrial but when saying worst, it is still good.

Is there a set of "settings" which should be applied to tv's, whether they be plasma/lcd/led?

 

[gIzzE]

Yeah it applies to both, just a slightly different set of rules for both as certain controls do different things.


Setting up a plasma is pretty easy, you need to adjust a few things and in a certain order, they are...

Set the Video mode.
Most plasmas come with 3 or 4 memories, usually called things like...
DYNAMIC
STANDARD
MOVIE
CINEMA
GAME
ECO

Different brands and different models usually have different names, but there will be something similar.
Some brands will always look the same on each preset if you set colour/contrast/brightness/sharpness/gamma/white balance etc. the same, however, many domestic sets won't, no matter how much you adjust you won't get them to look the same, this is because they add certain things like edge enhancement or exaggerated black levels to certain presets.

I would always put your display in CINEMA or MOVIE mode before calibrating, this is usually as close to correct as you will get out of the box with all the enhancements, that can actually ruin a picture, turned off.

You then need to set the colour temp.
Displays always look brighter if lots of blue is added to the image, however, this is not what studio monitors and directors see when they are mixing down their material, so it is not what you should have your display set to either. They calibrate their displays to D65, this means there is slightly more yellow in the image than there is blue, but it is correct, and it means you will see what they want you to see, if a scene is meant to be warm it will look warm, not cold.

You need to find the colour temp, there is usually COOL, NORMAL and WARM.
Some sets have COOL 1 and 2 and WARM 1 and 2 as well.
Set this to WARM or WARM 1 as a good base point.

So, so far we have the picture mode in CINEMA or MOVIE and colour temp as WARM.

If you have a Gamma setting you want to set it to 2.2.
Gamma is how quickly the levels rise coming from absolute black into grey.
Higher the gamma the darker the image looks, the lower the gamma the more detail you get in the shadows, but can make it look washed out.

Gamma of around 2.0, lots of detail but a little washed out.....

Gamma around 2.5, much punchier but lost detail in here jacket....

Gamma of 2.2, Much better, still lots of contrast in darker areas but all the detail there...

Now, obviously, I am assuming your pc monitor is calibrated properly and you can see the differences in the images above!

We now need to turn everything off.
Such as....
Dynamic Contrast
Enhanced Black
Noise reduction
etc. etc. etc.

Turn all that crap off.

Now we set contrast.

Contrast is the point where absolute white is, you can use a chart to do this and many THX discs come with them, however and easy way to do it is put the Sky banner up and turn the contrast up so the white in the banner looks really white and not yellowy white.
You want it at that bit where it just looks nice and bright white, usually somewhere between 45-70% on a plasma. We use the banner as we know that is white, use a white image on the screen and it might only be 90% white.

This is the sort of chart you need, you want to be able to just see all of the white boxes, if the last two blend together your contrast is too high, you will loose details in thing like white shirts, snow covered mountains etc.

This is an image with contrast set too high...

See all the detail in here face is blown out, around her forehead etc.



You set the black level, brightness, in the same way, so you can see every black box.
Once again though if you do not have a test pattern, and remember you dvd player may give you a slightly different level to your sky or freeview, you can simply put up a film with black borders top and bottom.

With a plasma there is a point where you can see the phosphors are being lit and when they have switched off, so stand right next to the screen with the black borders and turn up the brightness so you can see twittering pixels in them, then turn it back down again s the bars are solid black, it will be very obvious when this snaps in.

That is your contrast and brightness set.

You then need to adjust colour.
Most sets have the colour set far, far to high. This is to make sure in the store they stand out from all the others, but think about it, when you go to the football does the pitch look fluorescent?
I find that most sets need to have the colour somewhere between 25-40% for it to look accurate.

This is a Pioneer plasma with colours at 27%...

It doesn't jump out at you but it looks like a window, it looks realistic.


Next is sharpness, most sets need it set to 0, this is no added edge enhancement at all, which is just noise that will actually take detail out of the picture.
However, SD channels from Sky and Freeview can look very soft, so set this as you like it, I tend to have it off for Bluray, HD, and Gaming and at about 25% for SD stuff.
Also, for Freeview I sometimes use the STANDARD preset, this does add a bit of edge enhancment and knocks the gamma up to 2.5, which can help some poor quality broadcast look a little better, it will loose some detail, but so what, better to trick your eyes into it looking good and you don't know what you are missing if you can't see it.


The one thing you must do is take your sets out of DYNAMIC and turn all the crud settings off, these destroy an image.

If you have been looking with these on it may look a bit dull for a few hours, but after a few days going back will look very odd and artificial.



So...

CINEMA or MOVIE
WARM colour temp
Gamma 2.2 (or mid point)
Contrast - set using banner and get the white looking white)
Brightness - Stand next to screen and set it as high as possible without black bars looking noisy
Colour - just make it look natural, start around 25% and make grass look natural and peoples faces look natural.
Sharpness - as low as possible without it looking blurry.



Takes 5 mins and well worth it.

 

[gIzzE]

On an LCD the main differences are you have a back light adjustment and Contrast doesn't clip the bright areas.

So set contrast to 100.

Set your backlight so the whites look bright white and then do the rest above, but leave contrast out of the adjustments.

 

[DuFFmAn]

my god my decision just got tougher...

Just discovered 60" plasma TV's!!

LG 60PK250 60" Full 1080p HD Plasma TV with 600Hz: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics

I might head to Costco tomorrow to see what they have...

Energy consumption isn't a key factor for me... My concern was whether it is worth spending an additional £600 for something that is essentially the same thing. I'm not planning on hanging the display so weight isn't an issue...