Surveilance Society

[SimonsMerc]

So I got a letter through the post...

Harrow Council believes that a Penalty Charge is payable with respect to the above vehicle for the following alleged contravention: USING A ROUTE RESTRICTED TO CERTAIN VEHICLES, BUSES ONLY.

The alleged contravention was seen by camera operator number PA310 who was observing real time pictures from a road side camera at the time stated. This alleged contravention is supported by videotaped evidence.

Below is an image taken from the CCTV video evidence associated with the alleged contravention.

There is a very clear photo of my car and me, but nowhere near a bus lane (must be from earlier on the film). I don't remember driving in a bus lane - if I did, it would have been for a second or two to pass someone who is turning right. I'm pretty damn careful about obeying traffic signs etc. But of course to find out, I'd need to challenge it to see the CCTV, and if I lose the challenge I'd have to pay the full £180 fine.

Oh and, if I pay within 14 days of the notice, I get a "discount" to £60 - except that the date of the notice is exactly 14 days ago. Of course I paid it - I can barely afford £60 at the moment, let alone £180.

So...we're being constantly monitored by people looking at our driving at random. Great.

-simon

 

[kwakdonut]

Was it on the main road through Harrow just off the A40? I got caught there a couple of years ago, very similar to you. Was turning left at a roundabout and probably drove 5-10 feet at the end of the bus lane which ensured I was in the correct lane for my destination!!

Tried to appeal but was dismissed out of hand..... ridiculous. I phoned them and told them that I would never visit that area again! If they wanted to alienate drivers then they were doing a damn good job!

 

[verytalldave]

I would want to see clear irrefutable photographic proof of my car IN the bus lane before I paid any fine. Otherwise anybody who drives adjacent to a bus lane could be targeted in this way.

Bus lanes are for the most part the devils work and 98% of them should be removed.

 

[Sp!ke]

Are you allowed in a bus lane to overtake someone turning right?

I have a similar tale and received a nice photo in the post along with a penalty.

However, I only drove in the bus lane after hearing Ken Livinston state on the radio that this particular bus lane was causing congestion problems and was supposed to have been scrapped but TFL were still waiting on the contractors to remove the lines and signage.

I tried to appeal but rules are rules and I had to swallow the £100 fine. So much for common sense and fairness.

 

[flango]

This is a good one, I too would want to see evidence I had contravened the restriction, if the photo does not show it then maybe it is worth writing to them saying the photo sent does not show the contravention please send me one or a frame shot from cctv that does show the actual offence.

Will consult someone who knows more than me

 

[flango]

Don't normally like this site but check out some of the links posted on this thread which is specific to Harrow council and bus lanes, would also check the pcn is compliant with the relevant acts particularly in the wording.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=27391

Also check it's legality here

http://www.ticketfighter.co.uk/Buslaneticket.htm

 

[verytalldave]

Are you allowed in a bus lane to overtake someone turning right?.....................

No.

http://www.nelincs.gov.uk/AtoZ/atozDetail?ID=6990#8232

 

[kwakdonut]

Harrow council are particularly nasty when it comes to bus lanes

 

[flango]

Chapter and verse here

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2005/20052757.htm

 

[C240Sport97]

something similar happened to me about 2.5 years ago.

Camden sent me penalty notice with a web link to pics of the 'offense'.

Helpfully, their web site also allows you to challenge the fine on line. I did this, stating I wasn't in the bus lane or it was not bus lane time.

They never took it any further.

 

[verytalldave]

something similar happened to me about 2.5 years ago.

Camden sent me penalty notice with a web link to pics of the 'offense'.

Helpfully, their web site also allows you to challenge the fine on line. I did this, stating I wasn't in the bus lane or it was not bus lane time.

They never took it any further.

What you describe above is nothing less than theft IMO.

 

[124fan]

There's been many changes in our known world over my life time and recently I started questioning a little more deeply 'Why'

Found this guy called John Harris (freeman of England) ... he has some interesting ideas ...

http://www.tpuc.org/node/540

Cheers

 

[crockers]

Keep BUS lanes free of terrorists.........

I think you are all missing the point ............ it is imperative that the bus lanes are kept free so that we can fight terrorism.....and therefore all transgressors of bus lanes will be reported to the CIA and will experience the American art form of Rendition........


Have a nice day y'all..............

 

[215m3]

One of the largest revenues the government has is the car and we get attacked from all angles and bus lanes are such a farce.

It is amazing how many folk don't read the bus lane sign as many are on time restrictions and don't use them when the law allows them too.

I would always contest something until i see the evidence is 100%.

 

[219]

I have felt , ever since bus lanes were introduced , that since buses are given an exclusive lane all to themselves , they should be required to STAY IN THAT LANE and it should be just as illegal for them to come out into everyone else's lane . Nevertheless , when buses effectively reduce a two lane road down to a single lane , thus causing congestion , one frequently sees buses pulling out into the other lane to pass each other , then being unable to pull fully back into the bus lane because of other buses and blocking the entire road .

Then there are buses who pull across junctions and cannot complete the crossing because of other traffic and end up blocking crossroads etc .

You can probably tell I'm not a bus enthusiast ( even though my dear departed father was a bus driver some 50 or so years ago ) .

 

[C240Sport97]

bus lanes are the worst traffic management device ever invented.

close one lane off at peak times to improve traffic flow??

what about the environmental damage caused by long queues of cars prevented from using the mostly empty bus lane?

 

[Sp!ke]

Around my way we have these Smart cars patrolling with periscope style telescopic cameras on the roof.

I witnessed one the other day pull over onto a double yellow line (blocking rush hour traffic) to record someone who had briefly pulled over with two wheels on the kerb (so as to not block the flow of traffic).

I could see the driver and passenger of the Smart car get all excited as they cowardly videod their victim whilst blocking the flow of traffic themselves.

 

[kwakdonut]

Around my way we have these Smart cars patrolling with periscope style telescopic cameras on the roof.

I witnessed one the other day pull over onto a double yellow line (blocking rush hour traffic) to record someone who had briefly pulled over with two wheels on the kerb (so as to not block the flow of traffic).

I could see the driver and passenger of the Smart car get all excited as they cowardly videod their victim whilst blocking the flow of traffic themselves.

One word for people like that.

Give you a clue

Rhymes with 'bankers'

 

[st4]

I have felt , ever since bus lanes were introduced , that since buses are given an exclusive lane all to themselves , they should be required to STAY IN THAT LANE and it should be just as illegal for them to come out into everyone else's lane . Nevertheless , when buses effectively reduce a two lane road down to a single lane , thus causing congestion , one frequently sees buses pulling out into the other lane to pass each other , then being unable to pull fully back into the bus lane because of other buses and blocking the entire road .

Then there are buses who pull across junctions and cannot complete the crossing because of other traffic and end up blocking crossroads etc .

You can probably tell I'm not a bus enthusiast ( even though my dear departed father was a bus driver some 50 or so years ago ) .

Everytime I drive through Glasgow city center, or any other city center it is always a bus turning, pulling out etc that is causing a hazard, not a car.

People rant about 4x4's being bad in towns, but last time I looked roads were horizontal, not verticle so the height of the car is an irrelevence. Then the 4x4 hater says they're bad in padestrian impacts as opposed to cars, true, but so are buses and buses cause congestion.

Ban the bus is what I say :bannana: and give the tax paying motorist back their lanes :bannana:

 

[Sp!ke]

Has anyone else noticed how much less congestion there is in London when there is a bus strike?

As a motorcyclist, I have the unusual privilege of being able to work my way to the front of most holdups. More often than not, it is caused by buses. Our road infrastructure is simply not designed for them and when a bus stops to let one person on, 200 cars behind it also have to stop and wait in line and burn extra carbon whatsits. Clearly not as green a strategy as the government would have us believe.