grober
MB Master
Wishful thinking or fact? Ecclestone doubts Schumacher will stay in 2011 | Mercedes | Formula 1 news, live F1 | ESPN F1 or one more story from the rumour factory that's F1
Schumaker to retire at season's end?
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killwilly
Active Member
Fingers crossed it's true.
Toes crossed Eddie Jordan leaves too
I'll second that. :bannana:
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
Just more Ecclestone BS, The deal between Schumacher and Rosberg is running exactly as planned, Ross Brawn brought Schumacher in to develop the car for 2011 all the developments he has done this year have gone on Rosbergs car and hence the points gap, he was never brought in to be a championship contender in 2010. However for next year the gloves will be off and watch the difference then. The Schumacher deal was a 1 + 2 so my bet is he will take the 2 year option and carry on. You only have to listen to his interviews love him or hate him he is honest and when it is his mistake he says so, I'll think he'll be around for a while yet, wonder what odds I can get with William Hill for him winning the championship next year 
Diesel Benz
MB Enthusiast
Just more Ecclestone BS, The deal between Schumacher and Rosberg is running exactly as planned, Ross Brawn brought Schumacher in to develop the car for 2011 all the developments he has done this year have gone on Rosbergs car and hence the points gap, he was never brought in to be a championship contender in 2010. However for next year the gloves will be off and watch the difference then. The Schumacher deal was a 1 + 2 so my bet is he will take the 2 year option and carry on. You only have to listen to his interviews love him or hate him he is honest and when it is his mistake he says so, I'll think he'll be around for a while yet, wonder what odds I can get with William Hill for him winning the championship next year
Ecclestone of course talks whatever brings attention and money to the F1 business and BS is very good for this. But you cannot be serious about the Mercedes car being developed for Nico. On the contrary they made changes to the wheel base to make it more suitable for Michael. As a consequence, one GP was a complete disaster for Nico and just an ordinary disaster for Michael. Then Nico got it going better again.
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
Michael's is the development car, Nico's is the race car, Michaels car has a lot of development parts on it which Nico's doesn't, a lot of which don't work so are discarded, only the ones that work are transferred onto Nico's car. The wheelbase change was made to accomodate a bit of radical thinking which too did not work as you quite rightly point out.
Ed209
Active Member
Do they not get on then?
Diesel Benz
MB Enthusiast
They don't put new development parts to a car unless their factory data shows the parts should improve the car. More often they do than don't.
Often the factory cannot build enough new parts for both drivers to enjoy and then the better driver, or in this case the favourite in terms of marketing, gets the new, improved parts.
If you try to say Michael suffers from using new parts, how do you explain Nico gains from those at a later stage if they did not make Michael's car better when Nico still did not yet have them?
It isn't lottery when new parts are developed and put to the car first time.
My understanding is that the longer wheelbase was maintained except for the Monaco race.
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
Think about the big picture here live testing in F1 is banned as cost cutting measures so all testing is done on simulators now with the best will in the world a simulator whilst good is no substitute for the real thing. Now firstly I'll hold my hand up and say I am no F1 driver and not in their league but I have driven 2x F1 cars and had a shot at a works simulator and it is night and day to a numpty driver like me. even Pilots acknowledge the simulators only tell part of a story on handling and behaviour
So heres the Picture, Brawn put all their effort into the 2009 car to win a championship knowing full well the the 2010 car was going to be sh*te because of lack of money and development time. In Step MB and work with one of the best strategists in the business Mr Brawn, what can we do to get a competitive car for 2011? In 2010 we will run one race car and one development car and employ the best development man in the business In steps Mr Schumacher, use the info from the development car to build a world beating 2011 car, with me so far ? MB knew before the first race even started they did not have a competitive car or a chance of winning the drivers or constructors championship in 2010, the strategy is all about winning in 2011
As for factory testing of development parts? What testing all testing is banned under the new rules no wind tunnel aerodynamic evaluations anymore it all done by modelling and theorists, if the modelling is good then the chance is the parts good if its crap well you get the picture so in some rspects it now is a lit of a lottery and only as good as the software used by the teams.
Take the Virgin Team 15 minutes down the road from me and I know the outfit pretty well as they were Manor Motorsport before Branson put money in. Their whole car was built from a computer design no mock up for wind tunnel testing no 3rd development car straight off computer straight into build straight on to the track thats why it lags behind
If you don't believe me wait until next year and I'll jog your memory to revisit this thread when MB are up there with Red Bull & McLaren
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
Because in terms of car development and feedback to the designers on whats wrong he is still the best there is by far.
flanaia1 - is this your opinion with the same facts as the rest of us, or do you have inside knowledge? Genuine Q.
Much as I know that MS is perhaps the best development driver of modern years (I remember what the Ferrari was like before MS got there), I can't help feeling that he's not a patch on where he was on the racetrack...
Much as I know that MS is perhaps the best development driver of modern years (I remember what the Ferrari was like before MS got there), I can't help feeling that he's not a patch on where he was on the racetrack...
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
It's my opinion with the facts that have already been published or in the public domain, it also comes from conversations with some of the guys at Virgin and an Ex F1 Race Engineer/ Mechanic who is very close to MS still from their Ferrari days. Also one team princple is quoted as saying that is the reason Button left Brawn or should I say not stay with them as he knew the car would not be up to the job and he would not be able to defend his title competitively.
So I think all the information is publicly out there you just have to figure out what the real story is and unless you are working for MB F1 then I guess we will never know, but the above is my take on the scenario and if MS confirms he will be at MB next year then I for one will be putting some money on him winning the title in 2011
That's true and to add, only as good as the material data fed in to the software. Tyre and composite material modelling are in that respect very difficult in indeed.
Tell that to McLaren and their exhaust vent diffuser - tested on Friday at Silverstone and ditched straightaway because it just didn't work in the real world. New version due again this week.
sims are ok but there is no substitute for actual testing and as teams can't test in season it has to be done on the track. Schumacher has always had a good reputation as a driver who understands a car and can tell engineers what to do to make it better. Ferrari were not covering themselves in glory until he signed up. Whether others can drive a car he has set up is a different matter but as a developer he has got to be worth the money.
m.
