The EV fact thread

[MikeInWimbledon]

I agree that the transition from one form of propulsion to another will not make a huge difference to the planet - as I said, we need to built less private cars, and drive them less.

And, while analysts may show that the overall carbon footprint of an EV is lower than that of an ICE car, it is still a significant footprint.

Personally, I am in favour of EVs, because they make sense - clean air in city centres, and less sound pollution. In addition, they are mechanically less complicated than ICE cars and cheaper to service.

But as for the environment... no, we won't save it by moving to EVs. My view.

As I've mentioned before, we're about to add three billion additional cars to the planet, taking us from 1.5 billion to 4.5 billion as Asia, Africa and South America "catch up" with the West

(The world had "just" 500 million cars in 1985, doubling to 1 billion by 2010, and adding another 500 million in the last 13 years or so.)

This is why the Chinese deliberately went EV, and why the billions in India and Africa will be buying EV's.

Cars won't save the planet. CO2 reduction is part of a much bigger picture.

And who cares about Norfolk, Florida and the Gulf Coast anyway? Eighty years ago there was barely anyone living there. Times change.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

It's interesting to see the cost in Switzerland - I only charged twice on the motorways over there and paid much less - but this may have been a coincidence. What surprises me here is that Switzerland has hydro... you'd have thought that electricity will be cheap.

The low cost of electricity in Norway goes some way to explain why every other car on the road is a Tesla....

Is anything cheap in Switzerland? I only ever visit Geneva and everything is an arm and a leg for a tourist: Hotels, food, bars... Swiss people, land, processes are all... expensive.

We've discussed Norway before. Oil rich Norway doesn't charge import taxes or VAT on EV's and gives at least a 50% discounts on EV usage (charging, road tax, tolls, ferries parking fees) as well as authorised use of "bus lanes", with onerous taxes on petrol car purchase and usage.

 

[ChipChop]

As I've mentioned before, we're about to add three billion additional cars to the planet, taking us from 1.5 billion to 4.5 billion as Asia, Africa and South America "catch up" with the West

(The world had "just" 500 million cars in 1985, doubling to 1 billion by 2010, and adding another 500 million in the last 13 years or so.)

This is why the Chinese deliberately went EV, and why the billions in India and Africa will be buying EV's.

Cars won't save the planet. CO2 reduction is part of a much bigger picture.

And who cares about Norfolk, Florida and the Gulf Coast anyway? Eighty years ago there was barely anyone living there. Times change.

If China was bothered about the environment and the theoretical climate emergency they would revert to being the land of the bicycle, as they were in the 80 and 90's. Currently domination of the global automotive sector is their sole concern.

And CO2 is not a pollutant. Third world countries should welcome a CO2 rich environment where crops flourish.

 

[Bellow]

Oh, really? Then why did you make this dumb assed comment:

"There is no benefit that an EV brings over its predecessor - bar the dubious improvement of air quality in cities - so your comparison is somewhat misplaced."

Had you forgotten that Climate Change is THE reason for the rapid enforced EV transition that the Labour Government AND the EU signed us into ?

Can you not tell the difference between a city and a planet?

 

[markjay]

...Third world countries should welcome a CO2 rich environment where crops flourish.

Sure, if only they found a way to stop it from rising to the top of the atmosphere........

 

[ChipChop]

Sure, if only they found a way to stop it from rising to the top of the atmosphere........

Photosynthesis takes place on the ground where the plants are. CO2 is a relatively poor greenhouse gas in the grand scheme of things.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

If China was bothered about the environment and the theoretical climate emergency they would revert to being the land of the bicycle, as they were in the 80 and 90's. Currently domination of the global automotive sector is their sole concern.

And CO2 is not a pollutant. Third world countries should welcome a CO2 rich environment where crops flourish.

Seriously? You think a country is advanced and rich if its people ride bicycles? Do you work for Sadiq Khan?

China doesn't care about selling its vehicles to the 1% of the world living in the UK, it's got a market of 1,200,000 people to develop.

The West's car companies are obsessed with developing EV's to sell to the half of the world that lives in Asia. Without plausible EV products they will be wiped out.

Have a chat with the Scientists and Lord Prescott if you want to find out why Science believes that CO2 reduction is at the heart of attempting to manage Climate Change. The Kyoto protocol was signed 27 years ago.

Why do you think that I said that CO2 is a "pollutant?" I didn't

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Can you not tell the difference between a city and a planet?

Yes, I can tell the difference between a city and a planet.

Have you spoken to a schoolchild to understand what climate change is and why the scientists have told us to change our ways?

 

[poormansporsche]

because at current you cannot distinguish between electricity for an EV and electricity for domestic use.

Don't most new home wall chargers have a app that measures usage and can be linked to certain energy companies ?

Apparently "Special overnight tariffs" give with one hand and take with the other and you need to do a certain mileage to make it cost effective as they up your daytime rate to compensate.

 

[markjay]

Don't most new home wall chargers have a app that measures usage and can be linked to certain energy companies ?

I do not know. But certainly, those neighbours of mine running extension cords across the pavement will be using a standard wall sockets.

 

[markjay]

Photosynthesis takes place on the ground where the plants are. CO2 is a relatively poor greenhouse gas in the grand scheme of things.
View attachment 161929

So the CO2 generated by cars in Glasgow lands on the vegetable patch of a farmer in Indonesia? Interesting.

 

[SmartAmg]

Apparently "Special overnight tariffs" give with one hand and take with the other and you need to do a certain mileage to make it cost effective as they up your daytime rate to compensate.

I've heard that too, you have to be careful, do your sums, before
you just dive in, and get a wallbox. Don't forget there's the actual price of a fitted Box, to take into consideration aswell, which is about a grand.

 

[Retaxus]

I highly doubt that the low tax on electricity when charging an EV at home is by design.... more likely it's a fluke that the government doesn't know (yet...) how to overcome, because at current you cannot distinguish between electricity for an EV and electricity for domestic use. My guess is that there will be some legislation in future that will force the use of special chargers at home that will allow the government to tax the s**t out of electricity for EVs.

This is obvious from the fact that VAT on domestic electricity is only 5%, but when I charge my EV on public chargers I pay the full 20% VAT - the government makes no concessions where they can distinguish EV use from domestic use.

The point about electricity being expensive in the UK is interesting - this was certainly my experience when travelling across France and Switzerland last spring. At current, I pay between 45p and 53p for electricity from the slow 5 kW public charger outside my house. On the French autoroute services, I paid 49 cent (~40p) for electricity from a superfast Ionity 350 kW charger..... go figure.

I am in East Yorkshire, the public chargers here are all 79p.

 

[poormansporsche]

I've heard that too, you have to be careful, do your sums, before
you just dive in, and get a wallbox. Don't forget there's the actual price of a fitted Box, to take into consideration aswell, which is about a grand.

Fortunately I get free charging at work so I own the fastest Nissan Leaf in the country, every set of lights is a Grand Prix. The poor Audi drivers pi££ed on by a Leaf

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Funny you should mention iPhone:

We had the "Iphone fact" thread ? When the old boys said "Why would you need one, my landline does all I need?"

In 2005 I bought a Nokia 7710 like this one.

It failed miserably not least because almost everyone who saw it went to great lengths to explain to me why it was completely unnecessary or even ridiculous despite me not commenting upon their mobile choice. Their comments would invariably include many of the list below:

1. Physical size being larger (than mobile phones)
2. Cost being too expensive (than mobile phones)
3. Battery life being shorter (than mobile phones)
4. Lack of keypad making calls and texts
5. The screen is too large for sending messages
6. The screen is too small for other tasks
7. Paying in lieu of cash on your phone is unnecessary
8. Watching videos on your phone is unnecessary
9. Listening to music on your phone is unnecessary
10. Internet browsing on your phone is unnecessary
11. Online purchasing on your phone is unnecessary
12. Email on your phone is unnecessary
13. Office/productivity on your phone is unnecessary
14. Drawing on your phone is unnecessary
15. Installing apps on your phone is unnecessary

They were right and it never did catch on, parts of the demise of the once mighty Nokia. Every single one of their comments was 100% true, every last one.

For them. At that time. When all they knew was calling and for some texting. They compared it to their mobile phone and their PC and concluded it wasn’t as good as either, and unnecessary.

Even when iPhone populised smartphones, many said they didn’t get it until they tried it, and very soon after they got it. Same with Amazon, eBay, Facebook, Netflix and so on. Many said they didn’t get it, until they tried it, and very soon after they got it. EVs are the same.

Sometimes the populous don’t know best, especially at first. Try ut, you might like it.

 

[markjay]

Fortunately I get free charging at work so I own the fastest Nissan Leaf in the country, every set of lights is a Grand Prix. The poor Audi drivers pi££ed on by a Leaf

Your employer will be reclaiming the full VAT on your electricity....

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Funny you should mention iPhone:

In 2005 I bought a Nokia 7710 like this one.
View attachment 161930
It failed miserably not least because almost everyone who saw it went to great lengths to explain to me why it was completely unnecessary or even ridiculous despite me not commenting upon their mobile choice. Their comments would invariably include many of the list below:

1. Physical size being larger (than mobile phones)
2. Cost being too expensive (than mobile phones)
3. Battery life being shorter (than mobile phones)
4. Lack of keypad making calls and texts
5. The screen is too large for sending messages
6. The screen is too small for other tasks
7. Paying in lieu of cash on your phone is unnecessary
8. Watching videos on your phone is unnecessary
9. Listening to music on your phone is unnecessary
10. Internet browsing on your phone is unnecessary
11. Online purchasing on your phone is unnecessary
12. Email on your phone is unnecessary
13. Office/productivity on your phone is unnecessary
14. Drawing on your phone is unnecessary
15. Installing apps on your phone is unnecessary

They were right and it never did catch on, parts of the demise of the once mighty Nokia. Every single one of their comments was 100% true, every last one.

For them. At that time. When all they knew was calling and for some texting. They compared it to their mobile phone and their PC and concluded it wasn’t as good as either, and unnecessary.

Even when iPhone populised smartphones, many said they didn’t get it until they tried it, and very soon after they got it. Same with Amazon, eBay, Facebook, Netflix and so on. Many said they didn’t get it, until they tried it, and very soon after they got it. EVs are the same.

Sometimes the populous don’t know best, especially at first. Try ut, you might like it.

Dang ! Another great Finnish company finished, with smartphone manufacturing moved to China.

With strategy, design, marketing and distribution still run from the West.

Did we learn nothing from what happened to technical drawing, telex, NCR machines, and typewriters?

God, I miss those NCR and typing pool girls ! Such fun at the Factory Sports and Socials....

 

[markjay]

......manufacturing moved to China.

With strategy, design, marketing and distribution still run from the West...

Globalisation, when it works, means Optimisation.

 

[SmartAmg]

 

[markjay]

View attachment 161937

Some cars are meant to fly!

C4504 Ford Anglia 105E - Harry Potter Edition

C4504, Ford Anglia 105E - Harry Potter Edition, Scalextric, Cars, 1:32 Scale

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