The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[markjay]

I hear what you say Mark but in times of war, the War Cabinet sits and their decisions are final.

A very good point. The media didn't grill Churchill over the decision to send the BEF to Dunkirk, or over the surrender of Malaya, Hong-Kong, and Singapore, etc, and there were no anti-surrender demonstrations or conspiracy theories either. Would a Corona Cabinet work in the same way?

As can be seen on this thread, folks cannot make a decision whether to use soft toilet paper or softer toilet paper.

Ah.... this merits a separate thread...

Have a small, elected group of politicians with invited experts always on hand to simply advise on their relevant expertise and then have this small group of politicians make decisions that are final and would be implemented.

Should the media be allowed to continually attempt to undermine decisions that are made by our elected government? Letting mayors appear on TV crying their eyes out and demanding more support for that city, or should that be 'more votes for the mayor' The media is there to give balanced reporting. How much air time do they give the mayor of Manchester and straight after that person has had their say, how much time do they give to those that make the decisions? Fair and balanced reporting my hemorrhoids!!!

The media used to act in a fair and balanced nature but does it? does it really?

I think the media has the right to be biased (apart for the publicly-funded BBC), as long as they make a clear distinction between editorials and news, which sadly they don't always do.

 

[Swotty]

Swotty I note your criticism but the lack of any type of suggestions on how to rectify this.

My thoughts are that during the two World Wars we did not have any type of local or national elections and this panademic is causing this country huge issues, issues beyond my very own limited imagination. If we had postal votes then that would be open to so much abuse and by that I mean how many multi-occupied properties are there and what's to stop one person from accessing these postal votes and that is just one example of abuse. No doubt other more learned than little olde me will come up with even more reasons.

At the moment does the government suffer from too many chiefs and not enough red indians?

Socially distancing etc measures could have been effected. Elections were one of my ares of responsibility back in the day (when sharp pencils were de rigeur! )

I could have said postal or remote voting, but that is so open to fraud ...... be interesting to see if that's the direction in which we are headed, though. I suspect it is.

 

[glojo]

sadly Mark we are all guilty as taking as fact what we see and hear on our televisions. I always used top be a news addict. laying in bed all day I have nothing better to do but whilst I am still that same addict, I tend to watch Al Jazeera as I am sick of the biased drival that we are forced to watch on our British news and I strongly disagee with you about the media having the right to be bias. I cannot scream loud enough that we need balanced, fair reporting that offers both sides to any argument.

 

[markjay]

Socially distancing etc measures could have been effected. Elections were one of my ares of responsibility back in the day (when sharp pencils were de rigeur! )

I could have said postal or remote voting, but that is so open to fraud ...... be interesting to see if that's the direction in which we are headed, though. I suspect it is.

I think that it's inevitable that we'll move to online voting at some future point of time, though managing the risk from fraud and from hacking by foreign powers will be a massive task.

 

[markjay]

...I tend to watch Al Jazeera ...

Same here

(And I have no Qatari roots).

 

[Benzowner]

A very good point. The media didn't grill Churchill over the decision to send the BEF to Dunkirk, or over the surrender of Malaya, Hong-Kong, and Singapore, etc, and there were no anti-surrender demonstrations or conspiracy theories either. Would a Corona Cabinet work in the same way?

It was Neville Chamberlain who sent the BEF to France, Churchill brought them back via Dunkirk. Chamberlain resigned in 1940 when Churchill took over.

 

[flowrider]

It surprises me that some people will give more credence to something they read on social media over official government statements. Not that I believe everything the government says.

 

[Swotty]

It surprises me that some people will give more credence to something they read on social media over official government statements. Not that I believe everything the government says.

I rely on forum experts.

 

[Harrythedog]

I rely on forum experts.

You have to when the pubs are shut

 

[glojo]

It surprises me that some people will give more credence to something they read on social media over official government statements. Not that I believe everything the government says.

I don't see why we should be alarmed purely because the average votes cast for a general election is usually far lower than votes that get cast for the likes of X factor! I sure that if the judges of X-factor all said the World was flat, they would convince a number of their audience that this is correct!!

 

[Deleted member 65149]

I don't see why we should be alarmed purely because the average votes cast for a general election is usually far lower than votes that get cast for the likes of X factor! I sure that if the judges of X-factor all said the World was flat, they would convince a number of their audience that this is correct!!

I hope you’re not implying that it‘s not flat

 

[markjay]

It was Neville Chamberlain who sent the BEF to France, Churchill brought them back via Dunkirk. Chamberlain resigned in 1940 when Churchill took over.

Thank you, I stand corrected!

 

[Nat]

Thanks for some of the messages asking me to come back for my "opinion"

Well not much has happened - apart from some more deadlines. The EU have made European Parliament totally irrelevant with the EU stating that they can bypass them. - Who'd of thought it.

Fishies? Oh well. Here is a new one if it's not already been done on here. The EU have done the CAT quota - it doesn't look good for the EU by their own admission. Some quotas down to a big fat zero. Although the EU would still like us to giveaway the same quota (80%)The EU would like the CV budget to slightly different to the UK's where as the EU spending won't count to the UK's on the LPF- LPF? MY ****.

Barnier should still be off on Jan 9th - unless they want that rolled over to. Tick tock MB. EU rules they retire at 70.

Best deal is that the UK goes WTO and provisions to WTO 24 with the EU are on track. At least that way no side will be looked at been the side to give in.

 

[markjay]

...Best deal is that the UK goes WTO and provisions to WTO 24 with the EU are on track. At least that way no side will be looked at been the side to give in.

This might be true... but if this happens, then 70m Britons will wonder why we took 4 years and also replaced the government in the process, just to get to where we could have been on day One?

Yes, we had to try and all that, but for the politicians who want to be re-elected, WTO rules will be a tough sell to the British voters, and one which all of the government's opponents will happily exploit come next elections.

So... Will Boris sign a last-minute deal in order to have his triumphant photo-op shaking hands (or elbows) with 'defeated' Barnier?

 

[glojo]

This might be true... but if this happens, then 70m Britons will wonder why we took 4 years and also replaced the government in the process, just to get to where we could have been on day One?

Yes, we had to try and all that, but for the politicians who want to be re-elected, WTO rules will be a tough sell to the British voters, and one which all of the government's opponents will happily exploit come next elections.

So... Will Boris sign a last-minute deal in order to have his triumphant photo-op shaking hands (or elbows) with 'defeated' Barnier?

Does the great British public know what the WTO means? Do they even care?

We have been told the motorway approaches to Dover will be blocked with trucks. Not long to find out.

 

[Swotty]

Does the great British public know what the WTO means? Do they even care?

We have been told the motorway approaches to Dover will be blocked with trucks. Not long to find out.

Yes we have, whether or not a deal is agreed.

Normally the French would strew fish across the roads, so guess it'll have to be tyres now.

 

[Nat]

This might be true... but if this happens, then 70m Britons will wonder why we took 4 years and also replaced the government in the process, just to get to where we could have been on day One?

Yes, we had to try and all that, but for the politicians who want to be re-elected, WTO rules will be a tough sell to the British voters, and one which all of the government's opponents will happily exploit come next elections.

So... Will Boris sign a last-minute deal in order to have his triumphant photo-op shaking hands (or elbows) with 'defeated' Barnier?

In bold? Don't be silly. You know better than that silly statement.

Will Boris sign it? Will Parliament let him sign it?

Unless the EU drop the silly demands then the UK will be on WTO within a couple of weeks. Maybe after that then some kind of sense will happen, but to bow down to EU rules is simply stupid.

 

[markjay]

In bold? Don't be silly. You know better than that silly statement.

Will Boris sign it? Will Parliament let him sign it?

Unless the EU drop the silly demands then the UK will be on WTO within a couple of weeks. Maybe after that then some kind of sense will happen, but to bow down to EU rules is simply stupid.

I was referring primarily to the role of internal political considerations in the decision making process, rather than to the merit (or lack of) of any particular outcome.

 

[Nat]

Considerations mean what to the outcome? If you look at at CAT on fishies for 21 - it means nothing. If you mean on the LPF that means nothing either too.

The EU don't hold any Aces, just more members. Fiscal means what to them? Ask Italy, Greece. Where will the newly acquired debt be paid to? If you can answer that then you are a good man as even the EU don't know.

 

[SW18]

Sorry for side-tracking the Brexit discussion with something COVID-related, but this was too good not to share and it’s too political to put on any other thread:

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