The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[renault12ts]

Very very common among Merc owners....

And, I guess that makes me with my C180 middle-Class then?

More C class I'd say...but I'm CL class.

So you can look up to me and down on an A class...I look down on both of you . (With thanks to Monty Python).

 

[DSM10000]

..I look down on both of you . (With thanks to Monty Python).

Pay attention in Class! it was not Monty Python but The Frost Report with John Cleese, Ronnie Barker and Ronnie Corbett

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[Dryce]

More C class I'd say...but I'm CL class.

So you can look up to me and down on an A class...I look down on both of you . (With thanks to Monty Python).

.... and I know my place.

My recollection is that piece was on TW3 - "That Was The Week That Was "? It would have predated Monty Python.

[Edit: I notice that this has been properly clarified in the preceding post ]

 

[leef44]

As the Labour leadership election rolls on it appears that the "continuity Corbyn" candidate, Rebecca Long Bailey, is out in the lead amongst the membership with Keir Starmer a close second. Personally I don't see any of the candidates as a particularly inspiring choice (with the possible exception of Lisa Nandy), but I suspect that KS would have wider electoral appeal than RLB.

Which raises an interesting point: Is the Labour Party actually interested in being electable and forming a government at some point in the future, or is it more interested in being a "protest" party that objects to everything but never actually takes responsibility for anything?

It would appear so. However, as long as the Unions have a stranglehold on the membership numbers then the members will never represent the wishes of the majority of the labour electorate. So whoever they vote to lead, will represent what the Unions want and not what the voters for Labour want.

It would seem this is a bit of a stale mate until something changes with the membership e.g. the voting public take a more active role in joining as members to dilute the Union membership numbers.

This could take many years before Labour gets itself out of a hole.

 

[Benzowner]

This could take many years before Labour gets itself out of a hole.

IMO the next Labour Prime Minister has not yet been elected to the HoC, they are in a very very deep hole dug in the main by the last leader.

 

[st13phil]

However, as long as the Unions have a stranglehold on the membership numbers then the members will never represent the wishes of the majority of the labour electorate.

I'm not sure that the Union movement has as much hold over the Labour Party as it did, say, 40 years ago. I fancy that the mess that Labour finds itself in is more to do with a bunch of idealist activists who don't have much understanding of life outside their "bubble".

 

[190]

On average the bookies have Keir Starmer on odds of 1/3 with Long Bailey in 2nd at 3/1. I always struggle when the first number is smaller than the second but that seems to me an order of magnitude difference. On the basis that bookies are rarely that wrong, Long Bailey has no chance.

 

[leef44]

I'm not sure that the Union movement has as much hold over the Labour Party as it did, say, 40 years ago. I fancy that the mess that Labour finds itself in is more to do with a bunch of idealist activists who don't have much understanding of life outside their "bubble".

Very much agree. For one aspect is having financial knowledge.

It would be good if all politicians have to go through a financial induction course before they are allowed to take their seat. This would involve explaining how a country's economics works and the impact of various political decisons have had in the past and how such decisions can impact for the future.

For example, an understanding of how quantitive easing impacts in the near future (next few years) and long term (the next generation), why it is important to keep control of the deficit and national debt.

Maybe I'm being naive and in fact they do have such knowledge but choose to ignore it.

 

[st13phil]

Another fascinating piece, this time by John Gray in the New Statesman: Why the left keeps losing

 

[Benzowner]

I'm not sure that the Union movement has as much hold over the Labour Party as it did, say, 40 years ago. I fancy that the mess that Labour finds itself in is more to do with a bunch of idealist activists who don't have much understanding of life outside their "bubble".

Very much agree. For one aspect is having financial knowledge.

It would be good if all politicians have to go through a financial induction course before they are allowed to take their seat. This would involve explaining how a country's economics works and the impact of various political decisons have had in the past and how such decisions can impact for the future.

For example, an understanding of how quantitive easing impacts in the near future (next few years) and long term (the next generation), why it is important to keep control of the deficit and national debt.

Maybe I'm being naive and in fact they do have such knowledge but choose to ignore it.

Except it was the Unions, who, not too long ago, selected the wrong Miliband IMO

 

[Alfie]

Its true the unions don't have as much sway with the Labour party as they once did (basically labour couldnt govern without their say so) but the control has now been passed to Jon Lansman and his momentum thugs.

 

[m80]

I'm not sure anything with Labour is relevant to much at all tbh.
They have no chance of being a challenge to the Tories for 5 years, the worst they can do is be an irritating buzzing in and out of Westminster. They willstillappear on QT and on he news now and again telling us the Tories have done wrong and they wouldn't have, but so what? It will just be as boring as before.

In truth I'm not following the Leadership crawl much, but haven't heard anything from the wannabees that would give me confidence that they have learnt from the recent disaster.

Labourites will still hate Tories, but apparently in less numbers than used to be.
Tory types will still watch Labour with amusement, apparently with more valid reasons than used to be.

I'm more interested to see how BJ is going to try and bring more Scots and Welsh away from their possible independance desires. The Welsh don't have a seriously dangerous movement anyway, so leaving Sturgeon shouting in the Scottish wilderness would be the strategy I would expect.
She can shout Freedom, but if few people are listening she becomes a Farage.

 

[st13phil]

I'm more interested to see how BJ is going to try and bring more Scots and Welsh away from their possible independance desires. The Welsh don't have a seriously dangerous movement anyway, so leaving Sturgeon shouting in the Scottish wilderness would be the strategy I would expect.
She can shout Freedom, but if few people are listening she becomes a Farage.

At the risk of creating another 5 pages of posts about Scottish independence, my gut feel is that after 31st January the practicalities of it happening become significantly more difficult, so we're in for another few years of Sturgeon / Blackford / et al being noisy about it, but perversely the Union will be less likely to break up than it would have been had the UK remained in the EU.

In that sense, BJ doesn't have to do much, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be wise to do something to court the Unionists in Scotland in particular, whose voice is currently being drowned out by a noisy SNP. We've already seen the first shots fired in that one, IMO, with the public statements from Gove (amongst others) drawing attention to the less than stellar performance of the devolved Scottish government in terms of "getting on with their day job".

 

[Swotty]

I rather suspect that the fall out from Salmond's imminent court case will shed some light on the SNP's and Wee Krankie's poor, if not actionable, handling of the accusations.

Not long to go now.

 

[Bellow]

I rather suspect that the fall out from Salmond's imminent court case will shed some light on the SNP's and Wee Krankie's poor, if not actionable, handling of the accusations.

Not long to go now.

You bang on about this as if it actually matters politically. It doesn't. Salmond is far removed from Scottish politics and this is a personal matter concerning him and his accusers which will duly be resolved in a court of law.

 

[DSM10000]

You bang on about this as if it actually matters politically. It doesn't. Salmond is far removed from Scottish politics and this is a personal matter concerning him and his accusers which will duly be resolved in a court of law.

It will have significant political repercussions if it is found that Sturgeon et al were complicit in trying to cover up any aspects of evidence etc prior to the investigation and charges being laid. I am not suggesting this happened but it has been alleged and may still have substance, it may not of course and for politics as a whole I hope this is the case.

 

[Dryce]

You bang on about this as if it actually matters politically. It doesn't. Salmond is far removed from Scottish politics and this is a personal matter concerning him and his accusers which will duly be resolved in a court of law.

As @DSM10000 says - it may well have fallout if there has been any coverup.

Scotland is a difficult place to measure on this sort of thing because it's become the norm north of the border to keep things hidden from the public.

 

[Nicebutdim]

Good to see Donald Trump challenging the climate nutters/activists.

He called them doomsayers and foolish fortune tellers. Nice to see somebody standing up for common sense.

 

[m80]

I hope some one buys Greta a burger or two,
she would look better for a Big Mack, but some one else would have to carry it.

 

[Nicebutdim]

I hope some one buys Greta a burger or two,
she would look better for a Big Mack, but some one else would have to carry it.

I’m tempted to say send her back to school but I suspect that is where she was indoctrinated in all this rubbish. She’s just a puppet for her beardy wierdy parents and the climate movement.