The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[m80]

So we are leaving, not because it is good for us, but because of some limited and limiting view of what democracy is.

We had a democratic vote.
Like it or not, and there be the problem, there was a result.
The result is not being acted on and as much as is falsely promised it looks less likely as time progresses that the result of the referendum will be acted on.

The question of what is good for us has been an endless debate for over 3 years, there is no end to the debate until a decisive action is taken, preferably by an elected leader and not a mob leader such as T Robinson.

What has happened over the last 2 - 3 years most definitley is worse than had we left WTO, I realise that is my opinion and can't be substantiated, but it is and I stand by it.
The result of the referendum does not allow for us to remain, as much as there are efforts to cause this in one way or another, the May WA being one of them.
To carry on this dabacle will continue to divide not only Parliament, not that I really care about that bunch of largely self serving pretenders, but also the likes of you and I. We are some of the future of this country of ours and the closer aligned we are to creating the future the better for all.

A decisive outcome of Stay or Go is best for us overall, we then know our starting postion as best we can.
To stay ignores the referendum but is better than this cr*p.
To go at least respects what the majority voted for so in my eyes, and I am biased, is favourable.
Anything else will just prolong this destructive period. It will reduce what and who we are globally even more than at present.

We are short of a leader with the strength of character to say enough "this is what will now happen".

I'm staying away from the blaming that is so easy but isn't of benefit

 

[Yugguy]

So we are leaving, not because it is good for us, but because of some limited and limiting view of what democracy is.

But of course you'd be happy to accept the miniscule remain majority that the figures suggest and thanks very much?

 

[Bellow]

But of course you'd be happy to accept the miniscule remain majority that the figures suggest and thanks very much?

Yes, but I also said (though you chose to ignore it) that in a second referendum I'd accept a narrow margin for leave.
More than fair given that leave is overthrowing the status quo for the unknown, while leave preserves what we have, know, and is more or less working well enough for us.

 

[markjay]

It's not that simple.

We voted to leave.

May says her WA is 'leave'. Others say that nothing short of WTO-rules is in fact 'leave'. And even more other people have their own idea of what they will accept as 'leave'.

And, does leaving the EU and becoming an external member of the Customs Union qualify as 'leave'? Depends who you ask...

And then there are those who jump on the bandwagon trying to use the confusion as an excuse to stop or reverse the process.

May's shouting 'leave means leave' does not help clarify the issue one bit.

 

[Yugguy]

I'd argue that the current state of the UK is Leaving so we should demand a sizeable majority to change this

 

[m80]

Yes, but I also said (though you chose to ignore it) that in a second referendum I'd accept a narrow margin for leave.
More than fair given that leave is overthrowing the status quo for the unknown, while leave preserves what we have, know, and is more or less working well enough for us.

Any narrow margin will just keep this argument going. The minority will always find reason to say that wasn't enough to be decisive.

As for knowing what the futre is within the eu I challenge that.
I has evolved from what we joined,
it will evolve from what it is now, and with us whthin that evolution will be faster.

The working for us bit has been challenged on here already, so the eternal debate continues.
But the main reason people feel we will suffer is the fear of retaliatory responses for us leaving. A cartel that controls markets at the disadvantage of fair trading is usually considered wrong.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

It can be useful to know a good service manager, they do have some autonomy in their role and can be influential when dealing with warranty claims. My old contact, before he moved on, would also take on private work and charge half whatever MB would have done.

I miss him.

 

[Riva811]

Anyway Corbyn suggested a may deal, no deal or remain vote. The issue with that is the complexity of the question as it assumes everyone had read and understood May's deal. Then you need to pass it from parliament, then you need to make sure nobody takes you to high court for been antidemocratic. You need full support of the political and legal system to pull something like this off.
Remainers need to get over the denial stage, we already asked the remain or leave question, what is left now is the technicalities and they can't be put in a referendum.
I haven't gone through May's deal but at the same time nobody wants it without collaborating as to what aspects need rework. I appreciate the Irish border issue and May should of discuss it further.

Sent from my H8116 using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Anyway Corbyn suggested a may deal, no deal or remain vote. The issue with that is the complexity of the question as it assumes everyone had read and understood May's deal. Then you need to pass it from parliament, then you need to make sure nobody takes you to high court for been antidemocratic. You need full support of the political and legal system to pull something like this off.
Remainers need to get over the denial stage, we already asked the remain or leave question, what is left now is the technicalities and they can't be put in a referendum.
I haven't gone through May's deal but at the same time nobody wants it without collaborating as to what aspects need rework. I appreciate the Irish border issue and May should of discuss it further.

Sent from my H8116 using Tapatalk

I wonder how many actually have done?

 

[Scott_F]

It can be useful to know a good service manager, they do have some autonomy in their role and can be influential when dealing with warranty claims. My old contact, before he moved on, would also take on private work and charge half whatever MB would have done.

I miss him.

Did he vote Leave or Remain ?

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Did he vote Leave or Remain ?

Good point, no idea how that little pearl of wisdom ended up on this thread.

 

[del320]

Golden.

 

[AltonAnt]

We have apparently already spent £4billion on Brexit preparations

Think about what that could have been spent on.

 

[markjay]

We have apparently already spent £4billion on Brexit preparations

Think about what that could have been spent on.

More Brexit buses?

 

[Yugguy]

The EU?

 

[Dryce]

We have apparently already spent £4billion on Brexit preparations

Think about what that could have been spent on.

You might consider where this money was spent - and the chances are it wasn't anywhere much north of London.

 

[BMF]

This from FB:

 

[Riva811]

This from FB:
View attachment 85407

All the things that "tinfoil hats" have been saying all these years. I am shocked how everyone thought the UK and EU will remain as they are right now. Cameron tried to negotiate this and that's why the referendum was introduced - let the people decide.

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[AltonAnt]

It is on FB

It takes about 10 secs to do some basic fact checking - There’s a lot wrong with this viral list about the Lisbon Treaty

Do people really not think that if this was any where close to true it would not have been used by Farage/BJ/JR-M etc as propaganda?

 

[Dryce]

This from FB:

Hmmmmmmmmm.

Methinks Snopes might have something to say about this.

Have you actually checked the veracity of what it states ...... I suspect not.