The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[DSM10000]

Who knows...but I wish they'd put a 2/3 majority into the EU referendum.

Why?

So you would not have to lose?

Would you advocate thew same terms for Scottish and Welsh Independence? If not why not or is it you only support a rule that will be of benefit to your own views?

It looks likely we will have an election soon, it is possible that the UK will elect a Government whose policies I strongly disagree with, will i whinge, bitch wallow in self pity and try to find a way to reverse it or just accept it was a majority decision of the people (I suppose you could call it a people's vote? ) and work with it??

 

[Baldbloke]

Who knows...but I wish they'd put a 2/3 majority into the EU referendum.

Well........if there’s a further referendum, and the dreaded remain question is engineered back into the poll, would it require a 2/3rds majority before that was acceptable?


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[Baldbloke]

In the interest of a balanced view, this applies to both the Reamainers' doom-and-gloom predictions and the Leavers' rose-tinted-glasses promises of the untold riches that awaits us the morning after.

The truth is that we are in uncharted waters, sailing towards an unknown future. The only factual argument against leaving is that it's a leap of faith and we are taking a huge risk, and only factual argument against remaining is 'who dates wins' and 'if you don't try, you don't succeed'.

Both sides have a valid point, but in the absence of any concrete data it is really down to how risk averse or adventurous you are.

There’s also the principle of being fully self governed rather than having to consider our unelected and remote masters in the EU.


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[Baldbloke]

We now have the rediculous point scoring postering by the LD's and SNP over the date of a GE, 9th or 12th Dec. What is wrong with these people!

Labour were keen on the earlier date as it allowed the possibility of students at university utilising their vote twice. Home and away.

The later date precluded it


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[markjay]

There’s also the principle of being fully self governed rather than having to consider our unelected and remote masters in the EU.


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True, true, but this does not fall into the financial facts category.... so not relevant in the context of discussing how Brexit will affect the NHS budget etc.

 

[190]

Labour were keen on the earlier date as it allowed the possibility of students at university utilising their vote twice. Home and away.

I sincerely hope the Electoral Commission and the Police are going to take fraud a bit more seriously this time around. We need some prosecutions to act as a deterrent to the jokers that think electoral fraud is just fun and games. Any students that do it are just demonstrating they are too immature to be voting in the first place. And they want to give the vote to 16 year olds !

 

[flowrider]

So Corbyn is now thinking of proposing an amendment giving EU nationals and 16 year olds the vote. Doesn't he realise what a plonker he looks. Is he being advised to say these things so that he looks bad, if so it's working

 

[Baldbloke]

Thankfully it looks like there will be no time to give 16 year olds the vote. Stupid, stupid idea that makes no sense other than it's politically motivated.

Remain have obviouslydone their homework (like the SNP for Independence) and know that the bulk of youngsters with little life experience are more likely to vote for them


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[Harrythedog]

So Corbyn is now thinking of proposing an amendment giving EU nationals and 16 year olds the vote. Doesn't he realise what a plonker he looks. Is he being advised to say these things so that he looks bad, if so it's working

Whether that is a plausible idea or not it’s a massive change to our constitution and shouldn’t be pushed through via a few minutes of discussion and a quick vote

 

[Scott_F]

It's OK to point at people and say that they are doing certain things. But it is much more credible if you also have a plausible explanation as to whey these people are doing whatever it is that you say they are doing.

So you are saying that Boris Johnson is brewing a deal where the US pharmaceutics will be able to sell drugs to the NHS for much more than the NHS is paying for them now, which in effect will drain the NHS out of much-needed cash.

I don't disagree, you may be right, I don't know. But I am asking 'why?'. I.e. why would Boris Johnson willingly - and for no obvious reason - hand NHS cash to private US companies?

Is the allegation here that he is corrupt - did he get a bribe, or did he supposedly buy shares in US pharmaceuticals? Or is he an utter fool and the Americans managed to convince him to just hand-over our hard-earned tax money?

Logically, there are two other possibilities of course. One is that he is getting something worthwhile in return, the other is that this entire story is based on speculation and it isn't true.

But you are not alleging the two former possibilities, and you will not entertain the two latter ones.

So, in the absence of a plausible WHY, there is no motive and no conviction... I rest my case.

Your posts on this seem rather bizarre.

There are no allegations, no suggestions of corruption, no talk of bribes, no mention of convictions and you don't need to rest your case.

Although you haven't watched the program, it presented a compelling case that the US pharmaceutical industry is doing what it has done elsewhere by flexing its immense financial muscle to ensure that Washington puts their interests to the fore in any trade deal. It also provided clear primary evidence that this process has already started.

No deal had yet been reached but if that is one of the tenets of any agreement it is both hugely damaging and contradicts the funding promises of Vote Leave. Whatever terms are settled upon, no one gets a good deal from Trump and the US negotiators, funded by hundreds of millions of lobbyist dollars, will run rings around ours.

 

[m80]

And they want to give the vote to 16 year olds !

A common argument for a 2nd ref is that so many kiddies that would be affected by the result weren't able to vote.
Give the vote to 12 year olds and that reduces that some.
Then allow prisoners to vote as they'll get out one day.
Then all the eu should be eligible.
And why not Russians and Chinese as we'll be trading with them an larger scale after Brexit, and this pretend democracy would be a novelty for 'em.

But put a stop to all politicians voting, as they have demonstrated that the majority don't understand democracy and aren't worthy, and they are plain silly.

 

[st13phil]

So Corbyn is now thinking of proposing an amendment giving EU nationals and 16 year olds the vote.

Extending the franchise in the ways suggested would represent a massive change and the Deputy Speaker has wisely not accepted the amendments for debate, so they’re effectively dead - for now, at least.

Hopefully, the Lords won’t be stupid enough to reintroduce them when they debate the bill tomorrow.



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[geraldrobins]

Why?



It looks likely we will have an election soon, it is possible that the UK will elect a Government whose policies I strongly disagree with, will i whinge, bitch wallow in self pity and try to find a way to reverse it or just accept it was a majority decision of the people (I suppose you could call it a people's vote? ) and work with it??

You be perfectly entitled to. Opposition parties do it all the time whoever is in power.

 

[m80]

So Heidi Allen is giving up her Conservative sorry Change UK sorry LibDem seat, although it may be a jump before the push.

She shouldn't have to go through the harassment she has even if her views aren't appreciated.
I personally think this is a shame, seeing her on TV was a pleasure as I could always mute the sound.

 

[Baldbloke]

Whatever terms are settled upon, no one gets a good deal from Trump and the US negotiators, funded by hundreds of millions of lobbyist dollars, will run rings around ours.

What a ridiculous assumption. If no good ever came with dealing with the USA no country would ever bother entering negotiations. It’s only because of the enormous possibilities that we (like the rest of the world) are willing to see what’s possible.

You seem scared of any change. Perhaps that’s why you’re so negative [emoji848]


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[Deleted member 6183]

A common argument for a 2nd ref is that so many kiddies that would be affected by the result weren't able to vote.
Give the vote to 12 year olds and that reduces that some.
Then allow prisoners to vote as they'll get out one day.
Then all the eu should be eligible.
And why not Russians and Chinese as we'll be trading with them an larger scale after Brexit, and this pretend democracy would be a novelty for 'em.

But put a stop to all politicians voting, as they have demonstrated that the majority don't understand democracy and aren't worthy, and they are plain silly.

Or just keep all the votes for old grunters with a bad attitude.

 

[m80]

Or just keep all the votes for old grunters with a bad attitude.

I'll accept the 2 votes I'm due then,
I fit both of those criteria.

 

[DSM10000]

You be perfectly entitled to. Opposition parties do it all the time whoever is in power.

The point is Remainers have whinged, bitched, complained, wailed, etc, etc, etc ever since the result because they have some inexplicable love affair with the EU and clearly have no interest in retaining any degree of control over their own country in the future and also seem to assume they have some God given right to the result they want and are, therefore, able to ignore a majority verdict

 

[DSM10000]

What a ridiculous assumption. If no good ever came with dealing with the USA no country would ever bother entering negotiations. It’s only because of the enormous possibilities that we (like the rest of the world) are willing to see what’s possible.

You seem scared of any change. Perhaps that’s why you’re so negative [emoji848]


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Has little Scotty been playing with a keyboard again?

 

[Baldbloke]

The point is Remainers have whinged, bitched, complained, wailed, etc, etc, etc ever since the result because they have some inexplicable love affair with the EU and clearly have no interest in retaining any degree of control over their own country in the future and also seem to assume they have some God given right to the result they want and are, therefore, able to ignore a majority verdict

The most relevant posts hurt the most[emoji23]


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