Should there be some sort of competency test...

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Just this morning I had someone pull off a kerb without looking, I was too close to brake and had to swerve round so was lucky there was no oncoming traffic.

I am in a largish silver car and my lights were on.
 
However, I'll return to the comparison with aviation where the world around is telling the pilot that they are in situation "A", but the pilot still proceeds as though they are in situation "B" because that's what they expected to be in and they missed the first clue that they weren't. The human brain does strange things when confronted with a situation that doesn't match what it expects given the immediately preceding events.

Maybe some Human Factors training should be included for drivers?
 
Well this is a very emotive subject,but as I approach the time where I get the letter from the DVLA,asking am I still fit to drive,I think there should be some sort of test soon after 70,as I walk around town centres now having been retired 10 years I see people around my age who are physical wrecks,the same people are driving cars,now we all know that young drivers have more accidents that is for sure,but older drivers have accidents where nobody expects them to happen.
My point is if you can still drive well then a small test with a examiner coming to your home and you using your car for say a 20 min drive around local roads should be no hardship,any examiner will in the first 5 mins know if the aged driver is still safe on the road.
People are living longer and so we need to have some test of ability,when you look at the list of illnesses that you can still drive with it makes you wonder how there are not more accidents,that said I sat beside a 93 year old who drove fine,in the right gear aware of what was going on but he has now given up as he said he has no wish to drive anymore.
One interesting fact is that doctors do not have to notify the DVLA about a persons fitness to drive,the only time they do have to is when in their opinion having been talking to the patient is that they have not understood what has been said to them,now that says a lot about how slack our rules are about who can and cannot drive a vehicle.
 
Maybe some Human Factors training should be included for drivers?
50 years ago driving tuition revolved almost totally around physical control of the vehicle and compliance with the "rules of the road". Back then it was almost unthinkable that attitude factors and mental approach to driving would be part of the training, yet for the last couple of decades they have been part of both the training and the assessment of new drivers.

Is it impossible to believe that Human Factors training should be included in driver training? Why not?
 
Is it impossible to believe that Human Factors training should be included in driver training? Why not?

Surely the biggest hurdle is that there is no mandatory driver training of any sort in the UK.
 
The problem is that nearly all drivers could pass some kind of competency test but will just continue to drive as they feel afterwards.

None of us still adhere to driving test standards any more.
 
The problem is that nearly all drivers could pass some kind of competency test but will just continue to drive as they feel afterwards.

None of us still adhere to driving test standards any more.

My old feller wouldn't have stood a chance of passing any kind of competency test His bad habits just got worse. Apart from his Macular degeneration making him almost blind, his road sense was appalling. I refused to sit in the passenger seat and insisted on driving if I had to go anywhere with him.
A simple road test would have seen his licence removed far earlier.
Watching some of the old duffers trying to negotiate our roads makes me even more certain some kind of test should take place, maybe even before 70.
 
My old feller wouldn't have stood a chance of passing any kind of competency test His bad habits just got worse. Apart from his Macular degeneration making him almost blind, his road sense was appalling. I refused to sit in the passenger seat and insisted on driving if I had to go anywhere with him.
A simple road test would have seen his licence removed far earlier.
Watching some of the old duffers trying to negotiate our roads makes me even more certain some kind of test should take place, maybe even before 70.
I'm sure that you are right.
 
If my hunch is correct, then this Google Street View shot is where they would have made their ultimately fatal turn onto the off-slip in the wrong direction.

Note the signage on the left that could be mistaken for indicating that the junction on the right (actually the right-turn junction from the off-slip to the A329) is the entry to the M40 London bound. Once that mistake was made - if indeed it was - disorientation would take over very quickly because the driver would not understand why they were confronted by oncoming traffic.

While I'm a firm believer in periodic re-testing to maintain a valid Drivers Licence, I also agree with Bruce that any such assessment of driver capability would be highly unlikely to prevent events like this.
I think you may be right, I think they have mistaken it as a two way road as they turned in, and if they met no traffic on the slip road until they reached the motorway then they may not have realised until they’re staying (on their) left to miss cars coming off the motorway on to the slip road on their right.

Once they’re staying left, they’re approaching oncoming traffic in lane 1, and so swerve left into the centre lane, do the same thing again, and within 10 seconds of realising they were in danger, they may already have narrowly missed a collision two or three times and be trapped facing oncoming traffic in the fast lane.

Sadly I can see how it could happen.
 
I wonder how many of us drivers now at all ages would pass a test considering the bad habits some of us may have over the years.
Another option for older drivers who may need a car for short journeys for messages etc could be to ban them from certain roads like motorways and main Rds if possible , make them do
there retest in an automatic.
This would give them more thinking time compared to a manual and assist in hill starts etc
 
If my hunch is correct, then this Google Street View shot is where they would have made their ultimately fatal turn onto the off-slip in the wrong direction.

Note the signage on the left that could be mistaken for indicating that the junction on the right (actually the right-turn junction from the off-slip to the A329) is the entry to the M40 London bound. Once that mistake was made - if indeed it was - disorientation would take over very quickly because the driver would not understand why they were confronted by oncoming traffic.

While I'm a firm believer in periodic re-testing to maintain a valid Drivers Licence, I also agree with Bruce that any such assessment of driver capability would be highly unlikely to prevent events like this.

Now that I can see the suspected Junction, does anyone else agree that the Signage DOES give the impression that that "No Entry" is the M40 London/High Wycombe? :eek:

There's a "No Entry" on the Left, there should be a "No Entry" on the Right THEN the M40.
 
Now that I can see the suspected Junction, does anyone else agree that the Signage DOES give the impression that that "No Entry" is the M40 London/High Wycombe? :eek:

There's a "No Entry" on the Left, there should be a "No Entry" on the Right THEN the M40.
Yes, I agree. That could easily be misunderstood.
 
I've driven extensively in continental Europe for the best part of 30 years so am quite experienced at driving on the "wrong" side of the road compared to my home country but occasionally I've been confused by signage and road layouts when intending to join motorways from single carriageways while over there. On those occasions I find that I have to consciously think about which side of the motorway I need to join to get it right, rather than acting instinctively as I would in the UK, and I also adopt the approach that if I'm still uncertain I'll continue past the junction and turn around and come back to it rather than risk carnage by turning into an exit.

Overall, I can understand how what seems obvious to us is easy to get wrong for visitors who are driving on the "wrong" side of the road for them if they're not 100% on the ball.
 
Competency is not age related.

Not in all cases, certainly, but the older drivers get, the more likely it is that their level of competence will decline due to slower reaction times, poorer vision, and other physical factors.

I've driven extensively in continental Europe for the best part of 30 years so am quite experienced at driving on the "wrong" side of the road compared to my home country but occasionally I've been confused by signage and road layouts when intending to join motorways from single carriageways while over there. On those occasions I find that I have to consciously think about which side of the motorway I need to join to get it right, rather than acting instinctively as I would in the UK, and I also adopt the approach that if I'm still uncertain I'll continue past the junction and turn around and come back to it rather than risk carnage by turning into an exit.

Overall, I can understand how what seems obvious to us is easy to get wrong for visitors who are driving on the "wrong" side of the road for them if they're not 100% on the ball.

I can understand how a driver from the Continent, once he or she had ignored or failed to notice all the signs, could go up the off slip and not notice until they encountered traffic. They would be joining from the right, with the hard shoulder on their right, and three empty lanes to their left - just like home, in fact. If this couple were Irish, though, they would have been on the wrong side of the road even if the M40 was in Eire.
 
They would. But having given the matter a bit more thought, I think it could explain why they were in the "fast" lane: they didn't appreciate that they were on a dual carriageway and moved as far to the left as possible because oncoming traffic should be on their right.
 
Trying instinctively to get as far to the left as he could, presumably. I can only imagine the state of confusion, horror and sheer terror that must have been the couple's in the last moments of their lives. I find it quite upsetting even to think about it.
 
Trying instinctively to get as far to the left as he could, presumably. I can only imagine the state of confusion, horror and sheer terror that must have been the couple's in the last moments of their lives. I find it quite upsetting even to think about it.
+1 very sad loss of life
 

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