The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[Dryce]

I see the Scottish Tory vote of no confidence was defeated, just like the last one a couple of weeks ago. What a pathetic bunch of hypocrits.

Who - the ones who voted that they were confident in the FM or the ones who voted that they were not confident.

Or did you mean they are all a pathetic bunch.

But hang on a minute are there not a few SNP MSPs who are in Mr Salmond's faction who presumably at odds with the FM's 'genuine' issues with recollection? Surely they don't believe the FM - so are these the pathetic bunch you are referring to?

See there you have the demonstration of the strength of the cause being more important than morality.

 

[flowrider]

Why is it that when you ask for some SNP successes no one has any!

 

[flowrider]

I see the Scottish Tory vote of no confidence was defeated, just like the last one a couple of weeks ago. What a pathetic bunch of hypocrits.

They're not hypocrits for trying to expose whats going on in Scottish politics, if they're guilty of anything its naivety that, other than them, anyone in the Scottish parliament actually cares.

 

[rf065]

They're not hypocrits for trying to expose whats going on in Scottish politics, if they're guilty of anything its naivety that, other than them, anyone in the Scottish parliament actually cares.

Yet they stay silent when Hancock, Pritel etc are actually found guilty. Not a word from them, hypocrits, double standards and irrelevant are the only words to describe the Scottish Tories.

 

[GeeJayW]

Yet they stay silent when Hancock, Pritel etc are actually found guilty. Not a word from them, hypocrits, double standards and irrelevant are the only words to describe the Scottish Tories.

Instead of banging on about how rubbish the Tories are, perhaps just for a change, you could enlighten us on how brilliant the SNP are and how they have done so much for the people of Scotland? Might help us to better understand your viewpoint.

 

[rf065]

Instead of banging on about how rubbish the Tories are, perhaps just for a change, you could enlighten us on how brilliant the SNP are and how they have done so much for the people of Scotland? Might help us to better understand your viewpoint.

Start by telling me what their doing wrong? When you guys bang on about how bad they are, l can only think your talking about a similar country in a parallel universe, cause I don't recognize the scenario you all describe.

 

[AMGeed]

Instead of banging on about how rubbish the Tories are, perhaps just for a change, you could enlighten us on how brilliant the SNP are and how they have done so much for the people of Scotland? Might help us to better understand your viewpoint.

You'll be waiting for a long time.

 

[Dryce]

Start by telling me what their doing wrong? When you guys bang on about how bad they are, l can only think your talking about a similar country in a parallel universe, cause I don't recognize the scenario you all describe.

I seem to remember I gave you a factual list that you wrote off as 'opinion'. I could have made it longer.

I think the idea is that you should suggest some actual tangible positives ..... can you offer any?

(And there are some ... but I won''t do your homework for you - and note the 'actual tangible' I kindly stuck in -- no wishy washy ephemeral nonsensical stuff).

 

[AMGeed]

With all this talk of indyref2, is it not still the case that the Government in Westminster will not allow another referendum to take place whatever Sturgeon has planned for Scotland?

Scottish independence | Institute for Government

How could a second referendum on Scottish independence happen?

www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk

 

[GeeJayW]

Start by telling me what their doing wrong? When you guys bang on about how bad they are, l can only think your talking about a similar country in a parallel universe, cause I don't recognize the scenario you all describe.

You’re the SNP evangelist, educate me/us... Just in case you’re having a bit of trouble, here’s some eyewear that might help.

 

[LTD]

Instead of banging on about how rubbish the Tories are, perhaps just for a change, you could enlighten us on how brilliant the SNP are and how they have done so much for the people of Scotland? Might help us to better understand your viewpoint.

The second word in the two word answer is probably “all”

 

[Dryce]

With all this talk of indyref2, is it not still the case that the Government in Westminster will not allow another referendum to take place whatever Sturgeon has planned for Scotland?

Remember - the aim isn't quite as straightforward as it might seem

So we have a number of motivations for making such noises:

- Find and stoke the outrage - so make it a problem for Westminster to deny freedom and self-determination
- Keep the faithful happy - even if you don't want it now you have to beseen to advancing the great cause
- Make it seem inevitable - part of the neverendum
- Emphasise that Scotland is different and has its own identity - advance the cause - emphasise divisions
- Look busy while Scotland falls behind the UK as a whole

Andalong the way

- Look to gain concessions on more devolved powers
- Confuse the Labour Party who don't seem to know quite where they stand

But consider that the obvious motivation

- Having a referendum

Isn't necessarily the actual objective right now.

 

[st13phil]

Any release of the lockdown *owes a duty of care* to those who are unprotected even if the risk to them is small.

The “duty of care” is owed to the entire population.

There is a flawed argument that lockdowns and restrictions must be maintained to reduce or eliminate COVID-19 infections. The flaw is that there is an underlying presumption that the cost (in terms of physical and mental health, and economic) of doing so is small. It is not.

 

[Dryce]

The “duty of care” is owed to the entire population.

But in this case there is an added moral dimension when some of the population have benefitted from additional protection and some have not.

There is a flawed argument that lockdowns and restrictions must be maintained to reduce or eliminate COVID-19 infections. The flaw is that there is an underlying presumption that the cost (in terms of physical and mental health, and economic) of doing so is small. It is not.

The issue I have is that having taken the economic pain then we must not throw it away.

So the argument is that we have effectively invested so much that we must not waste it prematurely.

This is one reason I am so adamant that our borders must be controlled and the media focus on foreign travel and holidays is so irresponsible.

 

[st13phil]

So the argument is that we have effectively invested so much that we must not waste it prematurely.

The same sunk cost argument that lead the protagonists to continue WWI long after it was clear in 1915 that it was a foolish path?

 

[GeeJayW]

The same sunk cost argument that lead the protagonists to continue WWI long after it was clear in 1915 that it was a foolish path?

Was there an opportunity to end WWI in 1915 without leaving France, Belgium and so on occupied by the German forces?

 

[Dryce]

Was there an opportunity to end WWI in 1915 without leaving France, Belgium and so on occupied by the German forces?

I was thinking the same thing.

Also the dominant story of WW1 from a modern UK perspective tends to be the land war and U-boats. The blockade of Germany and its impact tend to be forgotten.

 

[st13phil]

Was there an opportunity to end WWI in 1915

No, because the protagonistS (plural) all thought they had to keep going because they'd already sunk so much into it...

 

[flowrider]

Start by telling me what their doing wrong? When you guys bang on about how bad they are, l can only think your talking about a similar country in a parallel universe, cause I don't recognize the scenario you all describe.

Have you not read all the informative posts about the SNPs failings. There have been quite a few, now its your turn.

 

[GeeJayW]

No, because the protagonistS (plural) all thought they had to keep going because they'd already sunk so much into it...

Little did they know....