Summer vs all season vs winter tyre group test video

[BTB 500]

A very interesting (and recent) group test, done under properly controlled conditions at a dedicated indoor facility in Finland. Well worth watching, but if you can't spare 12 minutes the conclusion (spoiler alert) is that for typical UK conditions the best approach is to use a summer tyre then switch to all-seasons (not winter tyres) when it gets colder.

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[moonloops]

the conclusion (spoiler alert) is that for typical UK conditions the best approach is to use a summer tyre then switch to all-seasons (not winter tyres) when it gets colder.

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Cool, that's exactly what I'm doing.

 

[flowrider]

The Michelin CrossClimate tyre came out pretty good against both summer and winter tyres so a good compromise if you don't want the faff of swapping tyres every year.

 

[Deleted member 126251]

A very interesting (and recent) group test, done under properly controlled conditions at a dedicated indoor facility in Finland. Well worth watching, but if you can't spare 12 minutes the conclusion (spoiler alert) is that for typical UK conditions the best approach is to use a summer tyre then switch to all-seasons (not winter tyres) when it gets colder.

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Yep I saw that a few days ago, interesting conclusion. But IIRC switch to all seasons to get better braking in the wet, summers remained better braking in the dry.

 

[BTB 500]

summers remained better braking in the dry.

Yup, they outperformed all the others right down to 0C. Of course you will quite likely be driving faster on a dry road than a wet one, which arguably increases the importance of dry braking (and overall grip).

 

[grober]

Very interesting test thanks for posting. However one thing struck me, and that was while the road, air and water temperatures were strictly controlled within the facility no mention of tyre temperatures were mentioned. The assumption being made presumably that the tyre rapidly assumes the temperature of its environment. Which leads to the interesting scenario of a car that has sat outside overnight say at -5c and then drives off onto a road that has now reached +5c in the morning -- how long does it take the tyre to "aclimatise"-- 100 yards ,a mile, 5 miles ?? and does that make a significant difference to its performance in that time. I'm betting that the tyres on test were not aclimatised to the test environment by a period of exposure prior to the test but mounted/demounted/stored in a warmer environment before entering the facility. Given that 50% of accidents happen within 5 miles of home it might be a relevant question for real life motoring for those not accustomed to cosseting their pride and joy in a garage overnight.

 

[190]

I've done some cold vs hot tyre pressure measurements and a tyre doesn't get up to a stable operating temperature in a mile or even 5 miles unless driven hard. It typically takes more like 10 miles although a mile or two might be enough to get from -5 to +5. There is changing pressure mixed in with this too at approx. 1.5 psi increase between -5 and +5.

 

[markjay]

The Michelin CrossClimate tyre came out pretty good against both summer and winter tyres so a good compromise if you don't want the faff of swapping tyres every year.

My thoughts precisely, i.e. if the summer tyre is only marginally better in summer than the CrossClimates, why bother swapping?

Based on the data in this video, my conclusion is that for the UK weather the answer is simply fitting CroseClimates all year around.

 

[Dryce]

the conclusion (spoiler alert) is that for typical UK conditions the best approach is to use a summer tyre then switch to all-seasons (not winter tyres) when it gets colder.

I was puzzled by this. The video is quite sensible. But the underlying impression from the video up the point where they state this conclusion is that CrossClimates were actually the optimal solution in the UK.

 

[BTB 500]

But the underlying impression from the video up the point where they state this conclusion is that CrossClimates were actually the optimal solution in the UK.

They look like the best compromise if you only use a single type of tyre all year round. But they were out-performed by summer tyres at all temperatures in the dry, and from about 10C in the wet. So for much of the year (depending on where in the UK you are) they're not optimal.

 

[markjay]

They look like the best compromise if you only use a single type of tyre all year round. But they were out-performed by summer tyres at all temperatures in the dry, and from about 10C in the wet. So for much of the year (depending on where in the UK you are) they're not optimal.

But the question is whether the difference is significant enough to justify swapping tyres?

 

[BTB 500]

But the question is whether the difference is significant enough to justify swapping tyres?

Probably not, which is why I said best single-tyre compromise. But if you live in the balmy South then staying on summer tyres all year round (as most do) isn't unreasonable either, so long as you accept that you may have problems getting around if there's actual snow on the roads. For the majority of the year you'll have more grip (wet or dry) than on cross climates.

 

[flowrider]

But the question is whether the difference is significant enough to justify swapping tyres?

Going by the results I don't think the summer or winter tyres outperformed the CrossClimates enough to justify using a summer and winter tyre rather than the CrossClimate tyre. Personally I prefer to stick with one tyre all year round but the CrossClimate isn't available in the correct sizes for my Mercedes.

 

[Dryce]

But the question is whether the difference is significant enough to justify swapping tyres?

Exactly.

The difference between the Cross Climate and the summer tyre in the dry tests was close.

And in the UK the temperature conditions in winter can be quite variable.

Hence my use of "optimal solution in the UK".

 

[rf065]

Going by the results I don't think the summer or winter tyres outperformed the CrossClimates enough to justify using a summer and winter tyre rather than the CrossClimate tyre. Personally I prefer to stick with one tyre all year round but the CrossClimate isn't available in the correct sizes for my Mercedes.

Yet, I've seen other tests in snow where the Crossclimates failed to get up a steep incline and the winter tyres sailed up it, that alone makes the winter tyres worthwhile for me.

 

[Dryce]

Yet, I've seen other tests in snow where the Crossclimates failed to get up a steep incline and the winter tyres sailed up it, that alone makes the winter tyres worthwhile for me.

And yet the justification cited for using winter tyres in the UK is not snow performance but cold weather performance and particularly cold wet weather performance .... particularly as normally we don't get much snow.

 

[grober]

This would perhaps be an indicator of where all weather tyres might be a better all year round tyre. Key factors might be elevation above sea level and latitude. This for a fairly warm January if memory serves correctly

 

[rf065]

particularly as normally we don't get much snow.

You might not, but I do, and it usually takes a few days to melt too. One of the things you learn to live with at higher altitudes.

 

[Chrishazle]

Another consideration is the size availablilty of Michelin Cross Climates. I have them on the front of the c220 as they're available in 225/45 R17, and my rears do not yet need replacing. However, my rears are 245/40 R17 and NA in Crossclimates! When the rears wear out (they're only about 5k miles old) I'll have to either find an available all season in 245/40 R17 or fit 225/45's to the 8J rear rims (which I gather I could do) and loose the additional traction of the wider rear tyres!

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Another consideration is the size availablilty of Michelin Cross Climates. I have them on the front of the c220 as they're available in 225/45 R17, and my rears do not yet need replacing. However, my rears are 245/40 R17 and NA in Crossclimates! When the rears wear out (they're only about 5k miles old) I'll have to either find an available all season in 245/40 R17 or fit 225/45's to the 8J rear rims (which I gather I could do) and loose the additional traction of the wider rear tyres!

I had 225/45 17 winter tyres on an 8.5j rear wheel, and it appeared stretched, but no problems. Only thing I had to be mindful of is there was less protection for the wheel rim against kerbs and potholes.

I would imagine that a 225/45 would fit fine on an 8j wheel, but it may be worth mentioning to your insurer, in case they’re sensitive to tyre sizes. The 225/45 may be listed in your handbook though as a winter option - mine was.